Thanks SkyW

[Nightrain_080]

Vote NO!

There are plenty of EMB-145's out there for lease. You just have to look around. I don't think JA is going to wait and see how XJT votes anyway. The lawyers and BOD have already voted.

 

[JoeMerchant]

Yeesh. Do they pass out the kool-aid before or after you sacrifice the virgin to the volcano?

SKW isn't nearly the "knight in shining armor" they'd like to think they are to XJT pilots. Under SKW's proposal 700 XJT pilots would see the street, all while watching SKW pilots sit in our former cockpits.

How many XJT pilots will see the street without the deal? That is the question? Jerry's Koolaid seems to work better than ALPA "job protection".....

 

[Nevets]

How many XJT pilots will see the street without the deal? That is the question? Jerry's Koolaid seems to work better than ALPA "job protection".....

This deal is setting up a whipsaw situation with the ability to eventually transfer all the XJT aircraft to join the other 30 at SKW if XJT decides not to become "cost competitive" after one year. How is that koolaid "job protection?"

All SKW/ASA/XJT pilots should be concerned about this.

 

[Nevets]

A company with loads of cash and bright future would like to buy their company and share that future with them.

What doesn't add up is the future JA is setting up with whipsaw of XJT by being able to transfer all their aircraft to join the other 30 at SKW if XJT pilots decide not to be "cost competitive" after one year.

I'm sure all XJT pilots would be more than happy if SKW was willing to treat its potential new employees a little better than putting the fear of losing more aircraft just a year later.

 

[Bako Cap]

One more thing: SKW pilots licking their lips over the idea of a quick upgrade on former XJT frames: anyone who knowingly flies XJT aircraft with XJT pilots on the street is nothing better than a scab.

Correct me if I am wrong. Does Xjet own any of the leases on the aircraft they fly? I was under the impression that the aircraft leases are owned by CAL and subleased to Xjet for the duration of their contract.

 

[ToiletDuck]

XJT doesn't own any aircraft. They opted to lease them so that they could easily disperse of them should the occasion require it.

 

[XPOO]

Yeesh. Do they pass out the kool-aid before or after you sacrifice the virgin to the volcano?

SKW isn't nearly the "knight in shining armor" they'd like to think they are to XJT pilots. Under SKW's proposal 700 XJT pilots would see the street, all while watching SKW pilots sit in our former cockpits. I personally don't see that as a good thing. Would you if you were put in the same situation?

Not to mention the fact that us giving up our scope is bad for everyone. It'll further the whipsaw between regional carriers, to which a combined SKW/XJT/ASA would see no end. JA obviously thinks we're a bunch of spineless doormats who are easily intimidated into giving up one of the things that makes our contract what it is. Just like all of us are standing behind PNCL ALPA with their contract struggles, all pilots who care about the betterment of the industry should stand behind the XJT pilot group in support of a NO vote to any scope change. Period.

One more thing: SKW pilots licking their lips over the idea of a quick upgrade on former XJT frames: anyone who knowingly flies XJT aircraft with XJT pilots on the street is nothing better than a scab.

Or, you can stay the course. Keep losing millions. The branded flying eventually goes away due to lack of funds. 700 pilots get shown the door anyways. CAL then starts taking your aircraft away one by one. JA already has his E145 certification and a deal with CAL. Looks like he'll win either way. It's just a waiting game now. Toodles.

Oh, and I like to have my Kool-Aid WHILE I watch the virgin get sacrificed. Thanks for asking.

 

[rchcfi]

One more thing: SKW pilots licking their lips over the idea of a quick upgrade on former XJT frames: anyone who knowingly flies XJT aircraft with XJT pilots on the street is nothing better than a scab.

Is this a joke? Why don't you wake up and smell reality. While I hate to see any pilot out of work, this is how the industry works.

This kind of angst in a post screams of your perceived "entitlement". If the tables were turned, I'm sure you would be licking your lips!

(Must've been a Riddle Rat - What do they put in the water down there?)

 

[ToiletDuck]

This deal is setting up a whipsaw situation with the ability to eventually transfer all the XJT aircraft to join the other 30 at SKW if XJT decides not to become "cost competitive" after one year. How is that koolaid "job protection?"

All SKW/ASA/XJT pilots should be concerned about this.

You still didn't address his question. How will NOT selling to SKYW be any better? Look at Mesa. That's what holding out till the bitter end without changing your ways accomplishes. Last I checked XJT is already offering COLAs to 300 of the peeps. You aren't too far from being there already.

 

[unreal]

Is this a joke? Why don't you wake up and smell reality. While I hate to see any pilot out of work, this is how the industry works.

This kind of angst in a post screams of your perceived "entitlement". If the tables were turned, I'm sure you would be licking your lips!

(Must've been a Riddle Rat - What do they put in the water down there?)

Your post is barely worth responding to with all of the assumptions you've thrown around, but:

"This is how the industry works" doesn't put food on any tables. I make my living, and won't stand around idly by as I watch that living be given to someone else to fly the same aircraft on the same routes. Anyone who does that flying would be stepping on the backs of those on the street just to get ahead, and no, there's very little difference between that and a scab.

Or, you can stay the course. Keep losing millions. The branded flying eventually goes away due to lack of funds. 700 pilots get shown the door anyways. CAL then starts taking your aircraft away one by one. JA already has his E145 certification and a deal with CAL. Looks like he'll win either way. It's just a waiting game now. Toodles.

C'mon, at least give me something challenging.

-If Branded shuts down, far fewer than 700 pilots will get shown the door. Even if Branded shuts down all at once, only ~350 would lose their jobs, and XJT would instantly be a profitable company again. Of course, summer is still on its way and we don't know what that has in store.

-If CAL takes another 51, there's no guarantee that SKW would even see those aircraft. Think you could find 51 ERJs overnight? CAL knows that with another 51 gone they lose the "most favored nation" clause, and all of those restrictions about rates and CPAs with other airlines would be gone. Could we put those aircraft somewhere else? Maybe, maybe not. But considering that the first aircraft wouldn't leave property until December 2009, nobody knows what the airline industry or economy will look like then.

No, things aren't rosy without SKW, but things are hardly rosy with SKW either. I'm simply hoping that the SKW pilot group doesn't stand behind JA's strong-arming tactics with the XJT pilot group. I've heard a lot of "Jerry wouldn't do that!" from the SKW crowd, but look around. Jerry is doing that, and you should be wary.

 

[SkyNation]

Nevets,

for someone who posted incessantly about SkyWest during the union drive, do you really believe the doom and gloom that you suggest will befall you guys if JA buys you? all the same conjecture was spewed during the purchase of ASA, yet none of it has come to fruition. hell, even USCTrojan praises Brad Holt now. I think you should look at how that all went as a model for how things would probably go should you be bought by Inc. while all scenarios present at least some degree of suckiness, it seems that being bought by Inc. might be the least objectionable.

also, I think I speak for most when I say that SkyWest pilots don't feel like we benefited any when we bought ASA (no rash of upgrades, no influx of AC, no noticeable change to bottom line numbers that resulted in more $ via bonuses, etc.). we didn't lose anything, either. so in the end, at least for me, I hope Inc. doesn't buy you guys, but I guess it won't change my life at all, just like the ASA purchase didn't. as I know you appreciate, it will change yours.

best of luck to you guys, I have a number of buddies there.

 

[unreal]

You still didn't address his question. How will NOT selling to SKYW be any better? Look at Mesa. That's what holding out till the bitter end without changing your ways accomplishes. Last I checked XJT is already offering COLAs to 300 of the peeps. You aren't too far from being there already.

When did you last check? 2-3 months ago?

That 300 number was just a rumor. According to GS, about 140 COLAs were approved, while quite a few were denied.

 

[McNugget]

All your riddle rats belong to us!

Sorry XJT.

Look at it this way SKYW, at least you'll be able to fly with Pocono Pilot

 

[XPOO]

Think you could find 51 ERJs overnight?

Where will Freedom put theirs once Delta says adios?

 

[sweptback]

also, I think I speak for most when I say that SkyWest pilots don't feel like we benefited any when we bought ASA (no rash of upgrades, no influx of AC, no noticeable change to bottom line numbers that resulted in more $ via bonuses, etc.). we didn't lose anything, either. so in the end, at least for me, I hope Inc. doesn't buy you guys, but I guess it won't change my life at all, just like the ASA purchase didn't. as I know you appreciate, it will change yours.

Are you kidding me? You guys got 26 of our aircraft that we had orders or options for. That's a lot of upgrades!

 

[Flyerdan]

Where will Freedom put theirs once Delta says adios?

Any truth to the rumor that ASA is spinning up an ERJ training program as well?

 

[Superpilot92]

A SkyWest pilot wanting ONELIST with my ASA and (hopefully soon) Xjet brothers. 7700 strong baby... .

your signature is dead on. Just think if everyone thought like that, You could change the regional industry overnight.

 

[Turtlesfly]

your signature is dead on. Just think if everyone thought like that, You could change the regional industry overnight.

If you wanted one list across the board then you would furlough some of your own people. You don't need all of our 274 planes, and whoever your most junior people are combined with our most junior people would both be doomed

 

[JoeMerchant]

Are you kidding me? You guys got 26 of our aircraft that we had orders or options for. That's a lot of upgrades!

....yet at the time ALPA leadership said those planes were never coming to ASA....Hmmm....Was ALPA honest about those airplanes?

 

[JoeMerchant]

This deal is setting up a whipsaw situation with the ability to eventually transfer all the XJT aircraft to join the other 30 at SKW if XJT decides not to become "cost competitive" after one year. How is that koolaid "job protection?"

All SKW/ASA/XJT pilots should be concerned about this.

I've been concerned about whipsaw and single lists since the ASA/CMR PID filing in 2000....It is ALPA that doesn't seem to concerned.....

The whipsaw is being used on you currently....We are all being whipsawed.....

 

[sweptback]

....yet at the time ALPA leadership said those planes were never coming to ASA....Hmmm....Was ALPA honest about those airplanes?

I can't answer for them. I'm not ALPA leadership. This is just my own personal opinion.

However, I think one of the reasons SkyWest bought ASA was for our order book. Whether or not those planes didn't come to ASA because we were in contract negotiations, our performance back then was terrible, or that the sky was blue doesn't really matter. The fact is, they went to SkyWest and for a SkyWest pilot to say that they didn't benefit from the purchase is pretty offensive to me.

An interesting tidbit, at the time of the ASA purchase SkyWest could not fly an aircraft with more than 50 seats for Delta due to the Delta PWA.

 

[Metro752]

Why not get rid of all of ALPA National, get some fresh blood in there.

 

[unreal]

A SkyWest pilot wanting ONELIST with my ASA and (hopefully soon) Xjet brothers. 7700 strong baby... .

To echo what Superpilot said, thanks for your support! Dead on!

 

[Dubya]

Why not get rid of all of ALPA National, get some fresh blood in there.

Your post has been rejected due to lack of anti-SkyWest rhetoric. Your attention to this matter is appreciated.

W

 

[SkyNation]

The fact is, they went to SkyWest and for a SkyWest pilot to say that they didn't benefit from the purchase is pretty offensive to me.

sorry to 'offend' your delicate sensibilities. maybe some jr. dudes upgraded, who knows.

I guess we agree that neither of us wanted the company I work for to have bought the company you work for? agreed. any 'benefit' derived from the purchase of any company by another would seemingly go the purchasing company, no?

blah, blah, blah, all this again. never mind.

 

[Nevets]

Or, you can stay the course. Keep losing millions. The branded flying eventually goes away due to lack of funds. 700 pilots get shown the door anyways. CAL then starts taking your aircraft away one by one. JA already has his E145 certification and a deal with CAL. Looks like he'll win either way. It's just a waiting game now. Toodles.

Oh, and I like to have my Kool-Aid WHILE I watch the virgin get sacrificed. Thanks for asking.

If SKW is so certain that XJT will go out of business, then why don't they just wait to buy up the pieces they want instead? There is reason why SKW wants this deal now.

 

[Nevets]

You still didn't address his question. How will NOT selling to SKYW be any better? Look at Mesa. That's what holding out till the bitter end without changing your ways accomplishes. Last I checked XJT is already offering COLAs to 300 of the peeps. You aren't too far from being there already.

Well, we have to see the final offer first. It may not be any better but there may be a majority that feel its better to not continue the race to the bottom that would happen when we get whipsawed. If we do vote down the offer, it may be like falling on our own swords and many think that is better for the industry as a whole. I personally don't think that its better, as the offer stands now, than to go independent because I don't think XJT will be bankrupt like SKW seems to think.

 

[Nevets]

Nevets,

for someone who posted incessantly about SkyWest during the union drive, do you really believe the doom and gloom that you suggest will befall you guys if JA buys you? all the same conjecture was spewed during the purchase of ASA, yet none of it has come to fruition. hell, even USCTrojan praises Brad Holt now. I think you should look at how that all went as a model for how things would probably go should you be bought by Inc. while all scenarios present at least some degree of suckiness, it seems that being bought by Inc. might be the least objectionable.

also, I think I speak for most when I say that SkyWest pilots don't feel like we benefited any when we bought ASA (no rash of upgrades, no influx of AC, no noticeable change to bottom line numbers that resulted in more $ via bonuses, etc.). we didn't lose anything, either. so in the end, at least for me, I hope Inc. doesn't buy you guys, but I guess it won't change my life at all, just like the ASA purchase didn't. as I know you appreciate, it will change yours.

best of luck to you guys, I have a number of buddies there.

Well, when SKW is out getting authorization to fly ERJs and at the same time negotiate a separate second CPA using 30 or so of XJTs aircraft to be flown by SKW pilots to feed CAL and at the same time put terms in the first CPA that CAL can put XJT's 205 aircraft up for bid one year later while at the same time offering XJT furloughed pilots preferential interviews coupled with the fact that ASA has language in their contract that prevents massive aircraft transfers, then there is little comparison between this deal and that of ASA.

I'm positive that BH and SKW as a whole runs a great ship operationally but that is different from saying that they wont whipsaw.

As the deal stands right now, it would benefit SKW pilots. But you may be right, it may be the least objectionable. I'll remain open minded and thanks for the well wishes.

 

[Nevets]

I've been concerned about whipsaw and single lists since the ASA/CMR PID filing in 2000....It is ALPA that doesn't seem to concerned.....

The whipsaw is being used on you currently....We are all being whipsawed.....

You are right. We are already being whipsawed when CAL said in their letter that "absent in our entering into a CPA with the savings of the magnitude with Skywest, we currently expect to deliver to ExpressJet on June 28, 2008, a notice to withdraw 51 of the existing 205 Covered Aircraft from the current CPA, beginning in December 2009." You can thank SKW for being a party in us already being whipsawed before any transaction is even complete. But its way more pervasive to be whipsawed by airlines owned by the SAME company!

 

[Turtlesfly]

CAL will not vote to give anybody 70 seat scope flying

XJT will not vote to give up our scope in a buyout.


This will kill the deal. Keep dreaming, Skywesties