Unfortunately CAL will lose it's 50 seat scope.

[luckytohaveajob]

SCOPE is a tough fight.

And an even tougher fight for a SCAB union. CAL ALPA cannot even get a pay raise after a concessionary contract has expired for two years. How is it ever going to lead the industry in something so important?

 

[Skyflyin]

What leverage will all the Major Pilot groups have over Scope, really?

The only legal leverage is a Strike, and I just don't think any Pilot group out there is going to Strike over Scope. Personally, I don't think Major Pilots will put it all on the line over Scope.

A full blown strike is not the only leverage. In fact, I believe many are correct that the President would not allow an airline the size of the combined United to fully strike. Instead, I see us doing something similar to the CHAOS campaign of the flight attendants. Strike only certain portions of the airline say, all Europe flights one week, then all Pacific flights the next, then Latin and South America flights next. That would not be a total shut down of the airline and still be legal after we have been released by the NMB.

As far as Scope, every pilot should be concerned about it. If much of our 737 flying is shifted to the regionals, as United's was, and we lose the bottom third of the seniority list, then everyone moves down. If your not fighting for Scope, you would end up losing money even if the contract included raises since you would be downgraded to the right seat or to a lesser airplane more than likely.

If a major airline pilot is not willing to put it all on the line for Scope then they need to get their head out of sand and look around.

 

[jetflier]

Strikes work.
As a NWA guy in 1998, our strike worked in our favor.

BUT, it takes balls. Period

 

[bigshooter107]

The new asa contract with Ua/Co for exspress jet flying is locked in for ten years with each airframe. When the 50 seat leases expire they are slated to be replaced with 70 seat aircraft. Those airframes and jobs have already been lost, does it not make sense to allow the company to have a first class product and make more money on the small lift feed?

 

[sleeves]

The new asa contract with Ua/Co for exspress jet flying is locked in for ten years with each airframe. When the 50 seat leases expire they are slated to be replaced with 70 seat aircraft. Those airframes and jobs have already been lost, does it not make sense to allow the company to have a first class product and make more money on the small lift feed?

Not arguing the merits of the equipment. The company can fly them as long as pilots on our seniority list fly them. They want to replace the 50's with 70's, what is next 70's for 100's. Bring them on property at rates they are being flown at now.

 

[doh]

It is not a joke. I am tired of bad pilots. Stupid accidents happened like this one because those people should have chosen another career path.

I saw it all the time at the regionals, I would say 50% of the pilot staff could not deal with a real emergency, 50% of them would make stupid mistakes on a daily basis. When they are paired together the odds of dumb mistakes doubles.

I am not saying I am perfect, I make mistakes too. But my daily mistakes would be things like breaking sterile cockpit, not doing all of the waypoint accuracy checks accross the Atlantic (who cares btw if you do them, just look at the GPS if it is working), forgetting to switch to tower at the sign in "LAX" (I may remember 100' past or so).... stuff that is not that big of a deal..
When if comes to situational awareness and actually doing what is important, flying the plane, I am at about a 99%. Oh and BTW, you can read the newspaper and know what is going on, unless you don't have any skill. I know there are some geeks that can't do that because they have to pay attention all the time...they are nervous every flight... My advice to them is change career, they were not meant to be a pilot.

I really get tired of the union protecting these pilots. I think they should be fired. I had a sim partner once at a regional that got 5 extra sim lessons, ridiculous!! I was finishing up sim #3 and he was still on sim #1, couldn't do a raw data takeoff, kept crashing.

Do you want your family or yourself on his plane, with 2 pilots like that?


Look at the Comair crash in Lexington....more bad pilots. You may say "that could happen to any of us"... I hate to tell you, NOT REALLY... good pilots would figure it out anything short of a unrecoverable mechanical issue.

Bad pilot crashes:

1) Air Florida
2) American in Cali
3) Air France in 2009
4) Most regional accidents.... AE in Indiana & RDU, Comair in DTW, Jetstream that crashed in Hibing & the other one up north in 2004. ACA in CMH (1995 I think), Clownair in LEX

5) and many more..


We need to demand good pilot hiring practices in order to demand higher wages!!! As long as we have goofy characters amongst us we will always get treated goofy by management.

I'm so glad you are able to stand in such absolute judgement of your fellows! All from the comfort of your computer screen! And you are 99% solid! I know this because you are telling me! What other proof could I possibly need!?! Someplace in this thread there is a reference to karma.

 

[bigshooter107]

Not arguing the merits of the equipment. The company can fly them as long as pilots on our seniority list fly them. They want to replace the 50's with 70's, what is next 70's for 100's. Bring them on property at rates they are being flown at now.

The company is not going to break a long term contract to make pilots happy. Lock the scope in for the duration of these contracts and bring them under mainline senority later. Just seems like this is a distraction from getting the best possible pat and work rules at mainline.

 

[bigshooter107]

Pay I mean

 

[Hvy]

What do you want to wager on that Gramps? You are being sold a bill of goods by your mec. They don't care much about the scope, only what that scope is good to trade for. Kiss it goodbye. Widebody folks can count on a raise. Narrow body pukes can count on getting the shaft. Hopefully you dont get furloughed.

Obviously, you know nothing. Start looking for another career. Your RJ job is going to be gone over the next few years.

 

[jonjuan]

Not arguing the merits of the equipment. The company can fly them as long as pilots on our seniority list fly them. They want to replace the 50's with 70's, what is next 70's for 100's. Bring them on property at rates they are being flown at now.

There was a good article posted some time back about this maneuver. It said that there's no way management will fall for this as they know they'll have to pay for it in the future when rates are brought up. They really are smarter than most people believe or want to give them credit for as they have the $$ and resources to protect their ATM, unfortunately. The battle cry always seems to be "management is a bunch of idiots." They seem to know what they are doing, however. Simple reality.

 

[doh]

That is why you have to be willing to go to the wall if you want to fix this mess.

 

[rtmcfi]

Obviously, you know nothing. Start looking for another career. Your RJ job is going to be gone over the next few years.

Looks like you fly big stuff. Enjoy your raise at your co-workers expense. The only way you all get back the rj is by burning the place down. Not gonna happen. You will be OK. Narrow body folks.......not so much. Save this post, and look at it again in 5 years. United already parked their 73s, Continentals smaller 73s are next.

 

[Jetjockey]

Looks like you fly big stuff. Enjoy your raise at your co-workers expense. The only way you all get back the rj is by burning the place down. Not gonna happen. You will be OK. Narrow body folks.......not so much. Save this post, and look at it again in 5 years. United already parked their 73s, Continentals smaller 73s are next.

They way mainline gets it back is holding the line on CAL's scope. As the economics become untenable for 50 seaters...they dwindle. Even if the new JCBA allows 70 seaters, I seriously doubt there will be any more ground given. Who says mainline has to "give up" anything?

This is not a concessionary environment. RJ operators have reached their high point. The decline has been in progress for over a year (consolidation is survival of the fittest). Mainline scope is the only thing preventing ALL domestic flying from being outsourced to regional airlines. You really think mainline pilots will allow more jobs to be outsourced? Guess again.

Whether you realized or not, the RJ is getting squeezed on one end by economics and the high CASM, and scope limiting seat increase on the other end.

 

[mamba20]

Whether you realized or not, the RJ is getting squeezed on one end by economics and the high CASM, and scope limiting seat increase on the other end.

I love a good 3 way.

 

[TheAlchemist]

They way mainline gets it back is holding the line on CAL's scope. As the economics become untenable for 50 seaters...they dwindle. Even if the new JCBA allows 70 seaters, I seriously doubt there will be any more ground given. Who says mainline has to "give up" anything?

This is not a concessionary environment. RJ operators have reached their high point. The decline has been in progress for over a year (consolidation is survival of the fittest). Mainline scope is the only thing preventing ALL domestic flying from being outsourced to regional airlines. You really think mainline pilots will allow more jobs to be outsourced? Guess again.

Whether you realized or not, the RJ is getting squeezed on one end by economics and the high CASM, and scope limiting seat increase on the other end.

We can all dream...but not likely to unfold like that.