UPS Pool

[AV80R]

...It does not make sense to see a company that makes so much money and has such a huge network....debating either furloughing or cutting back aircraft...

Huh? Furlough? Where did you hear that? Are you a member of some branch Davidian 'glass-is-always-half-empty' cult?

We are 'cutting' old aircraft to replace them with new ones, 767s and 747-400s. Take a deep breath; the end of the world is not here yet...

 

[Big Beer Belly]

Huh? Furlough? Where did you hear that?

Though I think much of it is bluster, it's still cause for concern when the company announces their intent to reduce domestic manning by 40% (5 crews reduced to 3 per aircraft). The numbers were about the same/worse on the international side.

IMHO... that type of staffing reduction is laughably improbable. HOWEVER, UPS's intent is to clearly reduce staffing and this first displacement bid is proof. It is cause for concern if you are junior in your seat or near the bottom in system seniority.

Best case is stagnation; very few pilots will retire in the next 5 years, age 65 and the 200 or so over 60 FE's, 3>2 cockpit conversion as old airplanes retired, all new jets are widebodies, etc...

I'm not even mentioning the possibility of several hundred mgmt pilots integrating or the economy in recession... This is certainly NOT a period of growth in our ranks, thus my prediction of no hiring for several years.

Wish it were different...

BBB

 

[LittleLearBoy]

BBB I'm with you on this. WHO KNOWS what they are going to do. I don't think UPS knows what to do as of right now. They have many plans, but don't know which one to pick from. I say just sit back and what the show. When they do start to hired again, I say EMPTY the POOL first!!! Yes, I hate the pool.

LLB

 

[pilotgolfer]

Is there anyone that interviewed at or around Sept 24th 2007 that made it into class already? I was invited to an interview that week and I'm curious if I would still be waiting for a class (if offered a job).

Thanks

 

[Tomct]

If they were smart...they would just pay the Old FE's their Captains pay, but leave them in the side-saddle. It is going to waste so much time and money that it is not even funny. And for what? So someone can sit in the left seat for MAYBE 3-5yrs? Leave them sideways and give them Captain pay and quit screwing around with all of the JMng. Get the guys out of the pool and get on with the hiring!!
NUF SAID!!! Discuss.....

 

[L'il J.Seinfeld]

We are tremendously overstaffed!! There are scores perhaps hundreds of pilots who have averaged less than 100 hours a year over the last 10 years at UPS. UPS has mismanaged its crew force and is finally starting to realize it. They don't need the reserve coverage we have and they are in the process of allocating resources correctly.

Thankfully the this contract fixed the FO pay rather than fatten the wallets if retirees like JM wanted. We will spend a lot longer on the FO pay scale but at least the pay is good. JM actually wanted to increase the retirement pay of already retired pilots!!

 

[AV80R]

We are tremendously overstaffed!! There are scores perhaps hundreds of pilots who have averaged less than 100 hours a year over the last 10 years at UPS...

Usually pretty positive posts from you. Did you have to sit hot standby by any chance?

 

[1800 RVR]

We are tremendously overstaffed!! There are scores perhaps hundreds of pilots who have averaged less than 100 hours a year over the last 10 years at UPS. UPS has mismanaged its crew force and is finally starting to realize it. They don't need the reserve coverage we have and they are in the process of allocating resources correctly.

Thankfully the this contract fixed the FO pay rather than fatten the wallets if retirees like JM wanted. We will spend a lot longer on the FO pay scale but at least the pay is good. JM actually wanted to increase the retirement pay of already retired pilots!!

L'il J,

You're starting to sound like management. :laugh: Personaly, I don't think that we are overstaffed, but more like the resources (us pilots) are just staffed in the wrong places. Certain fleets have reserve coverage that hardly gets touched, and then some that fly continuously.

You also state that certain pilots fly only 100 hrs a year. Again, if you are on a fleet that doesn't fly that much i.e. the -8, you won't get that much time. Pilots on reserve usually don't get large yearly numbers. That is why we are on reserve. We cover the sickcalls and a/c breakdowns. Ask the MD11 reserve crews, both CA and FO how much they are flying. A300 crews fly alot as well. Just my 2 cents...

 

[AV80R]

... Just my 2 cents...

I agree with your 2 cents...

 

[BiffF15]

If they were smart...they would just pay the Old FE's their Captains pay, but leave them in the side-saddle. It is going to waste so much time and money that it is not even funny. And for what? So someone can sit in the left seat for MAYBE 3-5yrs? Leave them sideways and give them Captain pay and quit screwing around with all of the JMng. Get the guys out of the pool and get on with the hiring!!
NUF SAID!!! Discuss.....

What would you do if you were UPS? I for one don't they they want to pay guys on the panel Capt's pay to have them sit there for years and years while simultaneously paying another guy as Capt who actually sits in the left seat to do the flying (it's like getting a half priced Capt - they get rid on one F/E and gain one CA).
I think the company is going to get them (over 60 guys) to sh-t or get off the pot. By giving them only ANC (for the most part) and (making) them go to training the company will force them to play their hand (move up or possibly get retired / trained on the DC8 panel). So an over 60 guy goes to training, who probably lives in SDF, who has to commute to ANC to fly into Asia for the next 5 years and then come back to a panel after ANOTHER training course. It appears they are going to up the pain threshold so much that the over 60 guys will die on the vine or retire. End result is no new guys needed, thinning out of the F/E ranks, and then actual retirement at age 65 (gets rid of the medical problems / sick call). In my opine they thought this one through at some levels (not all).
The next announcement will be retirement of the DC8s which will get rid of alot of F/E deadwood (in the companies mind) and save even more money.