Southwest evaluates -800's

[walkthasky]

I love it! You guys think we work sooo hard! 6 legs this, 6 legs that. 4 years, and have done that once. Oh and if we work hard we get paid more. This is hilarious to watch all the energy wasted on the same ol sh!t...

P.S. I dont give a sh!t how many cities i fly to, or where those cities are. By the way its 68, not 62 cities, but whos counting

 

[MILPILOT17]

I love it! You guys think we work sooo hard! 6 legs this, 6 legs that. 4 years, and have done that once. Oh and if we work hard we get paid more. This is hilarious to watch all the energy wasted on the same ol sh!t...

P.S. I dont give a sh!t how many cities i fly to, or where those cities are. By the way its 68, not 62 cities, but whos counting

It's 69 cities; yes, it really is!

 

[BILL LUMBERG]

C'mon Bill, really? Seems overly simplistic to me. Have you forgotten People Express, Frank Lorenzo, Chapter 11, etc and their effects on industry pay/benefits ?? Maybe it's just me thinking they had some impact on our profession. And blaming RJ's on SWA too -- nice, pure genius!! Here I was thinking Comair/Delta Connection was doing it, with DALPA approval, to upgrade their "regional" service from their Saab fleet as a way to help keep high yield business travelers.

In truth as a neutral guy I have to say both airlines would offer great career prospects. Each has its pros and cons but overall would be a great place to call home. But, as an outside FI observer it seems the SWA guys tend to be more in a defensive mode as opposed to the few OAL guys pointing fingers ...

MT,

True comments. You are right, there were other factors. If you read between the lines of my statement, WE major pilots have no one to blame for releasing the scope.....the downward PRESSURE on wages and benefits, productivity, wages and Luv came from many of the factors you listed but SWA can't be left out of the usual suspects lineup.......Southwest had a hand in it......In fact, read the DAL bankruptcy transcripts and the executives made a point of bringing them up and their productivity.

 

[BILL LUMBERG]

Forget the General, Bill Lumberg is now my NEW BEST FRIEND!

Backatya.....

 

[BILL LUMBERG]

I love it! You guys think we work sooo hard! 6 legs this, 6 legs that. 4 years, and have done that once. Oh and if we work hard we get paid more. This is hilarious to watch all the energy wasted on the same ol sh!t...

P.S. I dont give a sh!t how many cities i fly to, or where those cities are. By the way its 68, not 62 cities, but whos counting

Hence my point......

Apples to oranges my friend.....500+ destinations and you guys just cherrypick....

Seriously, you think you could expend some of the hard earned capital and make your profit machine cough up for some training? There, oh snap....now I've done it....

cue Scope in 3....2.....1.....(Mark)

 

[BILL LUMBERG]

Interesting observation. Though I would venture a guess that far more SWA threads have been hijacked by Delta dudes (like this one), than the other way around.

Sorry about the thread hijack.....

No kidding....

 

[waveflyer]

Scope only likes to stalk me.
Mustve seen me at a hotel gym and is hoping I'm a little bit gay. Sorry geek- not gonna happen.
And yes- wn threads are always hijacked by the haters. I don't care if you do or don't like your job- why do you care so much about mine?

As for 69 cities- what? Delta doesn't go to all those destinations to make a profit? You make it sound like delta was approached by Reagan and asked to add those cities for the good of the nation.
And as for apples to oranges- I agree- right up to the point an 86 seat rj flew from SLC-ATL- hub to hub- which you guys allowed AFTER you were out of bankruptcy. Care to know how many times I've seen rj's fly SLC-LAX? Or ATL-ORD?
Yeah... I'm gonna have to disagree that those markets OR those planes are too small for mainlone sellouts.
Fix your own screwed up house before criticizing anyone else. DALPA has been a huge part of the problem. And ALWAYS remember- every time you get "fed" over the atlantic or pat yourself on the back over how good your life is doing those 2 leg 3 days- you're enjoying that off the backs of commuter pilots you sold out who ought to be on your seniority list.

 

[Scope out RJ's]

Scope only likes to stalk me.
Mustve seen me at a hotel gym and is hoping I'm a little bit gay.

Unless you're talking the hotel in Athens, or Istanbul, then no, I haven't seen you. And no I don't hope you're gay, I know you're gay. You stated it!

Sorry geek- not gonna happen.

Thank God for that....Make sure and tell your man that, I'm sure he's worried.

And yes- wn threads are always hijacked by the haters. I don't care if you do or don't like your job- why do you care so much about mine?

I really could care less about you or your pay for training job. It is when you pass the buck on the ills of the industry and forget to look in the mirror. (or is cause you're flexing those abs for that man?)

As for 69 cities- what? Delta doesn't go to all those destinations to make a profit? You make it sound like delta was approached by Reagan and asked to add those cities for the good of the nation.
And as for apples to oranges- I agree- right up to the point an 86 seat rj flew from SLC-ATL- hub to hub- which you guys allowed AFTER you were out of bankruptcy. Care to know how many times I've seen rj's fly SLC-LAX? Or ATL-ORD?

My bet says you can't count that high, unless you're talking pay for training......

Yeah... I'm gonna have to disagree that those markets OR those planes are too small for mainlone sellouts.

Or we could just think how less we'd have to work if it wasn't for the swapa sellouts on age 65, their crappy work rules, and the origional inventors of pay for training.

Fix your own screwed up house before criticizing anyone else. DALPA has been a huge part of the problem. And ALWAYS remember- every time you get "fed" over the atlantic or pat yourself on the back over how good your life is doing those 2 leg 3 days- you're enjoying that off the backs of commuter pilots you sold out who ought to be on your seniority list.

I find it a riot that you continue to suck the sack of swapa that sold you out on your "quick upgrade," after spending all that money to buy your job, on age 65......
Then, you have the stones to point the finger elsewhere that someone is a sellout. Clean up your own house before pointing fingers Fidel.....That is of course if you can keep them off that "special man" in your life.
BTW wave, how's that stagnation treating you?:laugh:
At least you'll be growing by trading in some of those older 73-300's for some "heavy" 737-800's.....

 

[B727Driver]

Scope, what is it with your creepy fixation with SWA, SWAPA, calling others gay and bringing their mothers into your rant?
Clean up your own mess with RJ's and scope'em out. Any progress on this issue?
Last look still has RJ's doing a lot of mainline flying.
One thing is to have it as your screen name, the other is to get off your butt and do something about it. Instead of people seeing you as a colossal a--hole, I personally would like to read about how you lead your pilot group as the first one to separate mainline flying from a regional. That would speak volumes. Otherwise, all we have is a collection of 1600+ posts of nothing but senseless BS.
BTW, when you call waveflyer a 'sellout', explain RJ's? How did they get mainline flying at your airline? Senior pilots selling out the junior pilots? I've got mine, the heck with you?

Waiting for your non-articulate, immature response in....3...2.....1...

 

[MILPILOT17]

Unless you're talking the hotel in Athens, or Istanbul, then no, I haven't seen you. And no I don't hope you're gay, I know you're gay. You stated it!





Thank God for that....Make sure and tell your man that, I'm sure he's worried.


I really could care less about you or your pay for training job. It is when you pass the buck on the ills of the industry and forget to look in the mirror. (or is cause you're flexing those abs for that man?)


My bet says you can't count that high, unless you're talking pay for training......


Or we could just think how less we'd have to work if it wasn't for the swapa sellouts on age 65, their crappy work rules, and the origional inventors of pay for training.


I find it a riot that you continue to suck the sack of swapa that sold you out on your "quick upgrade," after spending all that money to buy your job, on age 65......
Then, you have the stones to point the finger elsewhere that someone is a sellout. Clean up your own house before pointing fingers Fidel.....That is of course if you can keep them off that "special man" in your life.
BTW wave, how's that stagnation treating you?:laugh:
At least you'll be growing by trading in some of those older 73-300's for some "heavy" 737-800's.....

Scope, When you finally sit down on the side of the bed with a handgun pointed at your head, please for the love of God, make sure it's loaded!

 

[waveflyer]

The stagnation's alright- bc I have a job where it doesn't suck to be an FO.
But I certainly don't gloat about it and am grateful every day for landing on my feet in this industry- a couple different choices and life might be a lot different for me- so feel bad for a flight instructor trying to break into a turbine flying job if you're into pity- but don't feel bad for me-
I don't suck swapa's teet- I was fairly neutral on age 65 bc I knew it was trending that way- what I disagree w/ wholeheartedly was the split second implementation that causes furloughs at every company that doesn't give a dam about their employees. I also think that every contract should have compensation for FO's and we did get some of that in our latest contract- enough?
We're in a pretty bad economy - I don't worry too much about enough.
Where did you get this idea that I haven't worked w/ my union as much as I can to address issues? Or this idea that I think we're perfect? I don't- what I say is that I love coming to work- and that's due in large part to our mgmt making this culture a priority. I appreciate that and am grateful for that.

Scope is a huge issue for me- did DALPA sell out 90 seat crj's out of bankruptcy in 2006 or did they not?

So while the general laments us for our occasional 5 leg days- I like to point out how many pilots you have flying delta pax's under delta colors - who you won't let on your list who routinely fly 7-8 leg days. You can pretend that's a different airline if you want- but it's burying your head in the sand-

 

[BILL LUMBERG]

The stagnation's alright- bc I have a job where it doesn't suck to be an FO.

Scope is a huge issue for me- did DALPA sell out 90 seat crj's out of bankruptcy in 2006 or did they not?

-

Wave.....tell the truth.....76 seats.....be nice!

Also it doesn't suck to be an FO compared to your old commuter job?? You sound like a JB guy who thinks he hit the jackpot....enjoy that right seat.....I hope it's comfy.

 

[waveflyer]

All crj 900's capable of 90 seats- mostly configured to 76 but a few to 84.

If they configured 757's to 76 seats would that be alright w/ you too?

Well bill since you asked - it's my 3rd major-
so I can compare legacy to wn w/ more legitimacy than most- but it begs the question- just when am I allowed to be "happy" in your estimation?
Only when I get to your seat doing the type of flying you do?

 

[GuppyWN]

How many domestic citites does Mother Delta serve?

I have no idea. I'm just curious.

Check back when Southwest is 80. Then we'll be able to really compare.

For now I hope that "all ya'll" think we're nothing more than a nickel and dime airline and are absolutely no threat to your customer base.

Gup

ps. I will add that Southwest is the only airline I know of, anywhere, that has a ZERO DOMESTIC CODESHARE clause in their pilot contract.

Put that in your pipe and smoke it.

 

[B727Driver]

Gup, guess y'all did what they could not.

 

[Scope out RJ's]

Scope, what is it with your creepy fixation with SWA, SWAPA, calling others gay and bringing their mothers into your rant?

The only one I call gay is waveflyer. He's the one who admitted it on this very forum, not me. I have zero fixation with swa,swapa. Your swapa boys point the might finger at alpa, and i have no problem with that. My problem is when they say alpa is responsible for all the problems in this industry, and calling alpa pilots sellouts.......Yet they see no problems with APA? Don't they have rj's as well? Are they sellouts too?

Clean up your own mess with RJ's and scope'em out. Any progress on this issue?

When we start section 6, I'll let you know.

Last look still has RJ's doing a lot of mainline flying.
One thing is to have it as your screen name, the other is to get off your butt and do something about it. Instead of people seeing you as a colossal a--hole, I personally would like to read about how you lead your pilot group as the first one to separate mainline flying from a regional.

I believe you'll see lots more regional reduction in the future. The 50 seater basically is obsolete (except for very few markets). More and more of them are being parked......

That would speak volumes. Otherwise, all we have is a collection of 1600+ posts of nothing but senseless BS.

Now what else would this useless sight be for then?

BTW, when you call waveflyer a 'sellout', explain RJ's? How did they get mainline flying at your airline? Senior pilots selling out the junior pilots? I've got mine, the heck with you?

Exactly! No different than southwest. Just look at yourselves. You guys invented pay for training, and were the catalyst for age 65. Your junior guys are not going to have any forward movement, and the growth you'll see is in larger 737's. Your senior guys would sell out your junior guys in a second to keep up their rediculous schedules, especially when when your fall cutbacks take place........And we're the sellouts????

Waiting for your non-articulate, immature response in....3...2.....1...

See below reply to milpilot17

Scope, When you finally sit down on the side of the bed with a handgun pointed at your head, please for the love of God, make sure it's loaded!

Milpilot:
Usually when I sit down on the side of the bed, I'm with your old lady, and with how many people are in and out of that trailer, I wouldn't point anything anywhere!:laugh:

 

[FLYLOW22]

ps. I will add that southwest is the only airline i know of, anywhere, that has a zero domestic codeshare clause in their pilot contract.

Put that in your pipe and smoke it.

bing!!!!!!

 

[B727Driver]

Hey Scope, SWAPA member...no. Sorry to disappoint you. Zero fixation on your part....oh, sure. 1600+ rants tell otherwise.

Sellouts, in a way, yes. Any legacy that contracts RJ's to do mainline flying and that is approved by the union are selling out the bottom and future members of their seniority list. The sad thing is that no one looks backwards or entertains future ramifications when contracts are due. The "what's in it for me" and "I've got mine" runs rampant. Gup is right, zero domestic codeshare in their contract. Do you have that in yours? I suspect that may have been an issue with the rejection of their first TA. Can't wait to see how you spearhead your Sec. 6. I commend you for stepping up. For now, there are still RJ's on the property and mainline flying your DALPA brothers are not doing. I believe you and APA had mainline, dues paying pilots furloughed while outsourced flying was in place (see Comair, ASA, Eagle...). Unity??? Also, please enlighten us on what SWAPA is thinking. You seem to know so much of what is going on over there. The end of the 50 seater is a good start, the larger RJ's are still a problem. Only sky high fuel costs will kill the high seat-mile cost of the RJ. Probably why SWA doesn't use them. Beware of the EMB's. They're more competitive, don't forget those when you go to Sec.6.

 

[maxblast72]

For now I hope that "all ya'll" think we're nothing more than a nickel and dime airline and are absolutely no threat to your customer base.

Leo Mullin thought Airtran was no threat to the big D back in the late 1990s when Airtran had 30 old DC-9s. Fast forward 10 years and Airtran had 140 brand new Boeings with an average fleet age of less than 5 years and was flying 4 times as many ASMs as they had 10 years earlier. Richard Anderson probably won't make the same mistakes of underestimating competition like Mullin did.

 

[BILL LUMBERG]

Gup, guess y'all did what they could not.

What's that?