Southwest evaluates -800's

[Chest Rockwell]

You are WAY off on your numbers, probably because you are spinning from all of the legs you do each trip.

When did being the least bit accurate with numbers matter to you? Ha!

Obviously, all those legs out of MDW on the "Connection" were more than you could handle.

 

[Moon-dog]

He is a ********************ing idiot, ignore him and maybe he will go back to living in the SST with his blue water friends.

 

[General Lee]

Hey Gen! How long have you been in the airline industry? Back in the Fractional world some of your ex check airman stated it was your pilot group that started this mess and gave the jets to ComAir. Some Of the old UA guy's said the same. It's old men like you that continue to sell the younger generation down the drain. It will catch up to you when you see Republic take your international flying at half the cost. Karma baby! LOL!

You should put your app in now.

Wow, smoke dope, much???? The checkairman that went to your fractional were the ones who voted that away, not the newbies who started after the 96 contract. (big hiring was AFTER that) The only other scope erosion was due to a BK judge who allowed the 70 seaters to become 76 seaters. I guess the frac guys never saw that part.....And, current scope is tightening, with pilots now who are ready to keep tightening the screws. At the same time, 50 seaters are leaving quick, and some mainline planes are taking over certain ex RJ routes.

But hey, keep dreaming about Republic taking over the world. IF that is your world, you need to take another hit of that bong! Go Dude, go!


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[General Lee]

When did being the least bit accurate with numbers matter to you? Ha!

Obviously, all those legs out of MDW on the "Connection" were more than you could handle.

No, I just decided that multiple leg stuff wasn't fun anymore, and I have transitioned to something so much better. Too bad you don't really have a choice. That is how your airline operates, and so will you, for years and years to come. Sorry about that. Try to enjoy TUL and ELP if you can.


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[The Prussian]

I remember flying at the "commuters" and I was dead tired after a 6 or 7 leg day out of MDW way back when. I bet you just roll your eyes everytime you look at your trip pairings. I look at mine and see ONE leg for the day, and going somewhere fun. I know you wish you could. You probably like going to SAN, but it takes 4 legs to get there, and then you are too tired, and have to get up for another AM trip early the next morning, for 4 more legs to BHM. Yippee. Enjoy that pal, for 20 more years.
Bye Bye--General Lee

Sounds to me that that you made your decision back when,...and are still questioning it in your mind. NO PROBLEM...you made your decision, and we made our decision. We're happy with our decision, and even more happy with yours...FANTASTIC!!!! (Oh golly,...I'm starting to sound like "him"...(!!?!))

 

[BILL LUMBERG]

It will catch up to you when you see Republic take your international flying at half the cost. Karma baby! LOL!

You should put your app in now.

Hey Texman....

Maybe you should heed your own advice....Hell, a Republic guy has more time with autothrottles and VNAV than you could muster......I think they are better qualified for 5 legs a day than you are.....

SWA=easily replaced....

DAL International..... mmmmnotsomuch (not believing my hype, just stating who's easier to replace....ask the Fine Midwest folks who got shafted)

Flame on haters!!! :uzi:

 

[General Lee]

Sounds to me that that you made your decision back when,...and are still questioning it in your mind. NO PROBLEM...you made your decision, and we made our decision. We're happy with our decision, and even more happy with yours...FANTASTIC!!!! (Oh golly,...I'm starting to sound like "him"...(!!?!))

Yeah, you made your decisions, and now will have to live with it. You ONLY have domestic high time trips. What does that mean? That means very productive trips, or in other words LOTS OF LEGS. No thanks for me. I can do that type if I want though, since my airline has a variety of options---domestic flying, INTL flying, a mix of both. The trips have variety too---1 day turns, 2 day trips, 3 day, up to 12 day trips worth 86 hours. Variety, something you lack.


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[BILL LUMBERG]

Hold the phone General.....

If you like the domestic crap.....keep it to yourself.....the ER is going to hell pretty quickly as far as schedules go....

 

[General Lee]

Hold the phone General.....

If you like the domestic crap.....keep it to yourself.....the ER is going to hell pretty quickly as far as schedules go....

Yeah, I know. Being in the ER category doesn't necessarily mean you will only fly INTL trips like the past. But, if you are senior enough, you do fly mostly INTL if you want. I do like Caribbean turns, and ANC, so that part of domestic I like. I don't really care for TPA or MCO turns, though. (unless they are GREEN)


Bye Bye---General Lee

 

[texman]

Wow, smoke dope, much???? The checkairman that went to your fractional were the ones who voted that away, not the newbies who started after the 96 contract. (big hiring was AFTER that) The only other scope erosion was due to a BK judge who allowed the 70 seaters to become 76 seaters. I guess the frac guys never saw that part.....And, current scope is tightening, with pilots now who are ready to keep tightening the screws. At the same time, 50 seaters are leaving quick, and some mainline planes are taking over certain ex RJ routes.

But hey, keep dreaming about Republic taking over the world. IF that is your world, you need to take another hit of that bong! Go Dude, go!


Bye Bye--General Lee

I think you have two personalities. You seem to be all about the RJ's during this thread.

So how do you know about a bong Gen nuts? Did you smoke a little too much last night flying your Flight Sim at home. Are you going to retire soon? If so we can start a Gen Nuts count down on FI.

Now don't be sad when AirTran runs you out of ATL. You might have to give up more scope. LOL!

 

[redflyer65]

And 750 RJs?



Bye Bye--General Lee

Hey General, you are just too easy buddy. Try this...

Compass.....36
Mesaba.......88
Pinnacle.....140
Comair.......120
ASA...........159

These total 543 without Skywest, Shuttle America and Mesa.

Its easily over 750 airframes (probably pushing 1000 if I had the exact numbers). What a joke. That's almost 300 aircraft more than Southwest even owns...

When I say enjoy your RJ's, you could pick one of a thousand!! Delta ALPA opened the door years ago, and YOUR management drove 1000 semi's right through the middle. You can go on and on about we parked this or that, but you will never recover the numbers you gave away.

How many pilots are not employeed by Delta because of this?

How many cities pairs lost?

How many airframes lost? Get the picture yet?

My last four day trip had two legs each day, so even your 4-5 legs a day rings hollow. Even on the rare occasion I do 4 legs a day, I know we are feeding our own operation....not farming it out like you do. Plus I get 105/hr after two years to do it. Enjoy all those RJ's buddy. I'll take the money to the bank and keep flying Southwest passengers....

well for... Southwest!

 

[satpak77]

BOYS ! Settle Down. Nobody gives a rats azz about anything besides size of paycheck and job security. "Equipment" maybe, ok, brand new 737's should satisfy that.

Anything else just isn't important.

SWA leads in the above two areas by the way...

 

[General Lee]

I think you have two personalities. You seem to be all about the RJ's during this thread.

So how do you know about a bong Gen nuts? Did you smoke a little too much last night flying your Flight Sim at home. Are you going to retire soon? If so we can start a Gen Nuts count down on FI.

Now don't be sad when AirTran runs you out of ATL. You might have to give up more scope. LOL!

All about RJs? No way. I agree that SOME destinations cannot handle a mainline plane profitably, so something smaller needs to fill that gap. If an RJ goes up against an Airtran 717 or a SWA 737, then that isn't smart. But, competing against another RJ or going to a small city with NO competition? Then that may work. Delta is a hub and spoke airline mostly, so DL does need passenger feed at the hubs. Would it be great if a route that could handle a mainline aircraft but currently has RJs flying it was replaced by those mainline planes? You bet. Are there some more cities that should be considered? Probably, mostly in Montana I think.

And did you say Airtran will run DL out of ATL? DL has 70% of the traffic at the World's busiest airport. I just don't think so. Airtran has actually pulled some planes out of ATL and put them into MKE to fight you guys and Frontier, so I don't really see them adding many back to ATL anytime soon. Good try, and enjoy AMA.


Bye Bye---General Lee

 

[redflyer65]

Hey Texman....

Maybe you should heed your own advice....Hell, a Republic guy has more time with autothrottles and VNAV than you could muster......I think they are better qualified for 5 legs a day than you are.....

SWA=easily replaced....

DAL International..... mmmmnotsomuch (not believing my hype, just stating who's easier to replace....ask the Fine Midwest folks who got shafted)

Flame on haters!!! :uzi:

Hey Bill,

Southwest has a ZERO domestic codeshare clause, how about Delta?

Most international is off the table too. Kinda hard for SWA management to replace the ops.

RF

 

[General Lee]

BOYS ! Settle Down. Nobody gives a rats azz about anything besides size of paycheck and job security. "Equipment" maybe, ok, brand new 737's should satisfy that.

Anything else just isn't important.

SWA leads in the above two areas by the way...

What happens when that isn't the case anymore? The legacies ARE getting more healthy, and contract time is coming up at UAL/CAL (for the merger), and DL (2012 ammendable, but talks starting 18 months prior). If rates match SWA for the 737 or equivalent, and higher for widebodies, then what would you say? If pay was about the same, SWA would lose for lack of variety in planes, routes, layovers, etc. Some people don't care about where they go, until they try INTL flying and see that it is like a mini-vacation. It's great, and the SWA guys like to say it's no big deal because "they used to fly to INTL places in the C141....." It's just not the same, and they know it. So, add the same pay or better and more variety, SWA will be seen as a well paid REGIONAL, flying lots of legs to some nowhere towns in West Texas.


Stability? I would say the airlines paying down debt and having the most cash on hand are pretty good for now. (DL is doing both) And with possible mergers out there for every airline, stabiltiy may be hard to come by. CEOs will be making decisions that could affect everyone.

And you think new 737s satisfy "variety?" They already fly 737NGs. How does that satisfy variety? They are stuck on one plane type, forever. They will fly it to ELP and LBB over 600 times in their careers, and that might be in the first 10 years. 4 or 5 legs a day in that plane, trip after trip, would get mighty boring. But hey, they are currently well paid, and they seem to have fun, which is not bad I guess. But add pay at the other airlines, and I see SWA guys leaving SWA in droves. They did before 9-11---SWA Captains were leaving for newhire UAL classes.


Bye Bye---General Lee

 

[General Lee]

Hey Bill,

Southwest has a ZERO domestic codeshare clause, how about Delta?

Most international is off the table too. Kinda hard for SWA management to replace the ops.

RF

Your management didn't trust you flying to Canada or Mexico, so they initially went for someone else. Westjet just dumped you guys for a potential Delta code share hook up. But hey, you still have Volaris, right? They were just sold by their owner (which included Carlos Slim, the richest person in the World), so you have that going for you, right?


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[redflyer65]

Westjest is gone and Volaris along with the other Mexican carriers are off the table.

What else you got General.

I guess DL doesn't trust you to go to hundreds of cities..

 

[The Prussian]

Go ahead and buy bottled water...I'm reaching in my pocket for my car keys...

 

[General Lee]

Hey General, you are just too easy buddy. Try this...

Compass.....36
Mesaba.......88
Pinnacle.....140
Comair.......120
ASA...........159

These total 543 without Skywest, Shuttle America and Mesa.

Its easily over 750 airframes (probably pushing 1000 if I had the exact numbers). What a joke. That's almost 300 aircraft more than Southwest even owns...

When I say enjoy your RJ's, you could pick one of a thousand!! Delta ALPA opened the door years ago, and YOUR management drove 1000 semi's right through the middle. You can go on and on about we parked this or that, but you will never recover the numbers you gave away.

How many pilots are not employeed by Delta because of this?

How many cities pairs lost?

How many airframes lost? Get the picture yet?

My last four day trip had two legs each day, so even your 4-5 legs a day rings hollow. Even on the rare occasion I do 4 legs a day, I know we are feeding our own operation....not farming it out like you do. Plus I get 105/hr after two years to do it. Enjoy all those RJ's buddy. I'll take the money to the bank and keep flying Southwest passengers....

well for... Southwest!

Are those current RJ numbers? I recall ASA losing 50 or so 50 seaters (some going to United) and some 76 seaters going to Air Mekong in Vietnam. Then there is Comair, which supposedly will lose a lot more this year. Mesaba doesn't have all jets--some are Saabs, and they are going away. Freedom Air (Mesa) has 22 RJs for Delta, and they will all go away by the end of this year. RA has stated he will be pulling down more of those 50 seaters, and we can see that that is underway.

As far as how many city pairs have been lost, or mainline jobs. Obviously, a lot over the years. No doubt about that. But, RJs are losing their luster, and the trend is reversing, especially with higher fuel out there.

And, the majority of your trips have mutiple leg days. You can't say otherwise. It's great you have a trip now and then that have fewer legs, but that isn't how your trips work. Your trips are supposed to be high productivity trips. Normally legacy pilots fly from BOS to LAX, or JFK to SLC and they are done. Not you guys, you fly BWI to SLC, and then onto LAS, and SJC. That stinks. Your trips try to get the max out of every day, and while that sounds great, you are left feeling like "dawgs." That is a direct quote from one of your FOs I talked to----"they work us like dawgs." But, if you like that stuff (for now anyway), good for you.


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[General Lee]

Westjest is gone and Volaris along with the other Mexican carriers are off the table.

What else you got General.

I guess DL doesn't trust you to go to hundreds of cities..

Are you comparing LBB and AMA to DL cities like Quito, Beijing, and Lagos? Yeah, I guess your cities are tougher...????(2 of those are nice, BTW)

And, Westjet is gone because they left you. Volaris was never a good fit for anyone. Since they are gone, when again will you start some INTL flying? Luckily you have finally mastered the VNAV and PFD, right?


Bye Bye---General Lee