Usapa has to go.

[eaglesview]

ALPA wants nothing to do with Airways.

That's a joke. My union (ALPA) forgave all the CO scabs, who flew EAL routes while I was on strike, and all the EAL scabs that CO was happy to hire just to collect the dues. ALPA has no morals.

 

[Ocity]

ALPA has no morals.

USAPA, at it's very core, is nothing but pure evil. The diabolical scabs that voted for it will forever deserve whatever misery they foisted upon themselves. Forget mercy Uscabians, That ship has forever sailed.

 

[Carl S.]

Time for East pilots to show some leadership. If you want off LOA 93, the ball is in your court! The West is going along for the ride, so I love when they bitch about LOA 93, yet do nothing but chase their tails about it. Could not happen to a better group of people, you reap what you sow.

 

[waveflyer]

[.

It's always easier to tell someone else what to do when you're not in their shoes. Funny how quick they change their tune when something affects them personally.ALPA will never see light of day here again, Teamsters who knows but ALPO is history here.

Don't pretend you're the only airline who's had to deal w/ a crappy merger/post 9/11 situation-

The argument is you'd be better off-
Yes- clearly- you need someone who isn't "in it" to tell you how wrong this stand is-

 

[ALGFLYR]

Whoever from USAPA or outside counsel is giving that advice needs to be drawn and quartered. No one will take on the liability of not using an SLI from an already previously agreed upon binding process. The potential for litigation is to great to ignore.

.....

Well IF LCC and AMR were to merge, and that's still highly speculative whether that will happen or not... Which seniority lists could be used for the integration? Let's look at that....

At this very moment, is the NIC award an official seniority list? No. That is a fact. The only official seniority lists at US Airways are the separate East and West lists, and the new hires (3rd listers). American's seniority list is uncontested, as is the 3rd list at Airways. So those two lists are good to go...

So the only question is what would be used for the East and West pilots...

Could an unofficial list (the Nic) be used? The only way the Nic list could ever become an official list is if it were ratified into a contract between USAPA and Airways management.... If a merger occurred and a new contract were negotiated between all the pilots and Airways/American management... The conditions that are required to solidify the Nic list could never be realized, thus the Nic could never become an official list... Just sayin...

 

[reepicheep]

And thus you have the next USAPA multi-million dollar wild goose chase. And who knows.....considering the (potential) parties involved...it could happen.

 

[flygirlqt]

Could an unofficial list (the Nic) be used? The only way the Nic list could ever become an official list is if it were ratified into a contract between USAPA and Airways management.... If a merger occurred and a new contract were negotiated between all the pilots and Airways/American management... The conditions that are required to solidify the Nic list could never be realized, thus the Nic could never become an official list... Just sayin...

As an attorney, I disagree with your premise.

 

[Crzipilot]

And how long have you been an attorney???? Or are you just back in school for such.

 

[ALGFLYR]

As an attorney, I disagree with your premise.

Well thank you... That really means a lot to me...

So as an attorney, you would advise a client to use and unofficial seniority list for a merger??

 

[waveflyer]

As an attorney, I disagree with your premise.

As the boyfriend of an attorney, we agree with your disagreement.

ALG- that's seriously bat-sh/t crazy.

How many BMWs have the east bought their attorneys? Hell, how many homes?
Somebody is continually selling a dream the east emotionally wants to believe.
Adds to how dumb this is(!)

 

[BILL LUMBERG]

Boyfriend of an attorney Wave?

Wow.....What's his name?

 

[flygirlqt]

Well thank you... That really means a lot to me...

So as an attorney, you would advise a client to use and unofficial seniority list for a merger??

I would advise my client, especially at this stage of the game, that the list agreed to by both parties in binding arbitration is going to stand. Your hypothesis above and merely labeling it "unofficial" because you do not like the results does not change the legal exposure and minefield for anyone to accept anything but a previously agreed upon binding arbitration.

You have spent an awful lot of money and thereby made certain lawyers very wealthy that are telling you what you want to hear rather than what you need to listen to.

And how long have you been an attorney???? Or are you just back in school for such.

Just passed the bar, Georgetown Alumni.

 

[flygirlqt]

Somebody is continually selling a dream the east emotionally wants to believe.

That is how I view it as well.

 

[waveflyer]

Boyfriend of an attorney Wave?

Wow.....What's his name?

Really?
Did you know they let women be attorneys these days? They can go to court and everything- crazy, huh- I like my women smarter than me- keeps me learning and challenged- is a good thing-
As for the gay quip- that's not an insult to me at all- just happens to not be accurate in my case- but far from an insult caveman bill.

Nice drift though- what do you think of usapa's stand at BK wages? You're at delta- they're dragging you down too- what do you think?

 

[waveflyer]

Congrats flygirlqt- that's a big deal

 

[flygirlqt]

Congrats flygirlqt- that's a big deal

Thank you very much.

 

[BeCareful!]

My American friends are really hoping it's the Nic, because they think it would be really cool to fly with some young Captains who are hip and like to party. I told them "dude, those young guys with Super Seniority will be in your way for the rest of your career!" But they all say "dude...." And I go "dude...." And then we head for the bar.

 

[Crzipilot]

I would advise my client, especially at this stage of the game, that the list agreed to by both parties in binding arbitration is going to stand. Your hypothesis above and merely labeling it "unofficial" because you do not like the results does not change the legal exposure and minefield for anyone to accept anything but a previously agreed upon binding arbitration.

You have spent an awful lot of money and thereby made certain lawyers very wealthy that are telling you what you want to hear rather than what you need to listen to.



Just passed the bar, Georgetown Alumni.

Well first, I would imagine an schooling as an attorney would have taught you to keep your mouth shut unless you know all the facts (or have a reasonable knowledge the the predominate facts) of a case. The previously agreed upon binding arbitration was an internal process to determine a bargaining position of a contract. That party is no longer alive on property. Show me where the courts have hand tied parties on how they can bargain?

Second, what he was actually alluding to, was the MDA lawsuit, in which US has already confirmed those formerly MDA pilots were actually recalled US pilots. That little fact, results in ALPA agreeing to an illegal call back, and should have had about 500 more pilots listed as active and not furloughed. This alone would have changed the dynamics of this so called list NIC generated.


Hmmm....Last time I thought I saw you, you were with republic out of SDF, still waiting on daddy to use his contacts to get you in at UPS, because you were going to be a UPS capt before 30.......where do you fit it all in?

 

[Golden Falcon]

And the morale of the story is......they should have let USAir sink, and eat the pickings...

 

[Metrojet]

Oly;
I would ask the following questions:

1. How soon do you want a contract?
2. How much longer do you want to work under LOA 93?
3. How willing are you to get involved?

While voting out USAPA because it has been a dismal failure in its present form, the fact remains that WE could change the fabric and leadership of USAPA with enough votes in the next couple months. If we can accomplish that, we can move to change the CBL's and reconstruct the key committees (NAC, Merger, Communication, Grievance, etc) so as to return to the business of a new contract and a potential merger.


All of this can be done in less than 6 months. A card drive will last at least that long. Once a new CBA is voted in, it would take at least a year to reconstruct the hierarchy (ALPA for instance) and get back to the negotiating table. Waiting for ALPA to return and a new contract through ALPA would be a 1.5 to 3 year wait. That is TOO LONG!



While we await a new CBL drive, how about getting on board with changing USAPA into a TRUE INDEPENDENT UNION? Are you a MIG? That is the first step. Go to: www.reformusapa.com and complete the three petitions that help to change the CBA's constitution & bylaws.


Respectfully,
CB

Eric , er I mean CB

Why do you even care about LOA 93 - it is not the contract you operate under!
Lets be truthful here - you just want the Nic so you can take advantage of the attrition coming to the East pilots.

Although I am disappointed with many issues on the East - we are capturing our attrition quite fairly right now, and we don't plan on giving that up.

You should just be happy that your on a "better contract". If you really wanted to move forward with the East - why is their no discussions anymore about conditions and restrictions that we BOTH could live with. (for example - if a west pilot wants to bid East - he has to use DOH - if a East guys wants to bid West - he has to use Nic, and if we can get the company to agree to a minimum fleet and block hours for both East and West - do you think that could work?

If/when the judge rules in the latest court battle - either way - the courts cannot take away mine or YOUR right to vote for a CB.

I know we both agree we are ready to get a better contract for both - but at what cost?

Respectfully,
Metrojet