Woman Dies on AA. Ouch!

[TWA]

Ok, before I say anything, I want everyone to know that I AM NOT an airline pilot. That being said, I have a question: Why is it such a bad thing to declare a pax dead on a flight? Just curious.

If you don't have a doctor on board, and can't declare them dead, wouldn't it be best to divert and let them officially die on the jetway? I would think that it would help keep you safe from liability because you "really didn't know" if she was dead or not.

This case sounds special because there were doctors on board. Since she did officially die, I don't think that there was any real reason to divert the flight. Oh well, she's dead, end of story.

By the way, the version I heard was the doctor on board had her on a breathing bag, and decided 02 should not be administered. Just what I heard from unconfirmed sources, disregard if necessary.

 

[Bjammin]

What is the big deal about diverting?!

I would say we have at least 1 PAX a quarter die during a TransPac and we will aboslutly divert to ANC or Japan depending on the direction of flight, no big deal.

You can not continue with a dead body in the cabin. Do you expect people to just go about reading their New York Times with a dead body in the cabin?

If you divert you are covered, no matter what. The family can't sue you for doing too little and the PAX can't sue you for emotional distress.

Let'e see some PAX try to sue the airline for not making the meeting with Joe Blow Boss with someone DEAD on board the aircraft.

CYA, period.

 

[kf4amu]

By the way, the version I heard was the doctor on board had her on a breathing bag, and decided 02 should not be administered. Just what I heard from unconfirmed sources, disregard if necessary.

Probably untrue. If a patients condition is so deteriorated they need forced ventilation, it requires 100 percent O2.

 

[J32driver]

So you divert, and you land 3 hours short of your destination and 30,000+ lbs overwieght. you land overweight, blow some tires, get a brake fire and evac the aircraft. 16 pax are injured in the evacuation and the aircraft needs a 1 million dollar inspection.

Cheers
Wino

Wow... you are really demonstrating your ignorance now!

Do you think your scenario above is what AA had planned when they were going to do the medical divert to MIA?

I would say we have at least 1 PAX a quarter die during a TransPac and we will aboslutly divert to ANC or Japan depending on the direction of flight, no big deal.

Thanks for the real world input Bjammin.

 

[Say Again Over]

J32, the bottom line is called the company COM or FOM, nothing is left to guess work, all real airlines have explicit procedures to follow. as mentioned by TWA, passengers are usually not legally deceased until the aircraft lands, in this case a medical doctor in conjunction with the Med Link made the call, at this point in time crews will notify dispatch and a collaborative decision will be made, if the decision is to continue, the Flight Attendant Manual outlines instructions for the disposition of the body.

 

[Wino]

bjammin,

What is the big deal about diverting?!

I would say we have at least 1 PAX a quarter die during a TransPac and we will aboslutly divert to ANC or Japan depending on the direction of flight, no big deal.

while I agree that several passengers die a year on the transpac operations, and aircraft are diverted, they are not "declared dead" on the aircaft. If they are and you divert, your duty day isn't long enough to continue the flight with the ensuing headaches, thus the "they died on the jetbridge" ploy. an excersize in semantics, I agree, but an important one. Ask your captain, or your dispatcher, or when you go back to recurrent.

You wind up putting em in a forward or aft galley (or in some aircraft lower level galleys, you don't leave next to the pax) But actually dead on the flight is a show stopper if actually divert. When it happens, (the crew was already dumping fuel when the doctor onboard declared em for example) its a trip to the hotel in ANC after you finally get released and either everyone waits or a new crew is flown out... Which ever can be done faster

Furthermore, 747s and 777s have the ability to dump fuel to avoid an overweight landing. Most other aircraft do not.

This is directly from boeing on overwieght landings.

Overweight landing
inspection requirements
The Boeing airplane maintenance manual (AMM )
provides a special inspection that is required any
time an overweight landing occurs, regardless of
how smooth the landing. The AMM inspection is
provided in two parts. The Phase I (or A-check)
conditional inspection looks for obvious signs of
structural distress, such as wrinkled skin, popped
fasteners, or bent components in areas which are
readily accessible. If definite signs of overstressing
are found, the Phase II (or B-check) inspection
must be performed. This is a much more detailed
inspection and requires opening access panels
to examine critical structural components. The
Phase I or A-check conditional inspection can
typically be accomplished in two to four labor​

hours.

Remember that you have duty day limitations, assuming a mechanic is ready to start a minimum 2 hour inspection before you leave, and the trouble with doing this inspection while the aircraft is in a custom's quarantine state.

So once again, who is ignorant J32?

Cheers
Wino

 

[J32driver]

So once again, who is ignorant J32?

Cheers
Wino

I'm not the one that got all dramatic and suggested we were going to wreck the airplane because of an overweight landing.

So now you've downgraded your rhetoric from a wrecked airplane to "needs a 1-2 hour inspection". That at least is back in reality.

You are arguing that the logistics are more important than the welfare of a passenger. I just don't agree with that.

For the record, I don't think I've ever said the AA crew made the wrong decision. I have said it wasn't the most conservative decision... but not the wrong decision. Read and comprehend my friend.

 

[Swede]

It's pathetic that supposed AVIATORS and professional pilots would swallow the first story, hook, line and sinker. You're the type who buys "World Daily News" and really believes Brittney carries an alien fetus, or Obama is really a genetically-altered bigfoot.

The media published it because it was sensational, not because it was true.

1) Bottles worked.
2) Defib worked.
3) Patient croaked. Doctor said so
4) "Grieving" relatives INSTANTLY thought "I just won the lotto."

Too bad a judge won't agree on point 4. Those people won't get a penny.

 

[Amish RakeFight]

Here's what two enterprising crooks did with one dead body:

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/01/09/nyregion/09dead.html

Even for the once-notorious Hell’s Kitchen neighborhood, it may have been a first: Two men were arrested on Tuesday after pushing a corpse, seated in an office chair, along the sidewalk to a check-cashing store to cash the dead man’s Social Security check, the police said.