honest questions about alpa

[utahpilot]

looking for info and not rhetoric or flames about alpa.

2 scenarios.

1-a pilot is involved in an incident, accident or whatever and the FAA seeks certificate action against him. he's an honest guy who made an honest mistake (ie: crossed and active runway, his FO struck a wing on landing or something similar). The company decides to fire him. what legal services would ALPA provide? is there a limit? how do they decide whether or not an attorney will be provided?

2-a pilot loses his medical (develops heart condition, eyes go bad, whatever.) he is no longer able to qualify for a medical, so he loses his job. what benefit would ALPA pay to this pilot, and for how long?

 

[Cpt Oveur]

not entirely sure about the first one, although alpa attorneys would be representing him, I know that much.

second scenario - in addition to the team at ALPA medical working to get his medical back, ALPA does off a loss of license policy where you could still collect money and benefits. More importantly is the team of doctors ALPA has try and get your medical back, I've seen pilots keep their medical just by calling ALPA medical and speaking with their AME on a cell phone and the pilot walk out with a class one certificate.

The ALPA legal and medical services are among the finest benefits that the association offers.

 

[SkyNation]

second scenario - in addition to the team at ALPA medical working to get his medical back, ALPA does off a loss of license policy where you could still collect money and benefits. More importantly is the team of doctors ALPA has try and get your medical back, I've seen pilots keep their medical just by calling ALPA medical and speaking with their AME on a cell phone and the pilot walk out with a class one certificate.

I'd also be curious the hear the specific amounts if a pilot cannot get his medical back.

 

[Tarzan]

I'd also be curious the hear the specific amounts if a pilot cannot get his medical back.

Depends on if there is insurance purchased. This stuff pays you even if you can work but can no longer fly due to blood pressure, eyes, etc.

 

[DrewBlows]

I cant' give you specific answers to these questions, but I'm sure someone else can. I'll try my best in general terms.

In scenario 1 there is an appeals process in place which eventually ends in arbitration. Someone else more familiar with the process can give you more details. I believe you would be provided with ALPA legal council at no additional cost with no limits set (that's what you pay your dues for).

I'm not sure what the loss of license benefits are, except that they exists.

 

[DrewBlows]

I'd also be curious the hear the specific amounts if a pilot cannot get his medical back.

Here you go.

ANNUAL PREMIUMS
Use this chart to determine your affordable annual premiums. Monthly Benefit Amount AGE* $600 $1,200 $1,800 $2,400 $3,000 $3,600 27 and under $57 $ 114 $ 171 $ 228 $ 285 $ 342 28 61 122 183 244 305 366 29 66 132 198 264 330 396 30 71 142 213 284 355 426 31 75 150 225 300 375 450 32 79 158 237 316 395 474 33 86 172 258 344 430 516 34 91 182 273 364 455 546 35 102 204 306 408 510 612 36 110 222 333 444 555 666 37 121 242 363 484 605 726 38 131 262 393 524 655 786 39 140 280 420 560 700 840 40 171 342 513 684 855 1,026 41 181 362 543 724 905 1,086 42 195 390 585 780 975 1,170 43 211 422 633 844 1,055 1,266 44 225 450 675 900 1,125 1,350 45 255 510 765 1,020 1,275 1,530 46 271 542 813 1,084 1,355 1,626 47 295 590 885 1,180 1,475 1,770 48 318 636 954 1,272 1,590 1,908 49 341 682 1,023 1,364 1,705 2,046 50 393 786 1,179 1,572 1,965 2,358 51 417 834 1,251 1,668 2,085 2,502 52 439 878 1,317 1,756 2,195 2,634 53 464 928 1,392 1,856 2,320 2,784 54 486 972 1,458 1,944 2,430 2,916 55 589 1,178 1,767 2,356 2,945 3,534 56 711 1,422 2,133 2,844 3,555 4,266 57 & Over** 823 1,646 2,469 3,292 4,115 4,938

Crap, the chart was totally lost in the cut and paste. Sorry.

 

[BrickTop]

Unless you are a 20+ year captain pushing big metal in top 10% of your senority list at a major, expect "NOTHING" from ALPA. USELESS!

 

[BoilerUP]

All info from ALPA website

LOL insurance:

ALPA is proud to offer Loss of License/Plus Coverage for pilots. We understand the nature of your life, and the importance of your license for your livelihood. As your colleagues, we want to make sure that you'll remain financially secure if you should ever lose your license. As pilots, we owe it to our families to have adequate Loss of License coverage.
No one knows better than pilots that in the event of a disability we can't count on our airlines to make up the financial difference. Many airline employee benefit plans have a definition of disability that is not satisfied simply by the loss of your license.
Coverage from the association that represents you, can help make up the difference. As an ALPA member, you know we understand your unique needs as a pilot. From representation in Washington to aviation safety programs, you trust the services we provide - and the ALPA Loss of License/Plus Coverage is just one of many affordable plans you can benefit from as a member.

If you're under the age of 27, an each $600 of monthly LOL benefit will cost $57 annually up to $3600/mo. At age 35 it costs $102 per $600/mo benefit, and at 40 that price increases to $171.

The Loss of License plan pays monthly benefits for loss of license due to covered physical or mental disabilities. Benefits commence 12 months after the date of disability and continue during disability for up to 48 months. Disabilities incurred after you reach age 57 have the following maximum benefit duration:

Lump-Sum LOL Insurance:

ALPA Lump Sum Loss of License Insurance is designed to help pilots at a time when they really need it. Losing your license to fly can be a devastating event, leaving you with no other way to support your family. This plan can provide up to $150,000* lump sum cash in your hands when you and your family may need it most.

• ALPA Lump Sum Loss of License Insurance offers you a new way of taking care of your responsibilities.
• After a waiting period of the latter of 1) 12 months from your date of disability or 2) 270 days from the date of your notification to ALPA that you have experienced a disability you may receive a large up-front payment that you can use to go back to school, start a business, or otherwise make up for the loss of income.

This is especially necessary for pilots because of the unique character of the work. The training is intense and very specialized. There just isn't another field you can slide easily into.
With the ALPA Lump Sum Loss of License Insurance, you have the opportunity to get back on your feet, without a financial calamity befalling you and your family.
*To a maximum of 2.5 times annual airline compensation

If you're under the age of 30, each $50k of lump-sum LOL will cost you $101 annually up to a maximum of $150,000 of benefit. 30-34 its $202 per $50k, and 35-39 that figure changes to $259.

First-time Apprentice members are automatically enrolled in the Plan at the $25,000 benefit level. This coverage is effective on the first day of the month following ALPA Membership & Council Services Department's receipt of a completed, signed and LEC-approved application for membership. This benefit is provided to the first-time Apprentice Member at no cost, until the completion of probationary employment. Thereafter, the coverage amount increases to $50,000 and premiums are required from the member to continue this coverage.

Exclusions and Limitations You Need to Understand

A Disability does not include an injury or sickness resulting from one or more of the following:

(a) intentional self-inflicted injuries or attempted suicide;

(b) any criminal act committed by you;

(c) disability due to act of war, declared or undeclared, invasion, acts of foreign enemies, hostilities (whether war is declared or not), civil war, riots, civil commotions, rebellions, insurrection or military or usurped power; provided however, that this exclusion does not apply to a disability incurred during active full-time airline employment;

(d) military service in the armed forces of any state, province, country or international authority, except if such military service does not involve interruption of active full-time airline employment;

(e) disability due to any injury or sickness which commences within the first two (2) years after the effective date of your initial or increased coverage, if such disability is caused or contributed to by an injury, sickness or condition for which you received care or treatment during the 12 months prior to such effective date;

(f) a period during which you continue employment with an airline as a flight deck operating crew member holding a Class II medical certificate; or

(g) a period of disability which is caused or contributed to by chemical dependency or chemical abuse such as, but not limited to alcoholism, drug abuse (including the taking of a prescribed or controlled drug in a manner not prescribed by a physician) or drug addiction (including the use of any hallucinogen). However, if you enter an Approved Rehabilitation Program within 90 days of the date disability begins, you will be considered Disabled as of the date of the disability. If you enter an Approved Rehabilitation Program more than 90 days after the date of the disability, you will be considered Disabled as of the date you enter an Approved Rehabilitation Program. In order to continue to be eligible for benefits under the Plan, you must continue to actively cooperate and participate in all aspects of the Approved Rehabilitation Program, or provide the Plan Administrator with satisfactory proof that you cannot be rehabilitated after completion of the Approved Rehabilitation Program.

For qualifying disabilities subject to this limitation, the maximum benefit payable is 25% of the Principal Sum.

(h) laser vision correction surgery. (Does not apply if the surgery was performed to treat a disabling condition.)

(i) mental and nervous disorders as a cause of loss are paid at 50% benefit.

(j) disabilities covered under this plan are anticipated to last at least 36 months. If your medical certificate is restored less than 36 months from your benefit payment date, you may be required to return a pro rata portion of the benefit payment.

(k) a medical disability for which your FAA Medical Certificate has not been denied.

 

[BoilerUP]

I personally carry $50k lump-sum and $1200 monthly LOL coverage.

 

[Soverytired]

Short answer is this:

1. IMHO: ALPA legal services are a joke (or were for me). Others report better results.

2. Your loss of license insurance is EXTRA, it is not covered by your dues. This may actually be a good investment, depending on your age, health, etc.

However, you don't have to vote ALPA on the property to be able to buy it. Numerous insurance companies offer it.

 

[KingNothing]

ALPA isnt concerned with those issues at all. They would rather stand behind podiums and pound their shoes, while making their groups take pay cuts and terrible QOL. And then tell you it makes sense for the next negotiations in 2013. Ever notice anyone involved with ALPA speaks and shouts at the rally?

 

[BoilerUP]

They would rather stand behind podiums and pound their shoes, while making their groups take pay cuts and terrible QOL.

Uh...ALPA didn't "make" anybody take anything. Every concessionary agreement at the legacy carriers was ratified by its respective pilot group. If those pilots didn't like what was negotiated, they were free to vote it down.

God forbid folks lose their apathy and take some responsiblity for their career...

 

[Troutbait]

AOPA not ALPA

You might check out AOPA's Legal Service program. It is $29 a year. A YEAR! They have the same type of lawyers and your membership helps many, many pilots. Just a thought because this service is for FAA legal action and medial issues.

• Airspace incursions and other FAA violations
• Aircraft accidents involving you or any aircraft you own
• Aircraft purchase/sale agreements
• Alcohol and drug testing related to flight activities
• FAA medical certification matters
• Review of aircraft rental and leaseback agreements
• Review of hangar and tiedown agreements
• U.S. Customs enforcement matters

 

[www.]

looking for info and not rhetoric or flames about alpa.

2 scenarios.

1-a pilot is involved in an incident, accident or whatever and the FAA seeks certificate action against him. he's an honest guy who made an honest mistake (ie: crossed and active runway, his FO struck a wing on landing or something similar). The company decides to fire him. what legal services would ALPA provide? is there a limit? how do they decide whether or not an attorney will be provided?

2-a pilot loses his medical (develops heart condition, eyes go bad, whatever.) he is no longer able to qualify for a medical, so he loses his job. what benefit would ALPA pay to this pilot, and for how long?

Under the current system at ASA two things take place. A grievance by the pilot is filed for the termination pilot AND ALPA atty will sit down with the FAA.

Grievance process... meeting with the company to find out all the facts of the violation and ALPA does their own investigation. ALPA safety works with the group to see if there have been any other such problems like this at this location etc..

If pilot is not put back to work, then it goes to System Board where both sides, ALPA atty and company, talk about the issue and try to find some common ground. Usually, but not always, able to bring pilot back to work with some items....retraining etc...

If not resolved at System Board then the case will be put before an Arbitrator for binding arbitration.

FAA...this has a great deal to do with the relationship on a local level between the FAA and the ALPA atty.
There have been several times that the two work together to find and resolve issues that arise. ALPA atty will handle this for you.

As for the medical...if the pilot has elected the Loss of License Insur. then he would be covered under the policy. As for the FAA, ALPA Medical in Denver is the best. They work with the FAA on thousands of medical cases to find what it will take to get his medical back. The doctors in Denver know about the latest treatments and procedures and can point you in the right direction and will work with your AME.

PM me if I can help.

 

[120% Torque]

You might check out AOPA's Legal Service program. It is $29 a year. A YEAR! They have the same type of lawyers and your membership helps many, many pilots. Just a thought because this service is for FAA legal action and medial issues.

• Airspace incursions and other FAA violations
• Aircraft accidents involving you or any aircraft you own
• Aircraft purchase/sale agreements
• Alcohol and drug testing related to flight activities
• FAA medical certification matters
• Review of aircraft rental and leaseback agreements
• Review of hangar and tiedown agreements
• U.S. Customs enforcement matters

You might want to do your research on this a little more before selling it as "similar to what Alpa offers". I signed up for this when I was a CFI, had a legal issue. I was told the legal services in the form a of an alpa paid attorney dont kick in until after you are convicted and have "exhausted all other resources". The attorney advice I got over the phone was some kid who just barely graduated from law school, building his resume working for Aopa. Not even in the ballpark compared to what Alpa offers. You get what you pay for but then again an intelligent person would understand you arent going to get much for $29 a year or even their slightly more expensive ATP plan which is what I had.

 

[PCL_128]

looking for info and not rhetoric or flames about alpa.

2 scenarios.

1-a pilot is involved in an incident, accident or whatever and the FAA seeks certificate action against him. he's an honest guy who made an honest mistake (ie: crossed and active runway, his FO struck a wing on landing or something similar). The company decides to fire him. what legal services would ALPA provide? is there a limit? how do they decide whether or not an attorney will be provided?

WWW. provided a good explanation as to how this works. Basically, there's no limit. The attorneys will work with you on the grievance all the way through to arbitration. They'll also deal with the FAA when necessary.

The guy who posted about AOPA obviously doesn't understand what he's talking about. AOPA members only receive a free consultation from legal. They don't receive free legal help beyond that. It's all extra. ALPA provides all of it for free for members on active status.

 

[Gr82Aviate]

You might want to do your research on this a little more before selling it as "similar to what Alpa offers". I signed up for this when I was a CFI, had a legal issue. I was told the legal services in the form a of an alpa paid attorney dont kick in until after you are convicted and have "exhausted all other resources". The attorney advice I got over the phone was some kid who just barely graduated from law school, building his resume working for Aopa. Not even in the ballpark compared to what Alpa offers. You get what you pay for but then again an intelligent person would understand you arent going to get much for $29 a year or even their slightly more expensive ATP plan which is what I had.

The problem here is you said "an intelligent person would understand"...thus all the anti-ALPA zealots that keep spewing their lies and propaganda!

 

[Troutbait]

Before you start your usual attacks and calling names, you should research their services a bit. They give free consultation to general members, but they do have a dedicated lawyer service to help you, if you pay for their legal service. I know, my cousin flies cargo and received help from an AOPA lawyer with a mistake he made out in California. They did help him and he still flies. He does pay for the service, but did get legal help. It is more than a magazine. I am not fully endorsing their services, because I don't get paid to do so, but there are other options. The ASAP program is also there to help. Skywest doesn't just hang it pilots out to dry, regardless of what you pro-ALPA heros say.

 

[USCtrojan]

Under the current system at ASA two things take place. A grievance by the pilot is filed for the termination pilot AND ALPA atty will sit down with the FAA.

Grievance process... meeting with the company to find out all the facts of the violation and ALPA does their own investigation. ALPA safety works with the group to see if there have been any other such problems like this at this location etc..

If pilot is not put back to work, then it goes to System Board where both sides, ALPA atty and company, talk about the issue and try to find some common ground. Usually, but not always, able to bring pilot back to work with some items....retraining etc...

If not resolved at System Board then the case will be put before an Arbitrator for binding arbitration.

FAA...this has a great deal to do with the relationship on a local level between the FAA and the ALPA atty.
There have been several times that the two work together to find and resolve issues that arise. ALPA atty will handle this for you.

As for the medical...if the pilot has elected the Loss of License Insur. then he would be covered under the policy. As for the FAA, ALPA Medical in Denver is the best. They work with the FAA on thousands of medical cases to find what it will take to get his medical back. The doctors in Denver know about the latest treatments and procedures and can point you in the right direction and will work with your AME.

PM me if I can help.

ALPA Medical is AWESOME. My buddy lost his Medical a few years ago due to some cardiovascular complications. He was taken off-line without pay. He worked through his personal health issues successfully and with the help of the ALPA Doctor got back on-line. There is a whole process to getting back on-line if you lose your Medical. The Doctor (I can't remember his name--Harvard grad very well known in the ALPA ranks), puts together a packet for you, and submits and re-submits based on what the FAA needs/wants to see. You could never do this on your own or just with a "local Doctor." The FAA is a beauracracy and god forbid you ever lose your Medical. Hopefully you all get a chance to attend an ALPA Conference. A lot of the different areas are covered and gone into detail by the individuals that head up each Committee. Hearing the Doctor's presentation about how he gets ALPA pilots back online was very impressive.

If you want to hear a personal account of it PM me and I'll put you in contact with my buddy. He's very proud of ALPA Medical and knows he wouldn't be flying the line today without it.

Trojan

 

[www.]

The ASAP program is also there to help.

And who represents the pilots in your ASAP program?

I have a question for you...What group of people were able to use their resources to help in the investigation, that lead to finding the faults in the E120 prop, of the ASA BQK crash?

Was it ASA MGMT?

Was it AOPA?

Was it ALPA?

Was it the Pep Boys, Manny Moe and Jack?