To the pilots age 61 and older:

[Skyboy722]

No one retired early for me.

QUOTE]

Actually, everyone retired at 60 for you!

 

[inline]

Yes go away, its time to pass the torch. Half way through your gift from Bush and Prater. Take the money and run.

I'm glad Pres Bush signed this bill into law.

 

[Quimby]

I'm glad Pres Bush signed this bill into law.

Of course.

 

[ACL65PILOT]

These guys are at the top of their earning potential. Why would they retire when they lost their pensions? They did not save outside of it because they did not think they needed to. Most are here for the duration, not because they want to screw you, they are doing it so they can unscrew their piss poor financial planning.

We are a few days away from being half way though the five years, get over it, it is water under the bridge. If you want to fight something, watch for getting rid of the retirement age all together.

 

[Bigoober]

Dude, get over it.

 

[Mr Wu]

Things must be great in your world if this is all you have to bitch about.

 

[Lear70]

No ex-wives. No child support. Plane is paid for. House paid for. Summer home paid for. I take one hell of a tax hit. (Not a bad problem to have with no debt.)

That's not very smart. *SOME* debt is good, especially if that $15,000-20,000 on two homes in interest payment per year can bring you down from the highest income tax bracket down into the next bracket (I believe the difference is somewhere in the 6% range).

If you can invest that money from two mortgages (payments at 4.75-5.25% interest at today's rates) elsewhere making 6-7% and save 6-7% on your taxes, that's an extra $15k-20k in your pocket every year. Keep your investments liquid enough to get out of when you retire, pay off the houses, and in the 3-5 years between now and age 65, you'll have another $60-100k to play with in retirement.

A house is not an asset if it's not making money for you in one way or another. Rich Dad Poor Dad (and basic math).

Greetings fellow serfs

- Medicare doesn't start until 65. Since single payer is considered too socialist,
a lot of people would be one major illness away from destitution without the company's plan after 60 and before 65.

- Social Security starts between 64 and 67. Since a number of pensions and
401K funds were buying up worthless derivatives being pushed by Wall Street
and rated "AAA," a lot of retirement plans have taken huge hits.

It's not just the airlines, the whole country is hurting. If you haven't noticed,
this country's quality-of-life quotient is decreasing. Your children will not have
a better life than you. More and more people will be working longer into their "retirement years" just to get by.

The class war is over and we lost.

True dat.

 

[Sy-bill]

Actually, everyone retired at 60 for you!

No they didn't. They only did because by law they had no choice. Otherwise they would have continued. Stupid comment.

That's not very smart. *SOME* debt is good, especially if that $15,000-20,000 on two homes in interest payment per year can bring you down from the highest income tax bracket down into the next bracket (I believe the difference is somewhere in the 6% range).

If you can invest that money from two mortgages (payments at 4.75-5.25% interest at today's rates) elsewhere making 6-7% and save 6-7% on your taxes, that's an extra $15k-20k in your pocket every year. Keep your investments liquid enough to get out of when you retire, pay off the houses, and in the 3-5 years between now and age 65, you'll have another $60-100k to play with in retirement.

A house is not an asset if it's not making money for you in one way or another. Rich Dad Poor Dad (and basic math).

Thanks for the financial advice. I have not shared my entire portfolio with you but I am well set up and am doing well with the advice of financially successful, lifelong friends. (Not pilots)

It's actually called "selfishness."

I completely agree. To tell someone to retire for their own gain is totally selfish.

 

[Dan Roman]

The reality is 60 is pretty young to retire at. You could be looking at 30 more years of fixed income. Inflation will cut your income in half, so working till 65 makes sense if you are still enjoying flying and you should be senior enough by then to get a good schedule
.
Many airline pilots took huge hits in their retirement that certainly wasn't expected, I can't believe anyone thinks someone who lost their retirement should go out early just to make room for some F/O to upgrade a little early and than have the benefit of extending his earning power till 65.
The playing field changed for everybody. Most of the F/O's I know are very pragmatic about it and don't whine.

It's interesting to note that the biggest complainers I have encountered in my career have far and away been the weakest pilots. You rarely hear the truly good pilots whine and complain. I think it has something to do with people that are weak would rather point fingers at others rather than engage in self improvement.

 

[Chairman]

That's not very smart. *SOME* debt is good, especially if that $15,000-20,000 on two homes in interest payment per year can bring you down from the highest income tax bracket down into the next bracket (I believe the difference is somewhere in the 6% range).
True dat.

So lets do your math here. You make say $100,000k You pay out 20k in interest on your mortgage. This brings your taxable income to 80k. Lets put you in the highest 36% tax bracket for this example.

So at 100k and paid for houses you would pay $36,000 in taxes

So at 100k with 20k paid in mortgage interest you would pay$ 28,000 in taxes.

So we would rather pay the bank 20k to save paying the goverment 8,000k. Seems to me I would rather have the extra 12k in the bank and then knock yourself out investing that money. And if you tell me well you would be in a lower tax bracket do it at 15% tax for 80k and you are still out and extra 4k vers having your homes paid for


If writing off interest was so great why the hell would I refi to 4.5% when I could keep a higher interest rate of 8% plus. Used this example right before I fired my financial advisor. Numbers don't lie if you can do the math.

 

[Lear70]

So lets do your math here. You make say $100,000k You pay out 20k in interest on your mortgage. This brings your taxable income to 80k. Lets put you in the highest 36% tax bracket for this example.

No, let's NOT put someone who makes $100k reduced to $80k after deductions in the highest tax bracket because... news flash... at that income they're NOT in the highest tax bracket.

If writing off interest was so great why the hell would I refi to 4.5% when I could keep a higher interest rate of 8% plus. Used this example right before I fired my financial advisor. Numbers don't lie if you can do the math.

You're not ONLY writing off interest in the example of taking a loan out on a property to invest in other things (other rental property, etc), but you're ALSO making money on that investment capital.

You failed to realize we're NOT ONLY talking about a 6-7% reduction of taxes on $160,000 income but ALSO the INVESTMENT INCOME from that money you took the loan out for to begin with because the homes were PAID OFF to begin with, that means the loans he takes out on those properties is PURE INVESTMENT CAPITAL for OTHER INCOME GENERATION.

Don't quit your day job, Mr. Chairman...

 

[Chairman]

.

Don't quit your day job, Mr. Chairman...

Trust me I won't and don't loose much sleep on your math skills either. You can put your example in any tax bracket you want. Go borrow all the money you want to invest. Lots did that in the dot com era worked for them to. To each there own but my math pays off every time with no risk of capital that has to be paid back.

Chairman

 

[JAM-BRO]

I fly with plenty of over 60 old farts... They believe they have to prove that they still got it and try to do everything. I don't mind though, less work for me. I do not like that my voice gets a bit raspy at the end of a 4day trip. Them old bastards are deaf...

"Circuit Breakers"....
"What??" says the old deaf capt...
"Sorry, ehem, CIRCUIT BREAKERS!!!!",
"Check" replies the old azz capt...
The lead can hear me screaming from the first class galley and comes into the flightdeck and asks , "Is everything OK boys?"...
"Yeap", I say, "Just reading the checklist..."

Oh well!!! It is what it is... We should push for a few things though. If furloughs happen, start with the over 60 guys first. When you fly with one, tell them that and see their faces change. Also tell them that the Age 60 Rule was unfair for all the guys that had retired but were not allowed to come back even though they were not 65 yet.... They love that too... They all say that that would not be right. They retired!
Gets their old hearts pounding.

 

[75 Driver]

Yawwwwwwnnnnnn

 

[eaglesview]

75, That about sums it up. It's the law. Folks need to get over it!

Yawwwwwnnnn

 

[Who Dey]

Quick math from Dave Ramsey,

Mortgage 5%
Average return on S & P 500 = 12% over entire history of S & P 500
Inflation avg = 4%

12% gains - 5% interest - 4% inflation - Capital gains taxes= break even but still have the liabilty of the loan

This is for primary resident not investment property.

Also 12% lately is hard to get and inflation looks like it will be greater than 4% by most experts predictions. So I will take no mortgage payments any day.

 

[SplitBar]

So lets do your math here. You make say $100,000k You pay out 20k in interest on your mortgage. This brings your taxable income to 80k. Lets put you in the highest 36% tax bracket for this example.

So at 100k and paid for houses you would pay $36,000 in taxes

So at 100k with 20k paid in mortgage interest you would pay$ 28,000 in taxes.

So we would rather pay the bank 20k to save paying the goverment 8,000k. Seems to me I would rather have the extra 12k in the bank and then knock yourself out investing that money. And if you tell me well you would be in a lower tax bracket do it at 15% tax for 80k and you are still out and extra 4k vers having your homes paid for


If writing off interest was so great why the hell would I refi to 4.5% when I could keep a higher interest rate of 8% plus. Used this example right before I fired my financial advisor. Numbers don't lie if you can do the math.

Plus the higher tax bracket rate is only paid income that is beyond that threshhold. For the sake of discussion lets say that 50-100K was taxed at 25% and 100-200K was taxed at 35%. If you made 100K you would pay 25K in taxes. If you made 101K you wouldn't pay 35% on the entire 101K....you would pay 25% on the 1st 100K and anything above 100K you would pay 35% on so someone who made 101K would pay $25,350, NOT $35,350.

 

[waveflyer]

SyBill- answer my question- when most every airline hired for projected retirements- and then age 60 happened- directly causing furloughs- there's no reason to believe that ought to have been handled differently?

But you got yours didn't you?

 

[pilotyip]

But you got yours didn't you?

Adam Smith at work, everyone makes ever economic decision in their own best interest. He did, you did, I did

 

[BobbyBiplane]

RETIRE you old jerks!


You knew the age limit was 60 your entire careers, so step down and get the hell outta here!

Cry Baby! You are both an idiot and a baby. Grow up.

Bob