To the Gulfstream crew at TEB...

[GVFlyer]

.85 or .86 on the natracks east bound is about average.

Gulfstream took a Citation X in on a trade and let the flight test engineers have it for qualitative testing before it was resold (this competitive analysis is something many manufaturers do, Bombardier leased and instrumented a GV, but they were disappointed in their results; Cessna sent an Experimental Test Pilot to GV initial at FSI). The engineers ballasted the X to 8 pax and put the requisite test stations and orange wire in the jet and this is what they came up with including NBAA IFR reserves:

Normal Cruise - M 0.85 Range: 2,613nm
Long Range Cruise - M 0.82 Range: 2,767nm
Intermediate Cruise - M 0.90 Range: 1,889nm
High Speed Cruise -M 0.92 Range: 773nm
MMO - M 0.92M

Takeoff distance 5,140ft.
(SL,ISA, MGTOW)

Landing distance 3,410ft.
(SL,ISA,MLW)

Initial Altitude FL 430

When ballasted for 4 passengers the engineers got:

M 0.85 - 2,978 nm
M 0.82 - 3,098 nm
M 0.92 - Not Tested

The test crew observed that the highest cruise speeds occured in the mid- 30's, but fuel consumption increased by almost 50 percent. Flying in the 40's dropped cruise speed by 25 to 35 knots, but available cruise speed was still up to 499 knots.

The only X's that go between the service centers are NJA's. Corp Citations do very well on the road.

In the last 12 months US Bank grounded then sold their Citation Xs and General Motors, citing a lack of reliability in their five Citation Xs, replaced them with Gulfstream G350s.

GV

 

[HawkerF/O]

Hold on a minute. US Bank closed the flight department. It's 1 thing if the planes got sold then replaced, but that is not the case here. If they had GVs or LR60s, they planes were going regardless. The flight department over at US Bank was a mess. I know they grounded their airplanes, but if you have poor performance by the MX staff, that stuff is going to happen. Then Tag comes in and you know how banks are aabout $, and Tag AIN'T cheap. It's like the aircraft owner that asked his Mechanic if the Hawker 800A could fly to Hawaii. Mechanic said "Oh yeah, no problem", so the pilots got fired cause they told him it could not do it safely. You have poeple that do not know what they are talking about or what they are doing and the CEO has to get involved, hang on, cause things are going to get nasty. Maybe their 750s were junk, but there is a lot more to the story than that. As for GM, those planes have run their course over there. They have had them for several years and they needed larger airplane. I frequently see those Xs pull up somewhere and 7 or 8 pax get off. The X is not a good airplane for 8 people on trips the lengths they fly. 8 folks crammed in there after a long day is not the best situation. Those middle and upper managers complained a lot about the size of the cabins. Once again, maybe their X's were junk as well, but there is more to the story than the planes were not reliable. Gulfstreams break as well, but like Boeings, it's typically not a no go item. Gulfstreams are extremely reliable aircraft and rock solid, and the same thing can be said about the GX. It's all a wash. BTW, I'd love to occupy that seat to your right.

Gulfstream took a Citation X in on a trade and let the flight test engineers have it for qualitative testing before it was resold (this competitive analysis is something many manufaturers do, Bombardier leased and instrumented a GV, but they were disappointed in their results; Cessna sent an Experimental Test Pilot to GV initial at FSI). The engineers ballasted the X to 8 pax and put the requisite test stations and orange wire in the jet and this is what they came up with including NBAA IFR reserves:

Normal Cruise - M 0.85 Range: 2,613nm
Long Range Cruise - M 0.82 Range: 2,767nm
Intermediate Cruise - M 0.90 Range: 1,889nm
High Speed Cruise -M 0.92 Range: 773nm
MMO - M 0.92M

Takeoff distance 5,140ft.
(SL,ISA, MGTOW)

Landing distance 3,410ft.
(SL,ISA,MLW)

Initial Altitude FL 430

When ballasted for 4 passengers the engineers got:

M 0.85 - 2,978 nm
M 0.82 - 3,098 nm
M 0.92 - Not Tested

The test crew observed that the highest cruise speeds occured in the mid- 30's, but fuel consumption increased by almost 50 percent. Flying in the 40's dropped cruise speed by 25 to 35 knots, but available cruise speed was still up to 499 knots.



In the last 12 months US Bank grounded then sold their Citation Xs and General Motors, citing a lack of reliability in their five Citation Xs, replaced them with Gulfstream G350s.

GV

 

[AIR2MUD]

i suppose it could have come from a citation crew as well. don't you think?:smash:

No, Citations at TEB never seem to be in a hurry...

 

[banned username 2]

You have educated me to the possibility that a straight winged jet may not be a jet at all. In your honor, I will never say my mach number when queried by ATC, I will reply with KIAS only (danged embarrassing anyway).

That thing actually has a Mach Meter in it?!?!!?

Just Kidding!

 

[cezzna]

Oh yeah!!! Well my dad can beat up your dad.
My girlfriend has bigger t!ts than yours (who was her plastic surgeon anyway!)
My Mustang will blow your vette's doors off biatch!
I'll see you at recess!

You're all a buncha PUNKS!

 

[Groundpounder]

How much does it REALLY matter what you fly (unless its a Hansa Jet or something else that is total junk)? Isn't pay and QOL more a factor? I'd rather fly a Citation 1, and have a great boss and a big paycheck, then fly a G550 and have to deal with an a-hole boss and make crap for money.

I'm not a pro-pilot, but isn't that what most people think?

 

[flybrowntails]

this is a fun thread to read.

 

[Gulfstream 200]

How much does it REALLY matter what you fly (unless its a Hansa Jet or something else that is total junk)? Isn't pay and QOL more a factor? I'd rather fly a Citation 1, and have a great boss and a big paycheck, then fly a G550 and have to deal with an a-hole boss and make crap for money.

I'm not a pro-pilot, but isn't that what most people think?

big paycheck in a Citation I as opposed to crap money in a G550?

just not how it works pounder.

Now, one can argue they like to stay home more and love the Citation, but they are usually full of crap and would jump on the opportunity to fly a G5 for a good company and make G money.

It also works the other way...lots of G flyers always say "hey, Id kill to fly a King Air...har,har" but again, they are full of crap, thier G-esus Egos would shatter and they would shrivel up if they had to give up that left seat perch in a G5.



(Just a generalization)

 

[semperfido]

..lots of G flyers always say "hey, Id kill to fly a King Air...har,har" but again, they are full of crap, thier G-esus Egos would shatter and they would shrivel up if they had to give up that left seat perch in a G5.

hmmm- not exactly--in about 6 yrs, i would love to fly a nice c90 or some other variation on the theme, just enough to stay current ( i can barely stay current now).

 

[banned username 2]

It also works the other way...lots of G flyers always say "hey, Id kill to fly a King Air...har,har" but again, they are full of crap, thier G-esus Egos would shatter and they would shrivel up if they had to give up that left seat perch in a G5.

Ouch! Being a "G-Pilot" myself, I can honestly say if I could get a very secure (yeah right) job flying a King Air 300 in Iowa somewhere, flying a couple days a week for $150,000+ base salary and a good retirement, I would probably jump at it! The problem is, those jobs just don't exist... So if you wanna make the money, you gotta fly the metal... Just the facts of life!

Until they come knockin', I'll just continue sluggin' around in the G-V...

 

[Gulfstream 200]

Ouch! Being a "G-Pilot" myself, I can honestly say if I could get a very secure (yeah right) job flying a King Air 300 in Iowa somewhere, flying a couple days a week for $150,000+ base salary and a good retirement, I would probably jump at it! The problem is, those jobs just don't exist... So if you wanna make the money, you gotta fly the metal... Just the facts of life!

Until they come knockin', I'll just continue sluggin' around in the G-V...

HA!

You might have some competition on that job Capt!

Guys, I was really kinda joking....just making the point to pounder that if you want the bucks ya gotta go away on the bigger equip....just a fact I suppose..the "bigger suitcase" is not for your clothes, its for your MONEY!...(haha)

Everyone wants that stable Fortune 10 job thats pay top dollar, puts you in a GV, and you only fly as far as Florida - 2X a month for an overnight....in casual dress and unlimited expenses.

 

[banned username 2]

Everyone wants that stable Fortune 10 job thats pay top dollar, puts you in a GV, and you only fly as far as Florida - 2X a month for an overnight....in casual dress and unlimited expenses.

Sign me up! I'll even fly as far as California (however, that would only be once a month in that case)...

 

[Gulfstream 200]

Sign me up! I'll even fly as far as California (however, that would only be once a month in that case)...

and my family comes with me..

Hey Capt - feel good to come home nonstop the other day?

 

[banned username 2]

and my family comes with me..

Hey Capt - feel good to come home nonstop the other day?

Was very nice, made the trip much easier! I'll take 11+10 non-stop anyday over 8+00 and another 4+00...

 

[HawkerF/O]

Ouch! Being a "G-Pilot" myself, I can honestly say if I could get a very secure (yeah right) job flying a King Air 300 in Iowa somewhere, flying a couple days a week for $150,000+ base salary and a good retirement, I would probably jump at it! The problem is, those jobs just don't exist... So if you wanna make the money, you gotta fly the metal... Just the facts of life!

Until they come knockin', I'll just continue sluggin' around in the G-V...

I am finding out those jobs do exist. You just don't hear about them cause the guys lucky enough to have that kind of job aren't stupid enough to talk about it. Would you? Give me a job flying a B200 around the Midwest and the boss goes only if I want to and I make 150K with a 12K car allowence, I fly 8 days a month, but if I want to fly more the boss tells me to take the airplane and go practice, boss does not believe in taking a trip unless it is scheduled 4 weeks in advance (never on weekends or holdays, just Tue-Thurs) and to top it all off, 30K bonus December 1st every year. If I had that and you asked me what I did for a living, the conversation would go just like this:
You: What do you do for a living?
Me: I am in aviation
You: Are you a Pilot?
Me: Yes
You: What kind of plane do you fly?
Me: One of those prop jobs
You: Oh, you didn't want to be a real pilot and go fly for the airlines?
Me: Exactly