What airport has the worst controllers?

[IFlyGC]

You controllers will LOVE this....

I just sent a student for a Multi-ride in a Turbo Aztec...not the greatest twin but will fly an approach at 120kts nicely with an inexperienced pilot at the helm. So anyhow, the guy passes but the examiner chastises me for having him do apch's at 120 and not 90 (blueline).

My reply? "Well ATC sees the twin and often asks them to keep the speed up to keep the flow smooth." To this, the examiner points his favourite finger in the air and screams "F*ck Em! They're their for us....if we want to do it at 90 kts we will, who cares what they think!"

So, next time a guy crawls down the pipe with a 50kt groundspeed....blame the students examiner...not the pilot!

~Fly~

 

[Vector4fun]

Yeah well, I've met a few examiners who were dangerous at any speed above 90 kts.....

 

[Future SNA]

Vector4fun,
I was just playing around, my first Caravan.....she was the love of my life.......made me never allow anyone to talk bad on her! BUT, I do understand your point..........

 

[StarChecker]

The bottom line is we bust our ass for you guys and it almost sounds like we are a thorn in your side. Lets just turn it into a free for all and the major airports, see how much you like that.

I had the oppurtunity to visit the NY TRACON in January. It was interesting to compare the BMW's, Mercedes', Range Rovers, and Cadillacs I saw in the parking lot there to the Corolla's, Honda's, and Pinto's I see at the employee lot at LGA.

By the way....controllers are dorks too. Love the vanity plates at the TRACON..... "SKYCOP" was my favorite...

 

[TWA Dude]

.....and oh my god if someone should have to sit off the active for 30 seconds before they get taxi instructions. Half the time they just keep rolling. That is a straight pilot deviation. If you havent gotten taxi instructions and you roll off the runway and keep moving then that is a straight violation.

I believe you that it's technically a violation but then driving one MPH over the limit is illegal as well -- but it's not enforced. At many busy airports stopping immediately after clearing a runway would cause go-arounds. Just like how at ORD Ground doesn't wait for a readback it's an accepted practice. After all, Ground knows where you'll be going. This kind of practice certainly varies from airport to airport. In an airliner I've never been yelled at for not stopping. I was yelled at once -- but it was a G.A. airport with no other traffic and I guess I stepped on his pee-pee.

Dude

 

[Lrjtcaptain]

well, TWA DUDE, i agree withyou on the fact that i never expect them to stop, but a few instances they dont even call, or if im busy on the shout line, they just keep going, and i usually just say so and so taxi to parking.

And of course I would let you do it..
your EX TWA.....I pay my respects to your loss....
I miss that airline!

 

[TWA Dude]

Lrjtcaptain:

Of course they should and must call Ground if instructed to do so by Tower. The only times I don't call Ground is when we neglect to hear the instruction from Tower due to our laughing too hard at the landing.

I miss TWA too. Next week I restart my career by joining America West. With luck I'll have as much fun there as I did at TWA. Oh, and I promise to be real careful about the runway incursions.

Dude

 

[mar]

Congratulations TWA Dude!

Good luck at America West. I'm glad to hear you're getting out of the prop trash (again).

But look out for those PHX controllers. I hear they're some of the worst!



I'm kidding. I'm kidding. You ATCers need to have another cigarette. And a shot of something.

Geeze.

 

[Lrjtcaptain]

TWA DUDE, thats awsome.....Cactus is actually a good airline. I grew up flying them to Phoenix all the time.
As for the runway incursions, I recall they only had 3 in a 3 month period but it theory, as proffesionals, they should have had none.
As for the controllers in PHX. I have to plead the fifth because I would love to work that Tracon or TWR someday but they do have some issues.
One controller actually ended up killing herself last year because of her coworkers. Thats what i heard anyways, have no info to back it up with details.

 

[AA717driver]

TWAdude--A word to the wise--

When you're in PHX watch out for the fake blondes with fake t*ts! They just want to use you for sex!

If you do succumb to their siren song, I'm always available for confession. TC

Enjoy, dude!

 

[TWA Dude]

Mar and Lrjtcaptain: thanks for the kind words. I'm excited. The J41 is a nightmare when the OAT gets above 65F (just like the J31 was, big surprise) so good riddance.

TC:

Thanks again to you too. I've heard stuff about those sultry Savannah Southern belles so you watch yourself as well. You also get a beach nearby (do you still look good in a swimsuit?). As far as fake blondes I enjoy brunettes just as well so it's no problem, and I'll be flying an Airbus with fake control feel so what's the difference between that and fake mammaries?

Oh, and I'll confess to no one other than my Maker.

Dude

 

[SDF2BUF2MCO]

Good luck TWA Dude! I hope the view is a better for you.
P.S. Take some of the good St. Louis Cardinal luck and pass it on to the mighty Arizona Cardinals! I don't want to get my hopes up but I think Arizona may go 5-11 this year.

 

[Hugh Jorgan]

watch out for the fake blondes with fake t*ts! /B]

There's no such thing as fakes. I mean, if you can kiss 'em, squeeze 'em and c** on them, they're real.

 

[ERfly]

As for the worst-a certain female who works ground in LGA.Can I get an amen?

Amen, Amen, Amen. We were on Spot 23 the other day. Company taxies up to 22 and calls for taxi. She gives him a left on A behind the Comair RJ that we were blocking. I called 4 more times and she told me I was in sequence. Finally, company on 22 asked if they were supposed to give way to us. She said no, follow the RJ. Finally after everyone was totally confused, she asked who was on 23 and I told her it was us, blocking the entire taxiway. She gave us Alpha, Echo short of 4. That's all it took.

The only good news is, when she's working, it won't be long before one of the good ones is on ground cleaning up the mess.

 

[Thedude]

OK ..for all you contollers out there I have a question.

Concerning squak codes
How are these assigned and I am curious about the 7000 series codes. I have been getting an unusally large number of 7000 series lately.

 

[A Squared]

I have been getting an unusally large number of 7000 series lately.

Have you been declaring an unususally large number of emergencies lately?

 

[Lrjtcaptain]

every radar facility has a certain number of XPDR codes that are allocated strictly for them. So depending on what overlying facility you are at usually determines the code. Lets say for instance, NCT has 400 codes allocated between 6700-7100. They give you a free one not being used and thats what you get.

 

[Vector4fun]

OK ..for all you contollers out there I have a question.

Concerning squak codes
How are these assigned and I am curious about the 7000 series codes. I have been getting an unusally large number of 7000 series lately.

Dude,

For the complete answer, you'd have to refer to the 7110.66, National Beacon Code Allocation Plan, or NBCAP. Unfortunately, as far as I know, It's not available on line; not that you'd really want to try to read and understand it. I probably couldn't.

The basics are here:
Controller's Handbook, 7110.65, Chap 5, Section 2

Beacon Codes are divided into different sub-sets for different purposes. Any Terminal facility (Approach Control or Tracon) has it's own subset(s). My facility uses 0200. Then that subset is further divided. We have eight codes (0270-0277) that are perminantly assigned to local operators, such as local PD, Air Ambulance, a local Parachute club, etc. Then we have eight codes reserved for local IFR operations which cue the ARTS computer to provide Minimum Safe Altitude Warning (MSAW). The remainder of the 0200 codes are for VFR ops, and DO NOT generate MSAW alarms. Adjacent Terminal Facilities use 0300 and 0400.

If the flight is going to get radar service beyond our local airspace, then of course, that requires an IFR or VFR flight plan in the NAS, which is the same thing as saying in the HOST Computer at the Center. The Host then assigns a beacon code.

Right now, the NAS is very stretched for beacon codes. For one thing, there are an awful lot of IFR aircraft out there. For another, thousands of aircraft that, in the past, would likely have flown VFR without Flight Following are now required, or are choosing to use ATC services, both VFR and IFR. (Think TFR violations).

At times, available codes run so short, we start getting IFR flight plans (proposals) all with a 2400 codes. When that happens, we will wait until you call for clearance, and then, (just to show how kludged up the NAS can be) we have to go to the FDIO terminal, and send two amendment messages. First, we remove the equipment suffix from your aircraft type, (Change a T/B733/G to a T/B733), and then change it BACK. That generates a discrete code. (I've personally called the automation office at the Center to ask if there isn't a simpler way to force a discrete code assignment, and they say there isn't.) So now you know what the delay in getting a clearance or beacon code is sometimes about.



I'm sure the automation guys in the Centers are scrambling to make as many discrete codes available as possible, and probably has something to do with number of times you're asked to change codes during a flight. It would surely help if you guys could be pro-active in calling us to say when you've cancelled a flight, so we can remove the flight plan, or refrain from filing multiple flight plans to the extent possible. (I've personably seen a Lear with 5 flight plans to 5 destinations in 4 different States, all in the same hour). If you're just going to be late, call us, and we'll update the P-time, rather than file a second FP. On a day with IFR WX, it's not unusual to have 10-20% of flight plans go un-used....

 

[JediNein]

The worst controller I've encountered works ZLA. I told him "standby" to a heading and altitude assignment while diagnosing instrument failure in a piston single that was doing its best to kill me in IMC. This guy responds with a long diatribe, with two headings to intercept a routing change, expedite climb to a different altitude than the first, and a frequency change at machine gun pace. My third response of "standby" was met by another rapid fire, to which I accepted the frequency change.

My passenger set the frequency. We were greeted by complete silence instead of the expected Class B chatter.

Later, listening to the tapes we found that controller to have issued several instructions that put us further off course into the rocks, had I followed them. The more I told this guy “no” the more excited he got.

------

A standing ovation (and an "aircraft save") goes to the next controller. He got me, unannounced, not even showing on his scope, with no position information, and I wasn’t changing frequencies again. In between no-gyro vectors, groundspeed reports, and position updates for me; he cleared his scope; coordinated the possible shutdown of the Class B airport; obtained several weather reports to give me possible options (none); cleared other air traffic out of my way; and stretched the limits of 7110.65 as far as he could with two Sups over his shoulder.

Another round of applause goes to the countless controllers we work with everyday during the countless hours of flight we pilots spend in utter boredom. I prefer boring flights!

Fly SAFE!
Jedi Nein

 

[Freightdog75]

While I agree with an earlier post that CAE is awfully slow, I have to give them a few well-desserved-pats-on-the-back.

CLT apprch. Saved my a$$ 3 years ago when I had an engine failure in a single, IMC, all that good stuff. To long of story -- whatever -- SAVED MY A$$.

GRR apprch. Only 1-2 months ago going eastbound for PTK cockpit fire 11000ft over Lake Michigan (IMC again). Fantastic job working with me. Enough said. SAVED MY A$$.

For all the times you've gotten some of us out of some incredible situations. From the bottom of my heart. THANK YOU!

FD75