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Why United Airlines will fail again

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calfo

Well-known member
Joined
Dec 4, 2001
Posts
204
Why United Airlines will fail again There is a plethora of financial and operational reasons why the United Airlines that exits bankruptcy early next month will soon enough be back in Chapter 11 or desperately seeking a merger to keep itself afloat.
But United Airlines will fail again primarily because it has no organizational heart, no identity and no definable brand. Most of all, it has none of the vision and discipline that separates the winners from the losers in the deregulated skies.
Consider the airlines that have had success of any meaningful duration in the last decade. There is, of course, Southwest Airlines. Whether you like what it sells is beside the point: You know and understand the product that it sells. And you know that Southwest delivers it at every seat on every flight on every route that it operates. Southwest's management and employees are fanatically devoted to its standards of simplicity and its unabashedly mass-transit approach to air travel.
Ditto JetBlue Airways. You know what you buy every time: a leather chair with decent legroom; free in-flight satellite TV and radio; a sense of casual style; and rational prices. AirTran Airways has found success because it offers a definable and recognizable product: no-frills, two-class service at simple prices. It even did the unthinkable—dump commuter flights—because they did not fit the image or the financial model. And before its corporate ego ran amok, Continental Airlines had a profitable run. Why? It crafted a demonstrably higher quality of "traditional" full-service flying and then reworked its management, crews, fleet and operations until the airline was a consistent and marketable whole.
United has done none of those things during its 38 months in Chapter 11. In a market that has proven it will only support consistency, United Airlines is a bizarre amalgam of in-flight products, fleet configurations and service concepts. It cynically tries to be all things to all fliers and careens from idea to idea, cabin to cabin and fare to fare, sometimes on a route-by-route basis.
In fact, United isn't. Not in concept or in execution. It is a disjointed collection of flights run by executives with no overarching vision, no unifying commitment and no marketing or brand discipline. In every conceivable way, United is the opposite of what works in the sky.
United will emerge from the most costly bankruptcy in American history with 26 separate in-flight seat configurations. It dabbles in everything from the upmarket p.s. service to the downmarket Ted. It slaps its name and logo on five types of narrow-body planes, four types of widebody jets and eight flavors of regional aircraft. It befuddles buyers with an ever-shifting combination of one, two, three and even four classes of in-flight service. And like all of the Big Six, its rococo fare structure is repulsive.
It is, simply put, an unholy mess competing in an unforgiving marketplace that only spares carriers with impeccable systemwide coherency.
United's intellectually slovenly approach to air travel guarantees its failure. But it's not just theory: United exits bankruptcy as a textbook example of worst-case practices. Consider:
• United's oil-price projections are fantasy. The five-year plan that United submitted to its bankruptcy court predicts annual operating profits through 2010. But its projections are based on oil selling for an average of $50 a barrel. The market price of oil is currently north of $65 a barrel. Given the growing demands of China and India and the upheavals in Iran and Nigeria, oil could be closer to $100 a barrel than $50 in the next five years. In fact, last week at the World Economic Forum in Switzerland, experts contemplated the mechanics of a global economy with $120-a-barrel oil.
• United is swimming in debt. United will exit bankruptcy saddled with about $17 billion in debt. It expects to issue about 125 million new shares under the ticker symbol UAUA. While some observers predict the stock will quickly trade higher, the opening price is likely to be about $15 a share. That gives United an equity value just shy of $2 billion and a debt-to-equity ratio of about 8.5-to-1. By comparison, American Airlines' debt ratio is deemed much too high at about 6-to-1.
• United is mortgaged to the hilt. United made public relations hay this week with its announcement that it quickly secured $3 billion in exit financing. What it didn't mention was that the loan was secured with just about every asset that United owns: fleet; spare parts; Atlantic and Pacific routes; corporate headquarters building; flight simulators; accounts receivable; and even the Mileage Plus frequent-flier program.
• United's route network is no longer admirable. The talking-head experts routinely prattle on about the peerless United Airlines route network. But, frankly, they aren't paying attention. United's Chicago hub is under constant pressure from American at O'Hare and Southwest is growing rapidly at Midway. Southwest has also returned to harass United in Denver, where Frontier Airlines is also an established competitor. Independence Air has disappeared at Washington/Dulles, but that isn't good news for United because two much stronger players, AirTran and JetBlue, are now able to make inroads there. Its Pacific routes are under pressure from some of the world's best airlines. It faces brutal competition in Latin America and Europe, too.
• United is less competitive than ever. United constantly promotes p.s., its three-class service in the New York-Los Angeles-San Francisco transcontinental triangle, as proof of its commitment to serve higher-fare, higher-profit business travelers. But United has little to offer those customers elsewhere. The p.s. concept, after 15 months, hasn't been added to any other route. Instead, United has turned huge chunks of its domestic route network over to Ted, which has no first-class service. And almost 40% of United's network fleet is now comprised of regional jets. United has equipped some of those smaller craft with first-class cabins, but those planes have generally replaced the larger jets that travelers prefer. Internationally, United has aging premium-class products that are notably inferior to the perks offered by it major competitors.
• United is stretched to the limit. United has improved its once-atrocious on-time ratings during its 38 months in bankruptcy. But those gains are constantly at risk because United has stretched its workforce to the limit. After shedding about 25,000 workers, it no longer has the capacity to cope when a few days of bad weather in Chicago or wonky computers upset daily operations. Operations nearly collapsed under the strain of both occurrences in December and United will probably be back at the bottom of the on-time ratings when December's numbers are published.
• United has no capacity to grow. Having dumped more than 100 planes in bankruptcy and deferred delivery of most of the rest of the mainline jets it ordered, United is stalled at its present size. In fact, its five-year business plan predicts no substantive capacity growth between now and 2010.
• United has a looming frequent-flier crisis. The no-growth scenario and high load factors—United currently fills almost 82%of its seats—also means that the airline will be hard-pressed to make good on all of the frequent-flier miles it uses to keep travelers loyal. Worse, it seems clear that there will be a torrent of new miles pouring into Mileage Plus. Earlier this month, United moved its credit card transaction processing to Chase, the bank that also issues the Mileage Plus credit cards. Why the switch? Chase agreed to make an advance purchase of miles equal to the hundreds of million of dollars that United must keep in reserve for credit-card refunds that would result from its grounding. That means Chase will be churning out an endless series of mileage-accrual offers that United's static capacity won't be able to easily absorb.
• United's top managers are focused on short-term gains. United's top executives recently rewarded themselves with 8% of the new airline's shares. This bonus plan, which The New York Times called "insanity squared," has another intriguing fillip: They vest with head-spinning rapidity. According to court filings, 20% vest after six months and another 20% vest after one year. Then 20% more of the shares vest in each of the next three years. Bottom line: Chief executive Glenn Tilton and his 399 top lieutenants now have a financial incentive to make the kind of short-term, shore-up-the-share-value decisions that are often incompatible with the long-term vitality of an airline.
• United's employees are angry. How would you feel if you lost your stock—United was largely employee-owned before bankruptcy—had your pension plan gutted when management dumped it on the Pension Benefit Guarantee Corp., made two rounds of salary-and-benefit concessions and then learned that the bosses rewarded themselves with a stock-bonus windfall? Now you know the state of mind of most of United's rank-and-file employees. It won't make for a lot of happy flights in the weeks and months to come.
Sadly, for all these reasons and many more, from whatever day that United officially exits bankruptcy next month, the clock will begin ticking on the next, and inevitable, crisis.
Read previous columns
Joe Brancatelli is editor and publisher of JoeSentMe.com, a website for business travelers. He is also the former executive editor of Frequent Flier magazine, travel advisor of Travel Holiday and contributing editor to Travel + Leisure. He can be reached at [email protected].
 
[• United has no capacity to grow. Having dumped more than 100 planes in bankruptcy and deferred delivery of most of the rest of the mainline jets it ordered, United is stalled at its present size. In fact, its five-year business plan predicts no substantive capacity growth between now and 2010.]


Aren't they growing the 70 seat RJ fleet?
 
A very good article. I can't believe there isn't more on Flightinfo about this!!! I wanted to puke when I read the part of the top execs taking the huge bonuses.

May United rest in peace in that great hangar in the sky....their glory days are well over with. Sure wish there was a way the government could regulate a****ho**les like glen tilton. If I was a long time employee of that horrible place, I would go postal and kill everyone of them.....hell I might even do it anyways :)

F****U******C***K****U nited

Y*********O**********U*********'**********R********E
O*********U**********T*********T*********A
H*********E**********R*********E*********!

Despite your opinions and my affiliation, getting around the language (and propriety) censor is frowned upon.

Take a week off.

UAL78
 
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Yeah-UAL should become "just like SWA" then everything will be better!

Fails to mention how ANYONE will make money at $70?
 
sewerpiper said:
A very good article. I can't believe there isn't more on Flightinfo about this!!! I wanted to puke when I read the part of the top execs taking the huge bonuses.

May United rest in peace in that great hangar in the sky....their glory days are well over with. Sure wish there was a way the government could regulate a****ho**les like glen tilton. If I was a long time employee of that horrible place, I would go postal and kill everyone of them.....hell I might even do it anyways :)

F****U******C***K****U nited

Real classy sport....and with 2300 hours! wow!
 
If I may make a few points:

UA is break-even at $67 dollars per barrel.

P.S. has seen full-fare first class bookings go up almost 40%.

Ted also makes an operational profit.

They still have like 25-40 airbusses on order.

UA's RASM is growing faster than any other carrier.

It appears to me that you are a Continental Airlines cheerleader who wants UA's Heathrow slots. I suggest you read into the numbers a little more and see what is going on.

And browsing through your post one more time, where do you get this crap about them leveraging everything they have for that loan. Its a non-secured loan, meaning that they do not give anything for the loan.
 
g-code said:
And browsing through your post one more time, where do you get this crap about them leveraging everything they have for that loan. Its a non-secured loan, meaning that they do not give anything for the loan.

Tell me, do you really think that the $3 Bil was an unsecured loan? Are you out of your mind? Looks like we have a new Village Idiot.

Repeat after me . . . . . "Duhhhhhhh. . . . . . "

Here's a quote from a Chicago Tribune article:

United faces challenges, including "high and volatile fuel prices and fierce competition from low-cost carriers in the U.S. domestic market" and a "highly leveraged financial profile," Standard & Poor's Philip Baggaley said in an analysis prepared for investors.

The Chicago Tribune article was more positive than the USA Today one, and filled with quotes from optimistic investment-banker types, all licking their chops and lining up to make some money off the deal.

http://www.chicagotribune.com/business/chi-0601100240jan10,1,1710499.story
 
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Hedging fuel costs money, Bubba. That is why so many carriers weren't able to do it . . . . they were "burning the furniture to heat the house".
 
• United is mortgaged to the hilt. United made public relations hay this week with its announcement that it quickly secured $3 billion in exit financing. What it didn't mention was that the loan was secured with just about every asset that United owns: fleet; spare parts; Atlantic and Pacific routes; corporate headquarters building; flight simulators; accounts receivable; and even the Mileage Plus frequent-flier program.

What he left out was, UAL's latest 10Q filing with the SEC states that the loan requires a minimum of $750 million of real, actual CASH on hand at all times. So the loan actually gives UAL $2.25 billion to play with NOT the $3 billion that everyone refers to. The 10Q filing also mentions the payback term is 6 years. With an average variable interest rate of approx 9%.

Currently S&P and Moodies rate UAL bond rating at B or Stable.

He also left out the fact that UAL's managers strike price is $9, so once they report earnings in 6 months (after the best period for earnings) They can cash in their 20%. If the stock does nothing Tilton's 20% is worth around a million in 6 months.
 
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I don't have a dog in this fight, but I'm not persuaded toward the author's views. Here are a few points of my own.
- He mentions different classes of service as a bad thing. The SW model works great for SW, but it's not a one size fits all solution. Most people buy their tickets on the internet these days and it's not that confusing regarding pricing; you put in your location destination and times and see what comes out. If UA has a good fare you buy it. Consumer is not confused.
- He mentions oil prices. Many people predict higher oil prices. I tend to think they're right. But many knowlegable people are predicting lower oil prices. I have no crystal ball and neither does he. We'd all have raided our retirement portfolios and put them in oil futures if we were as confident as he sounded about rising prices.
- Mortgaged to the hilt. When you owe the bank $500,000 dollars the bank owns you. When you owe the bank $5,000,000 you own the bank. The point of my little story is that big players (like GE) have waaay too much money invested in UA staying viable at this point to let them just drift away. If they were going to pull the plug they would've done it quite a while ago.
- He talks about the lack of domestic flying and the pressure put on them by SW and American. When has there not been pressure at United from American? 1920? Everyone's feeling the heat from low cost competition. But legacies have been shedding overhead costs (mostly through brutal labor concessions). And the domestic market is in shambles; it's hard for almost anyone to make money there. All the airlines are shifting more flying overseas where yields are still reasonable. And some of the flying is getting shifted to partners such as Skywest on the domestic front, I'm sure you know about the large CRJ's on order with first class configurations. Oh but that's a bad thing to have two classes or service, right?
- He criticizes United for not having enough aircraft capacity and no new orders (somebody said they had orders on Airbus, I hadn't heard that) in the same article he's criticizing their debt. In an industry with overcapacity and an airline struggling with debt could you imagine his criticism if they were buying new airplanes?
- One point I strongly agree with him on is that the company is focusing on short term gains. I don't know; maybe they have to at this point to get out of BK and take baby steps. But this sick practice of focusing on short term gains instead of long term value is endemic in corporate America and is at the center of what's wrong with a lot of things today. Why do you think that a great company like Bose wants to stay private? The airlines and United are hardly unique in this respect.
- Bitter workers? Have you flown on Delta or Northwest lately? While I jumpseated on NW a month ago I had a gate agent who was openly hostile to me and paying passengers and a flight attendent on the airplane discussed how much she hated NW during the flight. I'm not saying the situation is lucky go happy at UA but they're not unique in this cruel industry.
 
DB Cooper said:
I wonder if United will hedge fuel? If so, the $67 vs. $50 a barrel comparison is an apples and oranges comparison.

Despite what some have published or believe to be true UAL has NO FUEL HEDGED FOR 2006

This is from UAL's latest 8k SEC filing dated Jan 17, 2006

"The company expects mainline fuel price for the first quarter to average $1.92 per gallon, and for the full-year to average $1.81 per gallon (including taxes). Currently the company has no hedges in place for 2006. For the full-year 2006, the company anticipates fuel expense for mainline and the company's regional affiliates' operations will increase by approximately $885 million over its previous assumption, which was based on a mainline fuel price of $1.48 per gallon (including taxes). The previous assumptions were more fully described in the company's Updated G6 financial projections contained in Exhibit 99.1 to the Form 8-K filed with the SEC on January 17, 2006. The company expects to be able to offset some, but not all, of this increase through higher revenues."

http://app.quotemedia.com/quotetools/showFiling.go?name=UAL%20CORP%20/DE/:%208-K,%20Sub-Doc%203,%20Page%201&link=http%3A//quotemedia.10kwizard.com/filing.xml%3Frepo%3Dtenk%26ipage%3D3916596%26doc%3D3%26num%3D1

So if fuel goes up they plan on offsetting the costs by raising ticket prices not hedging fuel. You go Tilton.

Do these guys pay any attention to what is going on over at SWA? LUV does not have to raise ticket prices, they are making a profit already at current prices.
 
G4G5--Well, it's apparent that you're just a UAL basher! Shame on you. Can't you see that UAL is poised to explode from bankruptcy and regain their rightful place in the world?

I personally see a bright future for UAL and its employees--nothing in the forecast but sunshine and 75 degrees from here on out. In fact, I'm so positive about their future, I'm going to go out and get my UAL Chase card and the 1,000,000 FFB signing bonus they're offering!

(Singing: Zippity, do-dah, zippity-ay...) ;) TC
 
Enjoy Colorado, I bet you look hot in that ski suit
 
AA717driver said:
I personally see a bright future for UAL and its employees--nothing in the forecast but sunshine and 75 degrees from here on out. In fact, I'm so positive about their future,
(Singing: Zippity, do-dah, zippity-ay...) ;) TC


I heard you have an application on file so you can be a "real" airline pilot!:p


X
 
Ty Webb said:
Tell me, do you really think that the $3 Bil was an unsecured loan? Are you out of your mind? Looks like we have a new Village Idiot.

Repeat after me . . . . . "Duhhhhhhh. . . . . . "

Here's a quote from a Chicago Tribune article:


http://chicagobusiness.com/cgi-bin/news.pl?id=17564

Read this. Key words being "All debt financing". If you read other news articles you will find the word "unsecured" in there.

You should do some research before tossing out insults.
 
boeing747-800 said:
G4G5 captain...southwest just raised ticket prices you idiot!

Really, then it should be very simple for you to provide me with the link.

PS I just did a Google search " Southwest raises fares" and the last raise that Google showed was 8/2005. I assume that you have something a little more recent than 5 months ago.
 
I just skimmed the article, but it would appear there is one great big flaw in the assumption. That would be United's market share in the Pacific. It is a cash cow. If they play it right it is more than enough to sustain the company.

What all the people who cheerlead SWA, Jetblue, and Airtran fail to understand is that widebody aircraft make BIG money when properly utilized on international routes.


Typhoonpilot
 
AA717driver said:
I personally see a bright future for UAL and its employees--nothing in the forecast but sunshine and 75 degrees from here on out. In fact, I'm so positive about their future, I'm going to go out and get my UAL Chase card and the 1,000,000 FFB signing bonus they're offering!

(Singing: Zippity, do-dah, zippity-ay...) ;) TC

Not blue skies and bright future, just light at the end of the tunnel.
The last three years UAL's employees have been flying through a tornado filled squall line that's been kicking our a$$es. We may have even flown through a hurricane or two, but I don't remember finding the calm in the eye. It looks like we might be able to find a less rough patch ahead; I see AltoCu Standing Lenticular above and ahead. Flying around ACSL will be a refreshing change for us; with luck, the turbulence will only be moderate.

I hope that you and your airline find less turbulence than we've found at UAL; the ride sucks.
 
Just a couple of points --
?The exit loan is secured, it is a priority loan which leaves anyone else with a loan behind the curve.
Like most airlines, a number of things they do not controll will determine the odds --like the fuel price etc.
 
Just for G4G5 fool...

Southwest pushes through a fare hike; get ready to pay more
Southwest Airlines is raising airfares as the carrier’s exposure to high fuel prices increases, reports the Fort Worth Star-Telegram (free registration). The increases will be modest -- $3 each way for routes longer than 750 miles, $2 each way for flights between 400 to 750 miles and $1 each way on some routes shorter than 400 miles. But even given the relatively small fare hike, the Star-Telegram writes that Southwest’s increased fares “likely means higher prices for travelers who fly any airline competing with the discounter.” What’s more, the Southwest fare hike is likely to give staying power to the recent trend of steadily rising airfares. For the past several years, discount carriers have been able to dictate the fare levels -– even forcing the biggest traditional carriers to match fares or risk being undersold on competitive routes. But now that the discounters are raising fares, that frees the nation’s big carriers to do the same.
As for Southwest, the increase was the airline’s first since September, but the low-cost giant says its $299 cap on one-way fares will remain. "We have to balance our desire to be the low-fare leader with the cost pressures in front of us," says spokeswoman Beth Harbin. So why is the airline increasing fares now? The airline's fuel hedges have been reduced. The Star-Telegram writes that “last year, Southwest was shielded from most of the oil-price increases thanks to contracts that allowed it to buy fuel at cheaper rates. But some of those contracts expired at the end of 2005, reducing that protection.” And Southwest isn’t alone among discounters raising fares; JetBlue also raised fares last week, pushing its prices up $5 each way, according to the Star-Telegram. The Dallas Morning News (free registration) says other carriers, including American and Delta, have also pushed fares up by $5 each way.
 
boeing747-800 said:
Just for G4G5 fool...

Southwest pushes through a fare hike; get ready to pay more​

Southwest Airlines is raising airfares as the carrier’s exposure to high fuel prices increases, reports the Fort Worth Star-Telegram (free registration). The increases will be modest -- $3 each way for routes longer than 750 miles, $2 each way for flights between 400 to 750 miles and $1 each way on some routes shorter than 400 miles. But even given the relatively small fare hike, the Star-Telegram writes that Southwest’s increased fares “likely means higher prices for travelers who fly any airline competing with the discounter.” What’s more, the Southwest fare hike is likely to give staying power to the recent trend of steadily rising airfares. For the past several years, discount carriers have been able to dictate the fare levels -– even forcing the biggest traditional carriers to match fares or risk being undersold on competitive routes. But now that the discounters are raising fares, that frees the nation’s big carriers to do the same.
As for Southwest, the increase was the airline’s first since September, but the low-cost giant says its $299 cap on one-way fares will remain. "We have to balance our desire to be the low-fare leader with the cost pressures in front of us," says spokeswoman Beth Harbin. So why is the airline increasing fares now? The airline's fuel hedges have been reduced. The Star-Telegram writes that “last year, Southwest was shielded from most of the oil-price increases thanks to contracts that allowed it to buy fuel at cheaper rates. But some of those contracts expired at the end of 2005, reducing that protection.” And Southwest isn’t alone among discounters raising fares; JetBlue also raised fares last week, pushing its prices up $5 each way, according to the Star-Telegram. The Dallas Morning News (free registration) says other carriers, including American and Delta, have also pushed fares up by $5 each way.

Uhh...a publish date would be most appropriate.
 
bluejuice787 said:
Uhh...a publish date would be most appropriate.
No he did that on purpose. Seeing that it was just published today, he thinks he's being smart.

So smart that he forgot to check the SWA press release web site:
http://www.southwest.com/about_swa/press/prindex.html

He would have noticed that they have not announced a fare increase yet.
 
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G4G5 said:
No he did that on purpose. Seeing that it was just published today, he thinks he's being smart.

So smart that he forgot to check the SWA press release web site:
http://www.southwest.com/about_swa/press/prindex.html

He would have noticed that they have not announced a fare increase yet.

Idiot

The fare increase he is mentioning is nominal anyway by industry standards.

As much as I love my friends at United and wish them the best I very much agree with the original artical. LCCs are not simply leaner and meaner. In most cases they have started with the idea of a customer and built upon the idea of taking care of them. Someting Tilton et al know nothing about.
 
boeing747-800 said:
Just for G4G5 fool...

Southwest pushes through a fare hike; get ready to pay more​

Southwest Airlines is raising airfares as the carrier’s exposure to high fuel prices increases, reports the Fort Worth Star-Telegram (free registration). The increases will be modest -- $3 each way for routes longer than 750 miles, $2 each way for flights between 400 to 750 miles and $1 each way on some routes shorter than 400 miles. But even given the relatively small fare hike, the Star-Telegram writes that Southwest’s increased fares “likely means higher prices for travelers who fly any airline competing with the discounter.” What’s more, the Southwest fare hike is likely to give staying power to the recent trend of steadily rising airfares. For the past several years, discount carriers have been able to dictate the fare levels -– even forcing the biggest traditional carriers to match fares or risk being undersold on competitive routes. But now that the discounters are raising fares, that frees the nation’s big carriers to do the same.
As for Southwest, the increase was the airline’s first since September, but the low-cost giant says its $299 cap on one-way fares will remain.

LET ME FINISH THE PART OF THE QUOTE THAT YOU LEFT OUT:
Fares in some markets where sales are going on, such as Denver and Dallas, remain unaffected
"Such as Denver" my next question would be what other markets?

"We have to balance our desire to be the low-fare leader with the cost pressures in front of us," says spokeswoman Beth Harbin. So why is the airline increasing fares now? The airline's fuel hedges have been reduced. The Star-Telegram writes that “last year, Southwest was shielded from most of the oil-price increases thanks to contracts that allowed it to buy fuel at cheaper rates. But some of those contracts expired at the end of 2005, reducing that protection.” And Southwest isn’t alone among discounters raising fares; JetBlue also raised fares last week, pushing its prices up $5 each way, according to the Star-Telegram. The Dallas Morning News (free registration) says other carriers, including American and Delta, have also pushed fares up by $5 each way.

Just so I have this straight, SWA wil not be raising their max fare of $299, nor will their fare increase go into effect in the Denver market.

And this is good for UAL? Nice try

But a $1,2 or even $3 fare increase on non competing UAL routes is not going to solve this problem:

This is from UAL's latest 8k SEC filing dated Jan 17, 2006

"The company expects mainline fuel price for the first quarter to average $1.92 per gallon, and for the full-year to average $1.81 per gallon (including taxes). Currently the company has no hedges in place for 2006. For the full-year 2006, the company anticipates fuel expense for mainline and the company's regional affiliates' operations will increase by approximately $885 million over its previous assumption, which was based on a mainline fuel price of $1.48 per gallon (including taxes). The previous assumptions were more fully described in the company's Updated G6 financial projections contained in Exhibit 99.1 to the Form 8-K filed with the SEC on January 17, 2006. The company expects to be able to offset some, but not all, of this increase through higher revenues."

http://app.quotemedia.com/quotetools/showFiling.go?name=UAL%20CORP%20/DE/:%208-K,%20Sub-Doc%203,%20Page%201&link=http%3A//quotemedia.10kwizard.com/filing.xml%3Frepo%3Dtenk%26ipage%3D3916596%26doc%3 D3%26num%3D1

So tell me again how is UAL going to manage to increasing fares out of Denver, to cover fuel costs when SWA is not increasing fares? ? Idiot, fool?
 
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Must really suck for you in your little RJ life G4. I can't believe your obsession with all things United related. Have any of you flown on United recently? We always take care of the other airlines, we always put you in first when available (something MOST of you don't do), our service has been receiving award winning responses, our p.s. service is second to none, we still board pillows and blankets (even on Ted), we still offer economy plus seating instead of cramming you into the can like most others have gone, and we still have the incredible route structure which you all guaranteed us we would sell before emerging. So please, tell me what we're doing wrong. How I seen it, United is defining itself as the ONLY airlines that still offers amenities among the legacies.

As for $50 bbl, that's over the long term of 10 years. Right now we need $67 to break even.

Good job United. Glad to see you made it.
 
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FlyUnited said:
Must really suck for you in your little RJ life G4. I can't believe your obsession with all things United related. Have any of you flown on United recently? We always take care of the other airlines, we always put you in first when available (something MOST of you don't do), our service has been receiving award winning responses, our p.s. service is second to none, and we still have the incredible route structure which you all guaranteed us we would sell before emerging. So please, tell me what we're doing wrong.

As for $50 bbl, that's over the long term of 10 years. Right now we need $67 to break even.

Good job United. Glad to see you made it.

Playing Mr. Mom today.

I only wish the best for the UAL employees. My beef is with Tilton, I feel that he has done nothing except attack the pensions of the American worker. He was CEO of Texaco for under a year and his only claim to fame is being CEO when the company was sold to Chevron. As far as UAL, he has done nothing to impress me. Hiring expensive consultant and lawyers for countless millions, just to follow their advice does not add to his resume as a CEO.

Now it looks to me like he is trying to pull the company out of Ch11 too early just so he can cash in on his stock options. If I am pointing out UAL flaws it's not to hurt the employees but only bring to light the real problems and how little his mgt team has really done.

Good luck
 
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