Unfortunately CAL will lose it's 50 seat scope.

[PeanuckleCRJ]

I suspect the large regionals have a plan B either way. Republic is the first, Skywest and PNCL will be next...That plan B is that if their F4D flying is taken, they will simply become your competition at much lower costs...Something that may be even worse for you long term.

That sounds like a great plan, Joe.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Independence_Air

 

[JoeMerchant]

That sounds like a great plan, Joe.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Independence_Air

Indy Air primarily had 50 seaters. Then they bought some Airbuses to go with them at the end in desperation...That won't work.

Republic bought two established carriers, Midwest and Frontier. Air Canada Jazz is starting a charter operation with 757s I believe. The next "Indy Airs" will be smarter and more capable of competing. In addition, they will have 90 seat RJs to feed with which are much more competitive than a fleet of 50 seaters.

Skywest probably won't pull the trigger until they are forced, but I'm sure they are planing on it.

It's funny that a Delta pilot like doesn't believe anyone else can grow to be the next Delta...Delta started out as a crop dusting service....Nothing says there can't be others that grow into the next "Delta".....

 

[Bako Cap]

Skywest probably won't pull the trigger until they are forced, but I'm sure they are planing on it.
....

10 year contracts will keep the BOD and upper management weathly. There is currently little reason (no matter the aircraft size) for SkyWest to morph into an independent. Well, for at least for another decade.

 

[boxjockey]

Don't have the actual numbers, so I'm spit-balling here.
Also, it's a generalization of group attitudes - individual attitudes may differ.

A - Mainline pilots 60-65 - 5%
B - Mainline pilots 50-60 - 30%
C - Mainline pilots 20-50 - 25%
D - Regional pilots all ages - 40%

Group A sold out everyone else to take care of themselves.
Group B will need to maximize the years they have left and make up for all they've lost. Why be different than the previous group?
Group C has the most lose in this whole mess and seem to be the most vocal about scope - and with good reason.
Group D, it's been suggested, should be overjoyed to staple themselves to the smelly side of Group C regardless of QOL, security and pay they currently enjoy. Group D wouldn't mind if integration was fair. Group D is beneath contempt of Group C. Group C will have NO integration whatsoever - They think they got theirs (though not to the extent of A & B). Group D must then also look out for themselves.

So, we have 25% with the most to lose against 75% who either won't care or have something to gain from seeing scope go away - not to mention the fat cats who would love nothing more than to pay RJ wages for wide-body captains.

Unless groups unite, and on terms acceptable to all, what do you think will happen to domestic narrow-body flying?

So you are like Joe, don't want to give up your seniority at a regional, so you will try and bark your way onto a major list, based off of DOH? Is that basically what you think is "fair"? I just want to make sure I have it right, that you don't want to take the necessary steps to go and get a job at a major on your own. I used to work for a regional, great company. They don't have anything that belongs to them, they simply do what their parent company says to do, and for how much they tell them to do it for. What makes you feel like pilots from said company should be "fairly integrated" into a company that doesn't even own them or have any business with them other than a fee-for-departure contract? Get real, brah!!! If you want to go and work for one of these companies, then stick your hand up and give it a try. If not, then simply sit on your hands and see what comes your way. Your choice.

box

 

[SFR]

Unfortunatly, Joe "Jackarse" Merchant is right... Mgmt will show up with a big bag of dead presidents to slide under the table.... and presto!!! The arbitrators going to rule in favor of Mgmt, with the stipulation that no CAL pilot will be furloughed as a result... And Mgmt brings on 70+ seaters and shrinks the company through attrition when retirements start again...

Wait and see!!!!

You mean slide the bag under the table to ALPA who will then....

That can't happen....we picketed.

 

[IBNAV8R]

Box: You make my point exactly.

 

[bluefin]

So what happens if CAL loses scope? If there is no JCBA, no scope protection and the TA running out in May, I'll bet that there will be more furloughs at the old UAL and an increase of more RJ flying. UAL wanted to furlough another 300 before the TA was signed. So why shouldn't mainline guys be so defensive about their jobs? you rj guys have nothing to worry about, I don't see your jobs being given away on a daily basis! I hope scope is held strong and mainline jobs return, even if it is at your expense, everything until now has been at our expense!!! who knows maybe we can stand together and chat in the unemployment line!!

Another thing, fair integration, PHUK that!!! when I got furloughed, there wasn't fair integration for us furloughees, no DOH, hell my DOH would put me back into the top180 at Skywest!!

 

[nerjdriver]

Don't have the actual numbers, so I'm spit-balling here.
Also, it's a generalization of group attitudes - individual attitudes may differ.

A - Mainline pilots 60-65 - 5%
B - Mainline pilots 50-60 - 30%
C - Mainline pilots 20-50 - 25%
D - Regional pilots all ages - 40%

Group A sold out everyone else to take care of themselves.
Group B will need to maximize the years they have left and make up for all they've lost. Why be different than the previous group?
Group C has the most lose in this whole mess and seem to be the most vocal about scope - and with good reason.
Group D, it's been suggested, should be overjoyed to staple themselves to the smelly side of Group C regardless of QOL, security and pay they currently enjoy. Group D wouldn't mind if integration was fair. Group D is beneath contempt of Group C. Group C will have NO integration whatsoever - They think they got theirs (though not to the extent of A & B). Group D must then also look out for themselves.

So, we have 25% with the most to lose against 75% who either won't care or have something to gain from seeing scope go away - not to mention the fat cats who would love nothing more than to pay RJ wages for wide-body captains.

Unless groups unite, and on terms acceptable to all, what do you think will happen to domestic narrow-body flying?

Groups unite huh.... hmm this sounds so familiar.

When has a major airline supported its regional partner, lets use, oh say, CAL and XJT.

CAL (and the XJT MEC) want us to come out and support CALALPA and picket (because that will show em!). Where was the CAL group during 04', during the integration, and so on....


Oh thats right, they got theirs and said buh bye. Here is the REAL cycle, majors shrink, the regional pilots that have been hired over there become even more bitter, as they stay stagnant in QOL at a shrinking they continue to do anything they can to screw the regional pilot, who gets more and more of the major pilots flying for more and more money, all of a sudden Mr Mighty Major is a 58 year old reserve CA denying jumpseats to regional pilots because that is all he has left.

 

[Ex737Driver]

Groups unite huh.... hmm this sounds so familiar.

When has a major airline supported its regional partner, lets use, oh say, CAL and XJT.

CAL (and the XJT MEC) want us to come out and support CALALPA and picket (because that will show em!). Where was the CAL group during 04', during the integration, and so on....


Oh thats right, they got theirs and said buh bye. Here is the REAL cycle, majors shrink, the regional pilots that have been hired over there become even more bitter, as they stay stagnant in QOL at a shrinking they continue to do anything they can to screw the regional pilot, who gets more and more of the major pilots flying for more and more money, all of a sudden Mr Mighty Major is a 58 year old reserve CA denying jumpseats to regional pilots because that is all he has left.

You have a valid point but if you go with the negative, you have to go with the positive. There have been more XJT pilots go to CAL since 1990 because of the CAL guys than any other single group at any airline, anywhere.


IF you don't want to picket and take the same stance that any number of posters on this board have taken then please, OFFER ANOTHER SOLUTION!!! Everyone blasts and pisses and moans and that's all. Suggestions...............

 

[BUDDHA145]

Groups unite huh.... hmm this sounds so familiar.

When has a major airline supported its regional partner, lets use, oh say, CAL and XJT.

CAL (and the XJT MEC) want us to come out and support CALALPA and picket (because that will show em!). Where was the CAL group during 04', during the integration, and so on....


Oh thats right, they got theirs and said buh bye. Here is the REAL cycle, majors shrink, the regional pilots that have been hired over there become even more bitter, as they stay stagnant in QOL at a shrinking they continue to do anything they can to screw the regional pilot, who gets more and more of the major pilots flying for more and more money, all of a sudden Mr Mighty Major is a 58 year old reserve CA denying jumpseats to regional pilots because that is all he has left.

Is bcause we stall their flying, you know us regional pilots scumbs!!! is not that their top gun guys made a deal with the devil!!!
HA life is a bitch!!!

both sides are right and wrong... but who cares what I said, wheres my cheap moon shine.