United question.

[Chairman]

Have you done any ATP checkride with the circle or was your ATP ride done in the 145 with the circle limitation? That will determine if it is restricted or not I believe.

Chairman

 

[Flyer1015]

Have you done any ATP checkride with the circle or was your ATP ride done in the 145 with the circle limitation? That will determine if it is restricted or not I believe.

Chairman

A restricted ATP and an ATP with a limitation are two separate things. The circle ATP has a limitation and not a restriction. The circling limitation can be removed with an approach in a sim and the appropriate signoff from the examiner. A restricted ATP for all practical purposes now refers to the new hour rules for pilots. Military guys can get a restricted ATP with about 750 hrs. Aviation college grads can get a restricted ATP with about 1,000-1,2000 hrs or so. The normal ATP is 1500 hrs. Basically United is just saying they want a normal ATP with 1500 hrs.

 

[Ex737Driver]

..............I like Delta's management but they haven't been faced with the significant challenges that USAirways has dealt with.

United's management is really old Continental management; if you look at the resume of 20-some VPs at United, you'll see that 90% of them are from Continental. And quite frankly, they're living examples of the Peter Principle, except they've risen well above their level of competence. I was never impressed with old United management, but I have been shocked at how incompetent the current management is. The best way I can describe it is if the management of a chain of 20 gas stations took over running Exxon/Mobil.

United's poor management will eventually get resolved, but it will take some time. If we have two or three more mediocre quarters, I'd expect Smisek to be shown the door. He is unable to cultivate a talented management team and that's what's holding back United at the moment..........

The only thing I would add/change to that is our mgmt is working way above their pay-grade but the good management we did have was actually siphoned off to DAL well before the merger. We still have mid-level Lorenzo wanna-bees managing significant portions of our day-to-day operation. Until we can and do clean house, not much is going to change.

The next big issue is how the hell did Jeff, who was hired by Gordon, not learn a damn thing 10 years under him?

 

[Shrek]

The only thing I would add/change to that is our mgmt is working way above their pay-grade but the good management we did have was actually siphoned off to DAL well before the merger. We still have mid-level Lorenzo wanna-bees managing significant portions of our day-to-day operation. Until we can and do clean house, not much is going to change.

The next big issue is how the hell did Jeff, who was hired by Gordon, not learn a damn thing 10 years under him?

He was too busy saying co-worker and making safety videos.

 

[densoo]

The next big issue is how the hell did Jeff, who was hired by Gordon, not learn a damn thing 10 years under him?

Maybe he learned more than we think. Jeff is similar to Gordon, except without the awe-shucks personality. We had lousy contracts and got treated just as dismissively under Gordon, who happily walked away with a $50M golden parachute along with many other bennies. The only difference was we apparently liked it then. Now we don't. Myth has it that Gordon called us all a "box of rocks" when we supposedly "left $400m on the table" in C97. Jeff said "labor is not needed for this merger." But you're right. What Jeff did not learn from Gordon was the ability to make us feel ok about being treated poorly. I do credit Gordon with walking away from a Delta staple, and credit Kellner with walking away from this merger.

 

[Andy]

Until we can and do clean house, not much is going to change.

The next big issue is how the hell did Jeff, who was hired by Gordon, not learn a damn thing 10 years under him?

You and I and ALPA cannot change management. Please do not think that this is something we are able to do. We aren't.

The one thing that we can and must do is stop the contract violations. CALALPA has looked the other way for a very long time with respect to contract violations. It's time to force our ALPA reps to file grievances rather than sweep them under the rug.
Pilot pushing has become so deeply ingrained in LCAL pilots that I have been told too many times to count by CAL captains that if I try to enforce x portion of the contract, I'll be fired and it will take years to get my job back without back pay. That has to stop immediately.

 

[Andy]

Maybe he learned more than we think. Jeff is similar to Gordon, except without the awe-shucks personality. We had lousy contracts and got treated just as dismissively under Gordon, who happily walked away with a $50M golden parachute along with many other bennies. The only difference was we apparently liked it then. Now we don't. Myth has it that Gordon called us all a "box of rocks" when we supposedly "left $400m on the table" in C97. Jeff said "labor is not needed for this merger." But you're right. What Jeff did not learn from Gordon was the ability to make us feel ok about being treated poorly. I do credit Gordon with walking away from a Delta staple, and credit Kellner with walking away from this merger.

Gordo's just another snake oil salesman. He got CAL employees to violate work rules and do it happily. How many times were rampers popping open the cargo doors before the plane was even chocked? I don't know how many times I've seen the cargo doors opened with an engine running. And WTF were you people thinking when you accepted additional pay to sit in a middle seat while deadheading?

Nothing personal, but if you act like a $2 hooker, expect to be treated like one. Here's a blast from the past for you: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y6C8Z9aBa2Y
Stop acting like a $2 hooker.