SWA to England?

[Truckdriver]

IDave Neeleman would sell you out if he had to. I am not saying he will, but if it were in his best interests for some reason, he would do it and move back to SLC and hide in the mountains.


Bye Bye--General Lee

I know the mountains around SLC fairly good so he would have a hard time hiding from me!! I think that clause, if indeed true, will be more of a feel good thing to keep more B6 guys from jumping ship. The lawyers are saying it is "Iron Clad". It would be fun to see how something like that held up in court after a buyout. If it held up, I would end up being at around 50% on the 737/MD-88 FO list at Delta

 

[General Lee]

I know the mountains around SLC fairly good so he would have a hard time hiding from me!! I think that clause, if indeed true, will be more of a feel good thing to keep more B6 guys from jumping ship. The lawyers are saying it is "Iron Clad". It would be fun to see how something like that held up in court after a buyout. If it held up, I would end up being at around 50% on the 737/MD-88 FO list at Delta

I don't know if any of that could happen if there was a buyout, and ALPA wouldn't just fall over and allow it. But, I think we would be happy to give you DOH. Everyone seems to want DOH (USAir vs AWA for example), so I think we wouldn't mind giving you that. See, everyone wins!!


Bye Bye---General Lee

 

[The Victors]

Not europe. caribean. If spirit can do it, then so can swa. then swa will buy westjet and go north

 

[The Victors]

I shouldn't try to spell at 1 am

 

[CF34-3B1]

You guys are missing the point I think.

If SWA goes to Europe why do you think it would be in a 737 with no IFE out of ISP or LBB?

ISP's 737 International service will probably be limited to Canada, Mexico and the Islands.

 

[General Lee]

You guys are missing the point I think.

If SWA goes to Europe why do you think it would be in a 737 with no IFE out of ISP or LBB?

ISP's 737 International service will probably be limited to Canada, Mexico and the Islands.

Or, about the range of a full 737-700 on a 7006 ft runway.

Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[Truckdriver]

I don't know if any of that could happen if there was a buyout, and ALPA wouldn't just fall over and allow it. But, I think we would be happy to give you DOH. Everyone seems to want DOH (USAir vs AWA for example), so I think we wouldn't mind giving you that. See, everyone wins!!


Bye Bye---General Lee

Come on General, that is basically a staple except for the top 150 or so. I'm sure you would be happy to give us DOH. If the merger protection language is as "iron clad" as the lawyers here are saying it is, the only recourse ALPA would have is to tell Delta that if they buy us and merge us via a ratio, then they will strike. The only option Delta would have is to not buy us or convince ALPA this would be all O.K. Like I said, I'm not sure how "iron clad" it would be since I know nothing about law and how contracts hold up in court during situations like this. I do think it would give us a leg to stand on in court to fight for something better than DOH.

 

[General Lee]

Come on General, that is basically a staple except for the top 150 or so. I'm sure you would be happy to give us DOH. If the merger protection language is as "iron clad" as the lawyers here are saying it is, the only recourse ALPA would have is to tell Delta that if they buy us and merge us via a ratio, then they will strike. The only option Delta would have is to not buy us or convince ALPA this would be all O.K. Like I said, I'm not sure how "iron clad" it would be since I know nothing about law and how contracts hold up in court during situations like this. I do think it would give us a leg to stand on in court to fight for something better than DOH.

If the lawyers put in there "in the event of a merger or takover, every Jetblue employee gets $5 million and ice cream for 2 years.." Do you think that would be enforceable to? They could put anything they want into that to try to make it a poison pill, and it doesn't mean it would work. If we do aquire you, don't expect much. Delta would rather staple you and make their own non-union employees feel good (stews, gate people, etc) rather than see turmoil. This is all speculation, and therefore good to talk about. You never know.


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[Truckdriver]

If the lawyers put in there "in the event of a merger or takover, every Jetblue employee gets $5 million and ice cream for 2 years.." Do you think that would be enforceable to? They could put anything they want into that to try to make it a poison pill, and it doesn't mean it would work. If we do aquire you, don't expect much. Delta would rather staple you and make their own non-union employees feel good (stews, gate people, etc) rather than see turmoil. This is all speculation, and therefore good to talk about. You never know.


Bye Bye--General Lee

If they did say that we all got $5 million and ice cream if we didn't get ratioed in, then it would not be a good deal for Delta to buy us if they planned on not integrating us via a ratio. It is a route that nobody has seen in this industry yet and it would be interesting to see how it all worked out. We all know that the ALPA merger policy is anything but predictable. Maybe something like this could actually protect the employees of a company that is bought. The only thing I ask is to have my career expectations somewhat protected. I started at B6 knowing I would be a senior FO lineholder within 18 months and a Captain on a narrowbody within 6 years. I want to have days off and a predictable schedule to spend time with my kids while they are young. I don't want to be stapled to the bottom of the DAL list and be on reserve for the next 5 years and have crappy schedules. Put me on the list as a lineholder on the MD-88 or 737 and I'm happy. You can fence me off the widebodies for a decade if you want and I won't care.

 

[General Lee]

If they did say that we all got $5 million and ice cream if we didn't get ratioed in, then it would not be a good deal for Delta to buy us if they planned on not integrating us via a ratio. It is a route that nobody has seen in this industry yet and it would be interesting to see how it all worked out. We all know that the ALPA merger policy is anything but predictable. Maybe something like this could actually protect the employees of a company that is bought. The only thing I ask is to have my career expectations somewhat protected. I started at B6 knowing I would be a senior FO lineholder within 18 months and a Captain on a narrowbody within 6 years. I want to have days off and a predictable schedule to spend time with my kids while they are young. I don't want to be stapled to the bottom of the DAL list and be on reserve for the next 5 years and have crappy schedules. Put me on the list as a lineholder on the MD-88 or 737 and I'm happy. You can fence me off the widebodies for a decade if you want and I won't care.

I understand, and it is not up to me anyway. Who knows if this would ever play out anyway. I really don't know of any case where a non union entity made something enforceable for a ratio at a new company. Sounds murky to me. I don't think it would hold up honestly. But, you never know. And, if it did happen, you would not be a junior MD88 FO for 5 years. We would probably expand a lot, and there would be fences and growth. This is all an exercise in speculation, which I enjoy.


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[Reebo]

You guys are missing the point I think.

If SWA goes to Europe why do you think it would be in a 737 with no IFE out of ISP or LBB?

ISP's 737 International service will probably be limited to Canada, Mexico and the Islands.

True..

 

[Reebo]

Or, about the range of a full 737-700 on a 7006 ft runway.

Bye Bye--General Lee

Which is farther than you think!

 

[Truckdriver]

I understand, and it is not up to me anyway. Who knows if this would ever play out anyway. I really don't know of any case where a non union entity made something enforceable for a ratio at a new company. Sounds murky to me. I don't think it would hold up honestly. But, you never know. And, if it did happen, you would not be a junior MD88 FO for 5 years. We would probably expand a lot, and there would be fences and growth. This is all an exercise in speculation, which I enjoy.


Bye Bye--General Lee

It sounds murky to me also. The only thing that has me wondering is that there has never been a non-union airline that has had a legal agreement between the individual pilot and company that was signed and binding like we do at JetBlue. This clause is in that agreement that is signed by both parties. If one party being JetBlue management says they will sell to Delta and one condition of the sale is all the agreements between us and our pilots will be honored, they will have to honor it according to our lawyers. Neeleman has said that this agreement will be honored in the event of a sale and being the guy he is, I tend to believe him. This type of merger protection has never been seen in this industry and it looks at face value to be better than any I have seen. However, you never know until it happens and all the lawyers get done with the deal. On a side note, I'm still working the contacts at DAL and would probably come on over if they ever hire me. I'm not sure if they will ever hire any B6 guys, but I would love to live in SLC and not commute. I'd take my chances at the bottom of the Delta list so that shows how much I think any of this will actually happen. However, crazier things have happned so it's good to think about it a little.

 

[General Lee]

Which is farther than you think!

Give me some examples. (full of pax, with fuel reserves going to stormy England or Ireland, taking off on that 7006 ft runway). A BBJ can do it with 10 super rich pax, and Private Air can do it from EWR with 50 pax.


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[General Lee]

It sounds murky to me also. The only thing that has me wondering is that there has never been a non-union airline that has had a legal agreement between the individual pilot and company that was signed and binding like we do at JetBlue. This clause is in that agreement that is signed by both parties. If one party being JetBlue management says they will sell to Delta and one condition of the sale is all the agreements between us and our pilots will be honored, they will have to honor it according to our lawyers. Neeleman has said that this agreement will be honored in the event of a sale and being the guy he is, I tend to believe him. This type of merger protection has never been seen in this industry and it looks at face value to be better than any I have seen. However, you never know until it happens and all the lawyers get done with the deal. On a side note, I'm still working the contacts at DAL and would probably come on over if they ever hire me. I'm not sure if they will ever hire any B6 guys, but I would love to live in SLC and not commute. I'd take my chances at the bottom of the Delta list so that shows how much I think any of this will actually happen. However, crazier things have happned so it's good to think about it a little.

Sounds like a good plan. We are hiring now, and we will probably announce even more hiring soon. The MD90 in SLC is not very senior, and the 738 and 757/767 are not too tough to get after a couple years. We will be announcing a lot of new routes and a large aircraft order very soon (upon exit of BK around May 1st--expect a 787 order for 28-30 units, and 100 options--with arrivals starting in 2008 (we have had a phantom order with a lessor for the last couple of years)). We also may have a 100 seat order (they have been saying that for awhile), and more 737-700s and 777s are also on the way. We are coming out of BK a lot leaner ($7.5 billion in debt, down from $17 billion, while United still has $19 billion in debt), and could be worth $10 billion. It will be interesting to see what happens, but coming over here could be a good thing.


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[Quimby]

Did you go to Europe from there? We carry 162,400lbs of FUEL on our 767-300ERs to Europe. See, you are missing the point. A 737-700 or BBJ could probably make it to Europe, but at reduced pax and a lot of runway. Private Air does that, with about 50 pax and EWR's or IAH's long runways. I bet you and Gary Kelly could fly to RIO in that plane too, if it were the two of you and one stew....


Bye Bye--General Lee

So you had to throw in how much fuel that thing carries? Neat-o-mosquito. Is your ego back to normal levels now? Many a/c carry wayyy more than that....but I'm sure your neighbors are impressed.

What's next.....the potable water tank size?

 

[General Lee]

So you had to throw in how much fuel that thing carries? Neat-o-mosquito. Is your ego back to normal levels now? Many a/c carry wayyy more than that....but I'm sure your neighbors are impressed.

What's next.....the potable water tank size?

40 gallons I think. I use 20 of that each trip, lots of bowl movements.

Anything else you want to know? We are hiring lav dumpers if you want to get to know that system better.


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[Quimby]

Anything else you want to know?



Bye Bye--General Lee[/quote]




how's Lagos?

 

[Reebo]

Give me some examples. (full of pax, with fuel reserves going to stormy England or Ireland, taking off on that 7006 ft runway). A BBJ can do it with 10 super rich pax, and Private Air can do it from EWR with 50 pax.


Bye Bye--General Lee

Don't have any but i'm sure you know that the 737-700 isn't your daddy's 73.

A few examples of were we fly it are ISP-LAS, PVD-LAS, MHT-LAS, PHL-OAK, BWI-SAN, PHL-LAX. We also operate it out of MDW to the west coast at max gross of 154K on a 6000ft rwy. Other carriers use it from SAN, SNA, and OAK to Hawaii.

A previous post mentioned the -700ER model which has nice range.

Will it fly ISP-LGW, full pax with reserves? NO!!

My point is that when someone put ones of these in their posts they are usually just joking. No need to continue to beat a dead horse.

Have fun flying your 767's and I'll enjoy my little -700, even if it can't make it to Europe.

 

[General Lee]

Anything else you want to know?



Bye Bye--General Lee

how's Lagos?[/quote]

We start Lagos later this year, in December I believe. We do go from ATL to Dakar, Senegal and onto Johanesburg, and we fly from JFK to Accra, Ghana. If we pick up to 777LRs that Air India may not be able to take in the next month or so, we may shift the 767-300ER from Dakar/Joberg to JFK--Dakar--Nairobi, and do a 777LR nonstop to Joberg from ATL. Lot's of exciting things going on here. Thankfully if I were doing the INTL stuff on the 767ER (not yet), I probably wouldn't have to go to Lagos, but I might try it once to say that I did it.

How's Dayton treating you?


Bye Bye--General Lee