NWA/DAL negotiations update

[nwaredtail]

So on top of the % pay increase to bring their contract up to ours, they will get a huge pay increase to change their longevity to where it rightfully should be.

[/QUOTE]

Yup, negotiated by our NC, (mostly) and DAL management. You should be happy that your fellow pilots are getting a raise. Are you not?

It didn't come out of DALPA back pocket, so why do you care besides the fact your seniority may be affected?

 

[General Lee]

[/quote]Yup, negotiated by our NC, (mostly) and DAL management. You should be happy that your fellow pilots are getting a raise. Are you not?

It didn't come out of DALPA back pocket, so why do you care besides the fact your seniority may be affected?[/quote]

If he is on the DC9, it probably won't.


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[Frank Lorenzo]

Protections? Well, depending on when the DC9s are parked (they will be eventually), the timing of the SLI is important.

So when are all of your gas-guzzling MD-80's going to be parked? How old are your 767's? When will they be parked?

Don't worry General. Not to pick on just you. Nobody seems to want to address the fleet incompatibility as well.

What will the new Delta do with all the NWA Airbuses? What is the fuel burn of a 747? Will they be grounded?

If you simply answer that Delta will just "replace" these aircraft, where are the details?

Where the hell is Delta (not far from yet another bankruptcy right now) going to come up with capital and/or financing? If they are Boeing replacements, what production line will they come from?

You guys are amazing how you think that the size of this combined airline will stay static or grow. You are all banking on things to fall into place that have historically NEVER fallen into place after mergers.

This current hiring boom Delta just went through was a result of a huge expansion gamble. What if things don't work out as planned? Who will be the furlough fodder for that debacle? What is Delta goes into BK again? Where will the furloughs come from?

The Delta Family is about to become the Hatfields and McCoys.

 

[General Lee]

So when are all of your gas-guzzling MD-80's going to be parked? How old are your 767's? When will they be parked?

Don't worry General. Not to pick on just you. Nobody seems to want to address the fleet incompatibility as well.

What will the new Delta do with all the NWA Airbuses? What is the fuel burn of a 747? Will they be grounded?

If you simply answer that Delta will just "replace" these aircraft, where are the details?

Where the hell is Delta (not far from yet another bankruptcy right now) going to come up with capital and/or financing? If they are Boeing replacements, what production line will they come from?

You guys are amazing how you think that the size of this combined airline will stay static or grow. You are all banking on things to fall into place that have historically NEVER fallen into place after mergers.

This current hiring boom Delta just went through was a result of a huge expansion gamble. What if things don't work out as planned? Who will be the furlough fodder for that debacle? What is Delta goes into BK again? Where will the furloughs come from?

The Delta Family is about to become the Hatfields and McCoys.

Frank, you actually ran an airline? Wow, you don't know much. The MD88s are newer than AA MD80s, have autothrottles and FMS to help with fuel burn, and can carry more people so the CASM is lower. After our BK the lease rates were reduced $200,000 a month lower than they were, making them more profitable. They are now used on some INTL routes from ATL---which can be a better fit than the 738 or 757 on certain routes.

How old are the 767s? Well, we are adding winglets to them. Does that tell you something? That will help out on fuel burn, and they are good cargo birds also. Rumor has it that some of them will get a cargo conversion and go to ANC. (UPS flies them from ANC to Osaka, Seoul, etc) We will still have those valuable cargo slots when we merge you know, and the 742s are getting really old. If UPS is getting rid of them, I bet we will eventually. The 744s will probably be converted to cargo also. Even Air France announced their 744s retirements---they are adding 777-300ERs at a fast rate to replace them.

Will we replace all of the old planes? Probably---with 777LRs and 787s for the widebodies, and 737NGs and some 100 seater Boeing may produce for the narrowbodies. We supposedly will have the same hubs (according to RA today anyway)---so I think we will have close to the same numbers for fleet. It will take awhile to replace though, and in the meantime we will supplement our fleet with fairly new used aircraft if needed--like the 20 MD90s that could be coming from Saudia. They are more fuel efficient than other planes out there, and could provide the gap.

Who will be furloughed you ask? If we on the DL side park our planes before we combine the certificates, then our side will furlough. Same goes for NWA. It will take awhile anyway to get the SLI done it seems.


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[dtfl]

Yup, negotiated by our NC, (mostly) and DAL management. You should be happy that your fellow pilots are getting a raise. Are you not?

It didn't come out of DALPA back pocket, so why do you care besides the fact your seniority may be affected?[/quote]

No junior pilot will be happy with a temporary pay raise, only to be furloughed because the DC9s were parked AFTER the SLI.

 

[dtfl]

Are you joking? NWA did more "cleaning house" in BK than any other airline. That's precisely why we have the lowest operating cost in the business. Only a few years ago we had a fleet of 165 DC9's. We had almost 500+ total aircraft, while now we have 300 and some change.

If you think Delta is still going to receive those aircraft this year with fuel $130 + you're high.

and you think you will receive the coveted 787?
And I'd like to see those #s proving you have the lowest cost in the business. Legacy business, maybe. Nevermind..I'll research it.....

 

[dtfl]

Stick to the point.... What does the equip have anything to do with integrating a sen list? NOTHING.

On the other issue, you just answered my point. New hires are getting the 767 because it sucks. Blame it on resv rules, base, whatever, it sucks. To be junior at DAL on the 767 is not good. Just like being junior on the DC9 sucks.

Thats NOT what he said. New hires are getting the 767 (and MD88) to the NYC area....because NYC/LGA/EWR SUCK.

 

[Superpilot92]

Yup, negotiated by our NC, (mostly) and DAL management. You should be happy that your fellow pilots are getting a raise. Are you not? raise or some of the previous money back?

It didn't come out of DALPA back pocket, so why do you care besides the fact your seniority may be affected?

No junior pilot will be happy with a temporary pay raise, only to be furloughed because the DC9s were parked AFTER the SLI.

If the DC9s are just "parked" after the SLI then its directly because of the DAL scope language. It is directly against the NWA scope language to just park all the DC9s without parking 70 seaters first. I know it sounds better for your argument but thats the truth.

 

[Schwanker]

Protections? Well, depending on when the DC9s are parked (they will be eventually)......
Bye Bye--General Lee

So will all 8 (strike that), all 10 of your 777s.

Schwanker

 

[~~~^~~~]

nevermind....

 

[General Lee]

So will all 8 (strike that), all 10 of your 777s.

Schwanker

We'll have 16 777s by next March 31st, and probably 20 or more after that. Yeah, and they will all eventually be parked, and then I will bid the Space Shuttle and do Moon turns. You will probably hold long trips to Uranus.......


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[nwaredtail]

We'll have 16 777s by next March 31st, and probably 20 or more after that.

Typical General Lee, they will probably get more, but when NWA guys talk about the planes we will probably get, GL, Puffscab, etc jump all over it.

 

[FBN0223]

Predictable, but somehow entertaining....

 

[Schwanker]

We'll have 16 777s by next March 31st, and probably 20 or more after that. Yeah, and they will all eventually be parked, and then I will bid the Space Shuttle and do Moon turns. You will probably hold long trips to Uranus.......


Bye Bye--General Lee

Yeah? And we'll have 68 787s! Probably another 200 after that!

 

[General Lee]

Yeah? And we'll have 68 787s! Probably another 200 after that!

Looks to me like all of your group will be going to Uranus. Also, have you ever seen the "dreamliner?" Has it even flown yet? I am sure we also will order those Space Shuttles, and they will be on our side---and I have seen those fly.....they're cool.......

Bye Bye--General Lee