WSJ: Pilots Fail to Engage Jet Engines

[kf4amu]

Or you could just use the g*dd#mn checklist!

or look at the instruments every now and then

 

[PeanuckleCRJ]

This is why I hate the idiots that want to be "cool" and not say the evil word of "standard." I'm "laid back." Well, you'd better be... but you'd better at least try to be standard, too. It's not hard to do both.

No one is ever perfectly standard, but at least try your hardest to fly by the book and not be a dick about it. Is it really that hard?

 

[pilotyip]

No one is ever perfectly standard, but at least try your hardest to fly by the book and not be a dick about it. Is it really that hard?

No but if someone is not a consistent Dick, then draft away from SOP accelerates. It is a constant process. When I ride the JS and take notes I can get three pages of notes on a one leg trip, small pages, but SOP does stay in the envelope without constant herding. BTW I then put one of the pilots on the JS and then find things that I do that are not SOP. Good education process.

 

[wacoflyr]

Agreed. Checklists were invented by pilots. They work for pilots. They save pilots from pilots(themselves). There is nothing cool or ego stroking about making a mistake just because you are too lazy to use standard proceedures. The best pilots I have flown with insist on using standard, checklist backed proceedures. They insist politely, and they have my respect. Furthermore, the flight is more interesting, (because of the challenge to be as standard as possible) safer, and a whole lot more relaxing. You want to see an anxious FO? Do things in a new and novel way. Now your FO has no idea what is coming next, and is running checklists behind your back just to make sure the hotshot in the left seat has not fvcked up. Your 'personal proceedure' adds to my stress, and puts my certificate and life at risk. I'll be (politely) asking if we can run the checklist!

 

[PeanuckleCRJ]

Agreed. Checklists were invented by pilots. They work for pilots. They save pilots from pilots(themselves). There is nothing cool or ego stroking about making a mistake just because you are too lazy to use standard proceedures. The best pilots I have flown with insist on using standard, checklist backed proceedures. They insist politely, and they have my respect. Furthermore, the flight is more interesting, (because of the challenge to be as standard as possible) safer, and a whole lot more relaxing. You want to see an anxious FO? Do things in a new and novel way. Now your FO has no idea what is coming next, and is running checklists behind your back just to make sure the hotshot in the left seat has not fvcked up. Your 'personal proceedure' adds to my stress, and puts my certificate and life at risk. I'll be (politely) asking if we can run the checklist!

Bingo!

 

[pilotyip]

When Curtis LeMay took over SAC in the late 40's they experiencing a lot of accidents. In almost every case, the accident report stated that Capt. XYZ was one of the hottest pilots in the Wing. LeMay started wondering why there were so few reports of average guys crashing. After investigation it was found that the not so hot pilots used checklists, performance tables, and flew by the book. Since they were not so hot pilots they needed everything they could get their hands on to reduce the likelihood of them getting into trouble in the A/C. Flying by the LeMay book became the SAC way of doing things. I have to admit I am a wimp when it comes to checklists, I get nervous in my C-172 if I don’t do the

 

[PeanuckleCRJ]

When Curtis LeMay took over SAC in the late 40's they experiencing a lot of accidents. In almost every case, the accident report stated that Capt. XYZ was one of the hottest pilots in the Wing. LeMay started wondering why there were so few reports of average guys crashing. After investigation it was found that the not so hot pilots used checklists, performance tables, and flew by the book. Since they were not so hot pilots they needed everything they could get their hands on to reduce the likelihood of them getting into trouble in the A/C. Flying by the LeMay book became the SAC way of doing things. I have to admit I am a wimp when it comes to checklists, I get nervous in my C-172 if I don’t do the

Tonight, on Incomplete Thoughts by pilotyip...

 

[JoeMerchant]

Agreed. Checklists were invented by pilots. They work for pilots. They save pilots from pilots(themselves). There is nothing cool or ego stroking about making a mistake just because you are too lazy to use standard proceedures. The best pilots I have flown with insist on using standard, checklist backed proceedures. They insist politely, and they have my respect. Furthermore, the flight is more interesting, (because of the challenge to be as standard as possible) safer, and a whole lot more relaxing. You want to see an anxious FO? Do things in a new and novel way. Now your FO has no idea what is coming next, and is running checklists behind your back just to make sure the hotshot in the left seat has not fvcked up. Your 'personal proceedure' adds to my stress, and puts my certificate and life at risk. I'll be (politely) asking if we can run the checklist!

OK, where on the "before takeoff checklist" does it say to have both engines running? Checklists for important things are fine and dandy, but being "standard" doesn't prevent mistakes and make thing necessarily safe. How about all the "briefing" that is now "standard"....In many cases, that contributes to missing important stuff while people babble about superfolous BS.

About a third of the stuff on checklists is to keep the lawyers and cubicle folks happy...Nothing more...

 

[wacoflyr]

About a third of the stuff on checklists is to keep the lawyers and cubicle folks happy...Nothing more...

And of course, you know which third that is.... Your FO will really enjoy your explanation.

 

[pilotyip]

complete enought for most

Tonight, on Incomplete Thoughts by pilotyip...

complete enough for most poeple to follow, kinda like "923 leaving 340" I msut have spent toom uch time in college?

About a third of the stuff on checklists is to keep the lawyers and cubicle folks happy...Nothing more...

Not to mention the FAA

 

[JoeMerchant]

And of course, you know which third that is.... Your FO will really enjoy your explanation.

This thread is about not starting both engines...Does your before takeoff check have an item that addresses this?

 

[wacoflyr]

If you are working to be standard and running your checklists like you are supposed to be doing, following proceedures and fostering teamwork in the cockpit, I suspect you will get both engines started. If you are just dancing to your own tune, who knows? If your FO is good and covering your ass, he will know, of course. But he might not be.