For Those About to Vote/Not Vote ALPA At SkyWest...

[120% Torque]

Making contracts when things are good is not when alpo should be judged. It is when things are bad! alpo gets an F!!! Did skyw take a pay cut...EVER!
GO alpo?

Yes, while skywest management inked very lucrative deals that would fill the company cauffers and allow them to buy other airlines they removed COLA from the pay scales making an effective pay cut. To quote from a friend of mine on this subject:

The difference is when you look at 7-Year Pay Wage WITHOUT COLA ($67.94) vs. 7-YEAR pay WITH COLA ($83.52). The Difference = $15.58/hr. Or $15,580 annually (based on a 1000 hour flying year). This is the BUYING POWER you are giving up! This $15,580 in COLA is just so you can buy the same Starbucks Lattes, groceries for your family, gas for your car, etc. during the next 7 years. I can GUARANTEE the prices of these things will ALL raise at the rate of the CPI (Consumer Price Index) or more during the next 7 years. This $15,580 is JUST TO KEEP UP with the CPI.

Your ANNUAL RAISE (per se) for Experience and Longevity is wiped out by NOT having COLA. In fact, you will be working for the same (Buying Power Wage) 7 years from now as you are today. (Actually a bit less).

I'll make it even more simple. I'll give you a job today, but don't expect a raise for the next 7 years. In fact, you actually have to take a $0.23/hr PAY CUT every year for the next 7 years for the priviledge of me hiring you today.

BTW, COLA is not a fixed number, it fluctuates based upon the CPI. I used an average. Next year is projected to be around 3.1% (could be more . . .could be less)

So YES Skywest pilots DID take a pay cut when they were forced out of COLA which was in place when I was hired.

 

[difete]

I was greeted today in SFO by ALPA reps. They said that in checking all the records, they found that SKYWEST has fired more pilots in the month of July 2007 than ASA has done throughout the whole year till then.

I have two friends that have gotten fired from Skywest. Both with not so big of issues to be fired by. My major concern is job protection, and a legal binding contract that stands legally in a court of law, that policy manual means nothing to anyone.

I know of two pilots that were unfairly fired by Skywest, and were only able to get their jobs back because they had to spend the cash on individual lawyers.

We are all "probationary" pilots as long as we all abide by a policy manual, and not a contract.

 

[JoeMerchant]

Yes, while skywest management inked very lucrative deals that would fill the company cauffers and allow them to buy other airlines they removed COLA from the pay scales making an effective pay cut. To quote from a friend of mine on this subject:

The difference is when you look at 7-Year Pay Wage WITHOUT COLA ($67.94) vs. 7-YEAR pay WITH COLA ($83.52). The Difference = $15.58/hr. Or $15,580 annually (based on a 1000 hour flying year). This is the BUYING POWER you are giving up! This $15,580 in COLA is just so you can buy the same Starbucks Lattes, groceries for your family, gas for your car, etc. during the next 7 years. I can GUARANTEE the prices of these things will ALL raise at the rate of the CPI (Consumer Price Index) or more during the next 7 years. This $15,580 is JUST TO KEEP UP with the CPI.

Your ANNUAL RAISE (per se) for Experience and Longevity is wiped out by NOT having COLA. In fact, you will be working for the same (Buying Power Wage) 7 years from now as you are today. (Actually a bit less).

I'll make it even more simple. I'll give you a job today, but don't expect a raise for the next 7 years. In fact, you actually have to take a $0.23/hr PAY CUT every year for the next 7 years for the priviledge of me hiring you today.

BTW, COLA is not a fixed number, it fluctuates based upon the CPI. I used an average. Next year is projected to be around 3.1% (could be more . . .could be less)

So YES Skywest pilots DID take a pay cut when they were forced out of COLA which was in place when I was hired.

Good points......

However...... even at ALPA carriers, you don't get "COLA"..... The new ASA TA gives 700 pilots a 1% raise. This is a 1% raise after 5 years.... Hardly COLA....

Every one else is only getting 1% per year even though inflation is much more, and like to increase....

Voting in ALPA doesn't guarantee you COLA.... in fact, most ALPA carriers haven't gotten COLA increases and many have taken paycuts.....

 

[Rez O. Lewshun]

I didn't know you were asking me questions, what is it you would like to know?

I am sure you didn't know...

Reply, by quoting, to posts

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74-77
79
84
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111


If you can....

 

[Rez O. Lewshun]

Its amazing that these kids will spend 10's of thousands of dollars to be professional airline pilots, go to Skywest, and be subjected to the whim of managment for life. How can you justify that type of investment only to be fired cause management wants to make a problem go away (IOW not accept responsibility...)

Amazing...

 

[SkyNation]

difete,

please PM me with info on all of these firings.

In my own research talking to CPs, SkyWest fires about 5-7 pilots PER YEAR, including the retards who've been busted for alcohol. The others are for not passing probationary rides, IOE, etc.

 

[Gr82Aviate]

Making contracts when things are good is not when alpo should be judged. It is when things are bad! alpo gets an F!!! Did skyw take a pay cut...EVER!
GO alpo?

Um, yeah...we've been taking a pay cut every year since they took away our annual COLA(7 years and locked in with our great 0 or 1% for another 4)!!!!

 

[difete]

So let me say this here, cause I really need to vent:

Is SAPA closing PICs as fast as they can to publish PIC resolutions as a success story to the pilot group?

I have two PICs were nothing was resolved or any Policy was revised or changed to benefit neither the pilot group, nor myself.

Here are both of my PICS:

PIC ID#204 filed 7/18/2006
Issue: Violations of Company Policy Manual SP73 FMLA and seniority protection.

Resolution: (keep in mind it was pending for more than a year)
SAPA writes: "We have been informed that not one pilot was awarded SLC prior to the submitter being award SLC."

In other words I filed a complaint based on a lie. I was a lier, no one went over my seniority in this case. After more than a year and this is the best SAPA can do for this policy violation?????

Better yet, they have posted this PIC as a SAPA resolved PIC... One more victory for SAPA!!! Hurray!!!

PIC ID 167 filed 3/3/2006
Issue: Honoring managment's "recorded" voicemail assuring me of a class date, and then rearranging pilot standing electronic bids to keep me in DEN as an FO for a longer period of time. Violation of SP323(3)(4e.)

Resolution: Sapa states, "In recent correlation with Crew Support, it was determined that the submitter has been awarded his desired class date."

So since I got the award a month later, it means that their word is worthless??????????

SAPA, you have done nothing for me as an individual, but given managment an upper hand to violate their self impose "Policies". If I were to fly their planes with the same recklessness as they and you deal with me and the rest of the pilot group concerning our work rules, I think safety would be at a stake!!!

The lack of seriusness in your organization, and your lack of professionalism throughout your "Presidential Clowning" has let me no choice but to look to another stronger, and "Lawfull" way of representation.

I hereby exercise my right to vent (Free Speech),

Good day gentlemen,

Difete

 

[Gr82Aviate]

I was greeted today in SFO by ALPA reps. They said that in checking all the records, they found that SKYWEST has fired more pilots in the month of July 2007 than ASA has done throughout the whole year till then.

I have two friends that have gotten fired from Skywest. Both with not so big of issues to be fired by. My major concern is job protection, and a legal binding contract that stands legally in a court of law, that policy manual means nothing to anyone.

I know of two pilots that were unfairly fired by Skywest, and were only able to get their jobs back because they had to spend the cash on individual lawyers.

We are all "probationary" pilots as long as we all abide by a policy manual, and not a contract.

Sadly, the list is a lot longer than your 2 friends...

 

[Gr82Aviate]

I do not have alot of background about the bucket system but there are reps that do.


As for PBS, the pilot group did actually initiate the move. I know all of you wont believe this, but the PBS program was started for pilot QOL. Get a running start for the dog pile, but that is the where it got iit's start. What some of oyu don't realize is that there pilots that spend tons of their own time to enhance the PBS system.

It's funny, I don't remember ever being involved with "initiating PBS", or even being asked if I wanted it... as for QOL, I without a doubt did better with hard lines on both pay and days off!

 

[difete]

I dont remember working 6 days in a row, one day off and six days in a row again during hard lines.

 

[rtmcfi]

difete,

please PM me with info on all of these firings.

In my own research talking to CPs, SkyWest fires about 5-7 pilots PER YEAR, including the retards who've been busted for alcohol. The others are for not passing probationary rides, IOE, etc.

I would imagine some of those that are let go for not passing checkrides etc, may fail those rides due to pissing off someone in the training department or managment.

 

[120% Torque]

Good points......

However...... even at ALPA carriers, you don't get "COLA"..... The new ASA TA gives 700 pilots a 1% raise. This is a 1% raise after 5 years.... Hardly COLA....

Every one else is only getting 1% per year even though inflation is much more, and like to increase....

Voting in ALPA doesn't guarantee you COLA.... in fact, most ALPA carriers haven't gotten COLA increases and many have taken paycuts.....

You missed the point. Skywest pilots already HAD COLA in place back from the good old days when management really did keep Skywest pilots top of the industry. Sapa gave COLA away without so much as a batted eye and forgot to ask the pilots they represent if that would be ok, which of course it wouldnt be. This has been an ongoing trend for five plus years at Skywest under the reigns of Sapa.

 

[Rez O. Lewshun]

difete,

please PM me with info on all of these firings.

In my own research talking to CPs, SkyWest fires about 5-7 pilots PER YEAR, including the retards who've been busted for alcohol. The others are for not passing probationary rides, IOE, etc.

Your own research? Talking? Research requires documentation! Did you attend college? Take a science course?

In addition, you asked the hangman how many he's hung? Don't you think your "research" will be skewed? That is like asking saddam how many he has killed!

 

[Morning Wood]

I was greeted today in SFO by ALPA reps. They said that in checking all the records, they found that SKYWEST has fired more pilots in the month of July 2007 than ASA has done throughout the whole year till then.

I have two friends that have gotten fired from Skywest. Both with not so big of issues to be fired by. My major concern is job protection, and a legal binding contract that stands legally in a court of law, that policy manual means nothing to anyone.


We are all "probationary" pilots as long as we all abide by a policy manual, and not a contract.

Exactly how many were fired at SkyWest and how many were fired at ASA and what
were they fired for?

Sadly, the list is a lot longer than your 2 friends...

What do you guys consider fire able offenses?

 

[Morning Wood]

I would imagine some of those that are let go for not passing checkrides etc, may fail those rides due to pissing off someone in the training department or managment.

Then why don't they throw the book at all the people on the OC and set them up to fail so they can be fired when they come for a checkride? Do you want your familiy on airplanes flown by people who are not passing checkrides or any other part of the training?

 

[pookie]

Then why don't they throw the book at all the people on the OC and set them up to fail so they can be fired when they come for a checkride? Do you want your familiy on airplanes flown by people who are not passing checkrides or any other part of the training?

I assume that UAL, Delta, Northwest, Mesaba, ASA, Pinnacle..etc dont want to have passengers on their airplane with pilots that dont pass their checkrides either. But the respected companies have worked with their unions to improve training events to ensure that individuals are given the necessary additional training to make for better captains.

Have you ever questioned the training department and maybe believe it was the training department's fault or training material that caused the failure? Do you have a group that can question the training department? So you support the termination of pilots? Thanks for looking after the interests of the pilots?

 

[Morning Wood]

I assume that UAL, Delta, Northwest, Mesaba, ASA, Pinnacle..etc dont want to have passengers on their airplane with pilots that dont pass their checkrides either. But the respected companies have worked with their unions to improve training events to ensure that individuals are given the necessary additional training to make for better captains.

Have you ever questioned the training department and maybe believe it was the training department's fault or training material that caused the failure? Do you have a group that can question the training department? So you support the termination of pilots? Thanks for looking after the interests of the pilots?

Questioned the training department, absolutely. But the person I responded to implied that people are failing training or checkrides because someone in management or the training dept has it out for them. I find it hard to believe that that is only reason people are not getting thru training with the number of pilots (both newhires and existing) that have training every year and pass. Most that don't are given additional training in one form or another.

I do not support the termination of pilots, but don't be so naive that you think that every pilot who gets fired is a victim and is not guilty of what they are fired for.

 

[pookie]

I do not support the termination of pilots, but don't be so naive that you think that every pilot who gets fired is a victim and is not guilty of what they are fired for.

True, but every person terminated needs to have an independent review process with the best available protection and resources. Would you not agree?

 

[pookie]

I could be wrong but i dont think that SAPA can legally represent you in a hearing. Remember that you are only as good as your last flight. Do you really want to wager your career on that possibility?