SWA Int'l Ops

[fr8doggie]

A Question:

Assuming both pilot groups approve the AIP2, when will pilots operating under the SWAPA contract begin flying the international operations that AirTran currently flies?

The reason that I ask is I'm curious if the current SWAPA contract has an international override provision? Airtan pays $4/hr override.

Other airline guys: Please chime in with your int'l override (if any).

 

[SKC]

I believe it will be before the 717s make their way to the canyon blue side, which would make it sometime in 2013.

 

[thruthemurk]

Jetblue came up with a great international overide.
Then they promptly declared nearly all international destinations "not international".
I believe 2 airports still pay international.

Very Bluethy.

 

[herewego again]

We will be trained and capable of Intl Ops in 2012. Not too sure when we'll be used for such, but probably late that same year, or next. No provisions in our CBA 'yet'.

 

[mt2]

We will be trained and capable of Intl Ops in 2012. Not too sure when we'll be used for such, but probably late that same year, or next. No provisions in our CBA 'yet'.

You mean we'll have a class on how to decipher bad english ? That's the real secret to international ops...

 

[bluesideup1]

You mean we'll have a class on how to decipher bad english ? That's the real secret to international ops...

At least we don't have to figure out what the hell they mean by line up and wait anymore.

 

[Ky.BrownBourbn]

A Question:

Assuming both pilot groups approve the AIP2, when will pilots operating under the SWAPA contract begin flying the international operations that AirTran currently flies?

The reason that I ask is I'm curious if the current SWAPA contract has an international override provision? Airtan pays $4/hr override.

Other airline guys: Please chime in with your int'l override (if any).

I think a better question would be, if it is passed by both sides, When is ALPA out the window? Then everyone is a SWAPA pilot on SWAPA's MSL (Master seniority List)! Which means that SWAPA pilot's would be doing the flying (whether it be a Blue plane or a green one)! You guys gotta stop thinking US AND THEM! All this will need to be opened up for negotiation with the company.

BTW, and $4.00 override...BFD, consider most of those places "Dollars" are worth more than ours, they probably don't even want our Dollars anymore! ANyone ever take the time to check out what the IRS allows for per diem in these countries? Override should be a minimum of $50.00!

KBB

 

[Fox-Tree]

BTW, and $4.00 override...BFD, consider most of those places "Dollars" are worth more than ours, they probably don't even want our Dollars anymore! ANyone ever take the time to check out what the IRS allows for per diem in these countries? Override should be a minimum of $50.00!

KBB

$50/hour override seems a little steep.

Most airlines that fly international have an international per diem (it helps but usually won't get close to the IRS rates). The override (usually paid per flight hour) is generally used to account for the additional work involved with flying internationally. $4/hour seems about right for Mexico or the Caribbean.

 

[Ty Webb]

$50/hour override seems a little steep.

Most airlines that fly international have an international per diem (it helps but usually won't get close to the IRS rates). The override (usually paid per flight hour) is generally used to account for the additional work involved with flying internationally. $4/hour seems about right for Mexico or the Caribbean.

A per diem override should apply to the time away from base TAFB or some other applicable metric; do you get a per diem override in addition to international flight pay override?

Per diem is mostly non-taxable . . . plus it usually applies to more hours. If you fly 8 hours, but layover 24, the override would apply to the time you are out of the country & buying meals.

 

[Fox-Tree]

A per diem override should apply to the time away from base TAFB or some other applicable metric, not per flight hour.

Per diem is mostly non-taxable, plus if you fly 8 hours, but layover 24, the override should apply tot he time you are in the country buying meals.

I know how per diem works, but thanks for the refresher . I've never heard of a "per diem override". I can't even find a carrier that uses one by looking at APC's profiles.

An international override has nothing to do with per diem. As I said, most carriers that fly internationally have an override to their hourly flight pay when they operate internationally. At Fedex it is $7/hour for FOs. Every trip I operate that flies even one leg outside the 48 contiguous, I get paid an extra $7 for each credit hour for the entire trip.

Every airline I've worked for has a domestic and international per diem rate. No override required. If you operate internationally, you get the international per diem rate for the whole trip TAFB.

Using an "override" for per diem on international trips would be a big mistake from the pilot's perspective. With that, now management has the option to cherry pick when they pay it from layover to layover when you have a mix of international and domestic layovers on the same trip.

 

[OurMoney1]

INT'L OPS CLIFF NOTES

1. No Speak'a

2. No See'a

3. No Care'a

 

[Ky.BrownBourbn]

$50/hour override seems a little steep.

Most airlines that fly international have an international per diem (it helps but usually won't get close to the IRS rates). The override (usually paid per flight hour) is generally used to account for the additional work involved with flying internationally. $4/hour seems about right for Mexico or the Caribbean.

I was referring to the one time Override we use to get at the regional whenever we where out of country...Not $50 per hour!

I'll let you big ALPA carriers figure this one out...
I Don't fly international, Don't ever care to again, But I do fly to LBB and stay in a Holiday Inn Express (Chime in "LA Genatalia" in 3...2...1...

Anytime the following Keywords pop up: LBB, Lubbock, ELP, or EL Paso, she gets an Insant message that she insist on responding to here on FI!)

KBB

 

[fr8doggie]

I'll let you big ALPA carriers figure this one out...
I Don't fly international, Don't ever care to again, But I do fly to LBB and stay in a Holiday Inn Express (Chime in "LA Genatalia" in 3...2...1...
KBB

I was trying to keep it serious and civil...

You may let the "Big ALPA carriers" figure it out but from what I read on this forum you guys are pretty much going to own the world in about ten years. So, you (meaning SWA pilots in general) might want to start thinking about override and perdiem, etc.

I'm sure that you have no interest in flying a 787 ATL-LHW with a nice 24-48hr layover. But there might be one or two SWA guys who would like it. Or maybe you could just shove that int'l over water onto the AirTran side.

Is it possible to have any kind of conversation with you guys without bringing up ALPA? Come on... I think Dan Roman (whistle me a tune, Dan!) is right. It's SWAPA rules ALPA sucks with you guys.

I always liked those LBB layovers. We used to stay at the "Next to Denny's" with you guys. Of course, that was before the internets was invented so we were friendly and polite with each other.

 

[Ty Webb]

I know how per diem works, but thanks for the refresher . I've never heard of a "per diem override". I can't even find a carrier that uses one by looking at APC's profiles.

Every airline I've worked for has a domestic and international per diem rate. No override required. If you operate internationally, you get the international per diem rate for the whole trip TAFB.

Easy there, Chief, I didn't say you don't understand per diem. Just a little confused, because you were using the terms international per diem and hourly pay somewhat interchangeably. Apparently, that's how it's covered by your company, since it applies to the whole trip.

At AirTran, however, we only receive an hourly flight pay override [sic]for international segments, and also an increased per diem rate for the international portion of the TAFB.

So, in our case, they are both only overrides, because it only applies to international segments. Once you block in to a US airport, you're back on standard hourly rates and per diem.

 

[Sluggo_63]

I'm sure that you have no interest in flying a 787 ATL-LHW with a nice 24-48hr layover. But there might be one or two SWA guys who would like it.

I don't know anybody who would want a 24-48 hour LHW layover. Maybe if you told me I was going to LHR, I might be more apt to take that trip.

 

[fr8doggie]

If you can't have fun in Lanzhou I don't know where you can!

 

[Taco Rocket]

SWA will fly the 787 internationally, initially to 50 cities, expanding to 300 by year's end. Captain rates will be $567/hr with F/Os to come from Mesa at their rates.

 

[scoreboardII]

Just heard we are getting 35 -800's instead of 25 in 2012. Yes, I know HI is not international, even less so than ELP.

 

[Ky.BrownBourbn]

I was trying to keep it serious and civil...

You may let the "Big ALPA carriers" figure it out but from what I read on this forum you guys are pretty much going to own the world in about ten years. So, you (meaning SWA pilots in general) might want to start thinking about override and perdiem, etc.

I'm sure that you have no interest in flying a 787 ATL-LHW with a nice 24-48hr layover. But there might be one or two SWA guys who would like it. Or maybe you could just shove that int'l over water onto the AirTran side.

Is it possible to have any kind of conversation with you guys without bringing up ALPA? Come on... I think Dan Roman (whistle me a tune, Dan!) is right. It's SWAPA rules ALPA sucks with you guys.

I always liked those LBB layovers. We used to stay at the "Next to Denny's" with you guys. Of course, that was before the internets was invented so we were friendly and polite with each other.

It wasn't a personal attack, don't take it as such! Being previous ALPA...ALPA sucks! Period, I never experienced them from a "mainline" perspective, on the regional side, they didn't care about anything but our money! It doesn't work to represent both sides (mainline and Regional) but we can save that argument for a different thread!

I have no desire for a 24-48 hour overnight, my time is worth more than $2.00 per hour plus whatever override ALPA or SWAPA negotiates, when I'm away from home, I want to work, that's how we get paid, I do 3 days that pay 24 or 25 and 4 days that pay 32-34. I have friends that fly Intl elsewhere that there trips pay nowhere close to that...it is what it is! When I'm at work, I want to get paid!

I'll be happy for SWAPA pilots to fly tons of Intl on a gazillion 787's or whatever airplane SWA flies, it means more profit sharing for me! And if I get stuck flying those long legs, I hope they have better seats up front than the 73!

As far as being serious and civil, it's flight info, nobody cares about being serious and civil...and for what it's worth, I still try to speak to everyone in uniform (or with an ID).

Later,
KBB

 

[Ky.BrownBourbn]

Just heard we are getting 35 -800's instead of 25 in 2012. Yes, I know HI is not international, even less so than ELP.

If I recall, the assembly line was at capacity...sounds like their are a few less deliveries coming elsewhere!

KBB