What is NJ looking for?

[HUNTERB]

So I sent in an application about 1 month ago, and today I received and email stating they are looking to pursue candidates that are better matched to their current openings. I have 10000 plus hours of flying time in aircraft of which 7000 of it is MD80 time. Is it because I lack corporate time? I was just curious what others were getting interviews with or hired with for that matter.

 

[Wacopilot]

it seems that airline time is not the big value that it used to be. The 10000hr pilot now is the norm. They are looking for customer service oriented folks that happen to fly airplanes.... and have 10,000 hrs. Keep trying.

Waco

 

[lookin4better]

Actually pilots with 2503 total hours are being called, and fairly quick, it is FAR more about the customer service background than flying.

Sorry to hear though, you can always keep trying.

Good luck!

 

[lookin4better]

I just re-read my post and it sounds a little arrogant, and I appologize.

I just meant to say I think that a solid backround in customer service is ' the new 1000 hours of turbine PIC' in NJA's case. I think corporate and charter pilots have a slight advantage in the selection for an interview....I even know a guy who was a FA for 3 years prior to being a pilot....it took 10 days to get the phone interview intive for him.....

I have my fingers crossed for my 2nd chance, however, with the large amounts off applicants its hard to say what will happen.

 

[Trash8Mofo]

As insignificant of a job waiting tables @ TGI Fridays seemed back in the days, it actually help me getting a job at NJA.

 

[skyismyoffice]

I guess that might explain why they didn't hire me. I had a bunch of flying jobs on my resume...

 

[o2bflyn]

In myopinion...if you are trying for a fractional, corporate, or charter job you have to sell both the pilot and the "concierge" of yourself. I know when I looked at my resume, I had it set up to brag about all my pilot time and experience. There was absolutely nothing on it with regards to customer service. Some changes had to be made to show the customer service side of my profession.

Experience, and consequently safety, are the most important parts of what we do, but an extremely close second has to be customer service. It all goes back to selling yourself. A HUGE part of the fractional product is customer service. If you want a shot at it you have to make your interviewer see that you can deliever that product with unwavering reliablity.

 

[cathaywannabe]

I'm not sure if anyone can say for certainty what NJA is looking for. Unfortunately, and honestly, I'm not sure NJA knows what they are looking for.

RJ pilots with 2,500 hrs and little or no "customer service" experience have been hired recently, and so have 10,000 hr UAL retired PICs that also owned customer service type businesses. There seems to be no objective reasoning to the process at this point.

Apparently, word going around is that there are significant problems & issues with the hiring process. Hopefully it will be resolved in the future and the people that deserve to be hired will be.

Good luck! Don't beat yourself up if you don't make it here...there are other opportunities out there...

 

[aviatrix]

In myopinion...if you are trying for a fractional, corporate, or charter job you have to sell both the pilot and the "concierge" of yourself. I know when I looked at my resume, I had it set up to brag about all my pilot time and experience. There was absolutely nothing on it with regards to customer service. Some changes had to be made to show the customer service side of my profession.

Experience, and consequently safety, are the most important parts of what we do, but an extremely close second has to be customer service. It all goes back to selling yourself. A HUGE part of the fractional product is customer service. If you want a shot at it you have to make your interviewer see that you can deliever that product with unwavering reliablity.

That's probably why the airlines are failing. There is a complete lack of customer service. (Well, except for SWA). I'd rather have a competent jerk at the controls any day if I'm in the back, but anyone who can combine the two........great aviation background and excellent customer service skills will have an advantage going forward.

 

[reepicheep]

So I sent in an application about 1 month ago, and today I received and email stating they are looking to pursue candidates that are better matched to their current openings. I have 10000 plus hours of flying time in aircraft of which 7000 of it is MD80 time. Is it because I lack corporate time? I was just curious what others were getting interviews with or hired with for that matter.

Hunterb,

Don't feel too bad....I got the "app. received" email 9 months ago, updated at the 6 mo. point, and have heard nothing. 16000+ TT, 12000+ jet. Almost all Part 121. They probably interview a few of our types to keep a good mix going, but considering the deluge of apps, the odds don't seem too good.

 

[Vertigo37]

To build on what many have already said, from my views most pilot resumes tend to focus on the flying experience. I believe in NJA's case, you need to break that habit and reflect on the total person.

At the experience level they are currently hiring, it is a given that you know how to fly. Promoting safety is a plus, but that should also be a given.

How do you enhance customer service or promote your organization? How do you reach out as a leader in your community?

Quite frankly you need to see yourself as an ambassador not only to aviation, but if chosen, an ambassador to NJ.

Some don't want to be in that role. Some will not understand that role; however, in my opinion, that is the role needed for anyone at NJ---pilot or non-pilot.

I would suggest those applying to revamp your resume/cover letter to reflect a traditional business resume. Include quantifiable customer service/business enhancements. Include your community activities as long as they are not viewed as politically/socially controversial. Sell yourself!

I have interviewed at both SWA and NJ. Both are great companies. In my opinion, other than this phase of the process (waiting----and I think they are trying to work this part of the process out as the dust settles), NJ does it a few notches better than SWA. They do a great job giving you an overview and giving you an open-eyed orientation.

One last suggestion: Read NJ's Mission/Value Statements. I think this will be a good start to see if you/NJ are a mutual fit.

Best of luck to all who want to expand their career. Selfishly, best of luck to everyone I interviewed w/in June. A great group-----of which I hope each buys me a beer!

Cheers!
V

 

[av8tor4239]

After 9/11 2001 I was furloughed from Continental Express. They offered me a job as a ramper. The official title of the job was "customer service agent" Hind sight, the best thing that has ever happened to me!

 

[johnsonrod]

So, primary lesson from this post: go get a job at TGI Friday's on the side before you apply to Netjets if you are a high-timed pilot. I hear Dairy Queen is hiring too.

 

[rapedape]

Customer service

It seems this guy has it down:

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB118826634834410559.html?mod=googlenews_wsj

Maybe he'll jump ship at some point and go frac...

 

[blzr]

How do you enhance customer service or promote your organization? How do you reach out as a leader in your community?

I'm never in my community, unless you mean the Quality Inn. I do treat the hostess nice though, unless she gives me the smoking room.

 

[Vegaspilot99]

Hunterb,

Don't feel too bad....I got the "app. received" email 9 months ago, updated at the 6 mo. point, and have heard nothing. 16000+ TT, 12000+ jet. Almost all Part 121. They probably interview a few of our types to keep a good mix going, but considering the deluge of apps, the odds don't seem too good.

Same boat here...minus the time and experience.

 

[Trash8Mofo]

So, primary lesson from this post: go get a job at TGI Friday's on the side before you apply to Netjets if you are a high-timed pilot. I hear Dairy Queen is hiring too.

No, I was trying to say that don't short change whatever customer service experience you might have; no matter how long and how insignificant it seemed. You've gotta give HR something to imagine what kind of customer agent/pilot you are going to be.

we are used to telling technical stories (engine out, hyd failure, etc..). What, when and where it happened? What was affected? How'd you deal with it? What was the result? Use the same format with your HR stories, you'd do fine.

As far as 121 goes: in my interview group in May this year, out of 10, 5 got hired. of the 5, 1 regional 121, 1 737 121, 2 135 bizjets, and 1 mil.

 

[brokeflyer]

ok here it is.....since HR can be so picky with the 100's of resume's a day they get; You really need to set yourself apart from the others. Something in your app has to stand out. The flight time and type ratings don't mean diddly. I've flown with 10,000+ hour types that can't find new york and guys that meet the minimums who are great pilots.

You need to set your personal bar much higher than NJ's in order to get in here. If you don't get hired, then you need to find out what the other guy did to beat you. It's so competetive here right now it makes the old style interview look like taking a job at burger king. Make sure you got a 4 yr degree, belong to some kinda clan whatever.

good luck

 

[captain dad]

I would agree for the most part.

Your qualifications and experience are requirements not deal sealers. They get you in the door and that's it. If you think you deserve to get hired because you are Joe Jet pilot with 10,000 hours you might want to rethink your strategy. Everyone that comes through the door has an equal shot. This job is image, perception, and social skills more than flying ability. I would even venture to say that personal appearence is as important as your resume.

They want someone who is safe, thinks of the customer first, and looks to not be a slob.

I suggest looking at the stuff that is not on your resume before going to the interview.

 

[skiandsurf]

A couple of thoughts.

This hiring (or turning down good people) is a joke. NJs was built by the "losers" that couldnt get hired anywhere else, and now they are trying to get away from that. Why? Stick to what has worked in the past. (and no, there are no "losers" here, just the perception).

A friend of mine just got the "you dont fit our mold" letter. 8500hrs tt. 6000hrs of jet. Was an IOE instructor on 2 jet types. Worked Customer Service at an FBO. (not even a phone interview).

Met a girl last week that has a phone interview later in August. Regional FO. 2900hrs tt. Did work as a waitress while in college. (I will try to get an update in sept).

As long as airlines dont hire "the most qualified", we will always have start-ups like Skybus and Virgin.

(heres what I would do...put on your app that you were a waiter for 4 years during college. Hopefully you are old enough that they cannot do a background check on this. Or run out and really get a waiter job. Just a thought).

 

[fischman]

A couple of thoughts.

This hiring (or turning down good people) is a joke. NJs was built by the "losers" that couldn't get hired anywhere else, and now they are trying to get away from that. Why? Stick to what has worked in the past. (and no, there are no "losers" here, just the perception).

A friend of mine just got the "you don't fit our mold" letter. 8500hrs tt. 6000hrs of jet. Was an IOE instructor on 2 jet types. Worked Customer Service at an FBO. (not even a phone interview).

Met a girl last week that has a phone interview later in August. Regional FO. 2900hrs tt. Did work as a waitress while in college. (I will try to get an update in sept).

As long as airlines don't hire "the most qualified", we will always have start-ups like Skybus and Virgin.

(heres what I would do...put on your app that you were a waiter for 4 years during college. Hopefully you are old enough that they cannot do a background check on this. Or run out and really get a waiter job. Just a thought).

That is a terrible idea. If NJA found out you lied on your app, it is an automatic disqualification.

These guys are trying their hardest to get on with the finest aviation company in the country and you're telling them to falsify their app??? Come on man. Think before you type!

I went ahead and fixed all your spelling errors for you.

 

[freighterguy]

does anyone know how many started INDOC today, what fleet types were assigned?

 

[skiandsurf]

That is a terrible idea. If NJA found out you lied on your app, it is an automatic disqualification.

These guys are trying their hardest to get on with the finest aviation company in the country and you're telling them to falsify their app??? Come on man. Think before you type!

I went ahead and fixed all your spelling errors for you.

Wow, a democrat that doesnt lie.



And where were my spelling errors?

 

[FLYLOW22]

A couple of thoughts.


NJs was built by the "losers" that couldn't get hired anywhere else, and now they are trying to get away from that. Why? Stick to what has worked in the past. (and no, there are no "losers" here, just the perception).

I have no idea where to begin here man.

Ok... um, how bout this.

-Those "losers" are senior to you and will fly something larger than you for the rest of your career.

-Those "losers" kept the lights on until the company chaged to NJA fro EJA and matured to what we have now.

-Those "losers" have, NO DOUBT, learned much in their careers while working here... they've learned on their own, they've learned from others, we've all matured.

I can't say that the process is over, more like it's only begun to take traction in the last few years.

Hiring is broke because the company sent away one of the true crown jewels of the company. NJ screwed up there and I wish here nothing but the best for the rest of her days. We are truly at a loss.

Back to the point... we CAN'T do what always worked... we've grown, and outgrown the ability to run things like we always did.

Pilots NEED to know how to speak, how to deal with issues, to prioritize issues on the line and keep the desires (service) of the Owner in mind while, of course, preserving the utmost of safety.

Those "losers" you speak of have been hauled up by their boot straps to the new service level of the rising tide.

Over time, many will continue to learn much.

What will you learn? Discretion perhaps? Perhaps not...

 

[FLYLOW22]

yeah...

 

[skiandsurf]

I have no idea where to begin here man.

Ok... um, how bout this.

-Those "losers" are senior to you and will fly something larger than you for the rest of your career.

What will you learn? Discretion perhaps? Perhaps not...

I think you missed my point. Back in the day, when guys couldnt get hired by UAL or AA, they went to SWA. Most of the SWA were trying to get on with the "majors". Back when UAL, DAL, and AA were hiring boat loads, guys that got hired at UPS or FedEx were laughed at. At Skybus and VA, some pilots look at them as "losers". But reality is for one reason or another, they got passed over for a lesser qualified pilot. They are not losers, nor are the senior Netjets pilots. But as you agreed, senior guys built this company. Were they the "most qualified" of their time? Reading the union board, most of the senior guys admit that they probably couldnt get hired in todays environment. This is what is frustrating. Sure, I got mine and you got yours, but what about those others that are just like us. I never worked as a waiter, but I think that my customer service concerns are as good, if not better, than the next guy.

All I am saying, is why change the profile of who we hire? We fly airplanes. If we crash, we make the news. If we forget to call an owner by his "preferred name", that wont make the news.

 

[DAS at 10/250]

does anyone know how many started INDOC today, what fleet types were assigned?

I don't know how many but I spoke with two of them at the hotel Sunday night. Seemed like good guys. Both had interviewed in the April/May time frame.

 

[DAS at 10/250]

I'm not sure if NJ still asks this during the interview but here is another thought.

NJ is a very generous company when it comes to charities. I was asked about any charity work that I did and I told them about my long time involvement with Feed the Children. A recent development had also put the MDA on my donation list and I mentioned that as well.

I'd list any and all recent or past charity/donation work that you have done.

This is only current as of December last year so take if for what it's worth.

 

[o2bflyn]

A couple of thoughts.

This hiring (or turning down good people) is a joke. NJs was built by the "losers" that couldnt get hired anywhere else, and now they are trying to get away from that. Why? Stick to what has worked in the past. (and no, there are no "losers" here, just the perception).

A friend of mine just got the "you dont fit our mold" letter. 8500hrs tt. 6000hrs of jet. Was an IOE instructor on 2 jet types. Worked Customer Service at an FBO. (not even a phone interview).

Met a girl last week that has a phone interview later in August. Regional FO. 2900hrs tt. Did work as a waitress while in college. (I will try to get an update in sept).

As long as airlines dont hire "the most qualified", we will always have start-ups like Skybus and Virgin.

(heres what I would do...put on your app that you were a waiter for 4 years during college. Hopefully you are old enough that they cannot do a background check on this. Or run out and really get a waiter job. Just a thought).

I am hoping that last part was a joke. Why would you recommend someone lie on an app? Other than the moral side of it, the consequenses of getting caught are long term. Not only will they get disqualified this time, I am willing to wager they will make some sort of list of people who falsify their apps. Probably won't have a chance in the future either.

Really dumb idea!

 

[o2bflyn]

All I am saying, is why change the profile of who we hire? We fly airplanes. If we crash, we make the news. If we forget to call an owner by his "preferred name", that wont make the news.

It will make the news as far as the owner is concerned. Maybe that is the difference in what Netjets is looking for and what you percieve they should be looking for.

The little things make the difference! That is what customer service is all about.