The Upcoming Structural Pilot Shortage is REAL - merged

[Andy]

photo, it is the truth, maybe as Jack Nicholson said in a Few Good Men, "You can't stand the truth" I don't see anything in the post that does not reflect reality of today's job market. The worldwide pilot shortage is real, and it is growing in the US. The signs on the lower end of the hiring chain are having trouble finding qualiifed pilots

The truth? Puleaze!
The lower end is NOT having a problem finding qualified people; there are plenty of 250 hour wonders out there who are ready to fly for (what amounts to) less than minimum wage. There may be a shortage of 2500 hr pilots willing to do that, but the lower end will continue to lower standards until the supply meets the demand.
The lower end of the hiring chain pays sub-McDonald's fry cook wages. There seems to be an infinite supply of idiots who are willing to live in their parents' basement for life because 'they fly for the love of it' or whatever rediculous line you want to use. Once the 250 hour wonders become scarce, look for ab initio training to start blossoming.
All the while, wages will stay in the crapper.

 

[pilotyip]

andy you know they never lower thier standards. They just redefine thier competitive hiring minimums.

 

[Checks]

There is no pilot shortage. When regional airlines are still paying pilot less than 20K a year then there is no shortage!

 

[pilotyip]

There is a growing quality shortage reflected in the redefinition of competitve hiring minimums on the entry level. BTW the $20K is a starting pay, a chance to build time in order to be able to move on to your next job. Someplace like USA Jet where you start at $36K as a DA-20 FO and have a chance to move into scheduled DC-9 passenger service in your first year at the company.

 

[Andy]

There is a growing quality shortage reflected in the redefinition of competitve hiring minimums on the entry level. BTW the $20K is a starting pay, a chance to build time in order to be able to move on to your next job. Someplace like USA Jet where you start at $36K as a DA-20 FO and have a chance to move into scheduled DC-9 passenger service in your first year at the company.

Pilotyip, what is your job at USA Jet? Are you a management puke? Recruiting? What?
Look, the top end of pilot wages is collapsing (mark my words, freight will have it's day of wage pain). The bottom end will continue to remain low; I expect it to go lower.
I wish that there were less people out there pumping sunshine up people's anuses and take off the rose colored glasses.
Most of us enjoy flying. Personally, I view putting food on the table as a higher priority than flying an airplane. But to each his own.

 

[pilotyip]

Andy thanks for the plug, always recruiting, always, as I have said on the lower end of business the pilot pool is drying up, so it takes a constant effort to keep 12 pilots in the pool. Fortunately we have almost no turnover which allows us to still be selective. Believe it or not, guys actually like working here until hired at someplace like FedEx. Plus I wanted to let guys know they don't have to suffer in the regional cockpit, there are other jobs out there that pay better than 18K to start.

 

[Andy]

Pilotyip, don't forget to mention the fine print. Have to live in the Willow Run area; have to be on beeper with a 20 min response time. The devil's in the details.
Silly question. If you have very little turnover, why do you have to constantly recruit? Is your annual growth rate in the three digit range?

 

[pilotyip]

Andy, we never hide the fine print, in fact we a have a 1/2-hour orientation for interviewees that gives them the complete facts of life at good ole YIP. We have about a 10% turnover, guys leave for other jobs. Like flying 74's for Connie, Atlas etc, Airtran, Spirit, guys look for career positions outside of on-demand cargo. We wish them well and say kind things about them to their next employer. It is a family thing. We hire 8-10 pilots per year, average guy had been here 6 years, ave. DC-9 Capt over 10 years. BTW again thanks for the plug, people are going to think you are my straight man

 

[Andy]

Ah, you're management. No wonder I haven't been able to get straight answers from you.
That also explains your tag line, "Fly because you like to, if you are in it for the respect, prestige, recognition or money you may be disappointed." Let me interpret for those that don't speak managementese. 'We're looking for gullible individuals who will work for peanuts for the love of the job. We will not respect them, reward them, acknowledge their contributions, and we will certainly not pay them a decent wage.'

 

[Checks]

I wanted to work for USA Jet, and still might one day, but after seeing how much it cost to live in YIP and the fact I needed to support a family I decided to pass on even applying. Seems like a good company but is pay and QOL really that good after a few years on the job? It seems like over the last few years that you guys are always in some kind of roller coaster cycle. Up one month and hiring like crazy, down the next. I personnally like some stability if I am only going to make less than 50K a year and ask my family to relocate.

 

[pilotyip]

Checks, stability in the on-demand business, I think that is one of those oxymorons. Check out the Ameristar thread. Fortunately our passenger business is growing at good pace, just based one in Long Beach for the West Coast market. Maybe have 5 DC-9's on charter this winter

 

[Andy]

Pilotyip, my apologies on any personal attacks. We disagree on the direction of the industry, but I fouled by personalizing my opinions.
I don't like industry trends, and I don't think that they will improve.
I'm sure that USA Jet is a great company; it's just not something that I want to do. I wouldn't want to fly for Southwest, fractionals, or private bizjets.
My goal in life is to fly a widebody on international routes. At my age, I will never see the left seat of a widebody at United, but I'm OK with sitting in the right seat until the end of my career.

Tailwinds.

 

[ExAF]

What?

Sarcasm On: Hey...this is FlightInfo.com. Apologies aren't allowed here. No fair trying to reverse a personal attack. One is right and one is wrong. You are not allowed to disagree. Now get back on that horse and start riding again! OK sarcasm off. Its a slow day.

 

[atpcliff]

Hi!

ExAF:
I did a decent amount of F4-G refueling in Iraq War I. It was pretty fun. My T-38 IP, who was awesome, was an RF-4 guy out of England-Mildenhall???

C U!
cliff
YIP

 

[ground_fog]

I am a Software consultant. My Wife actually wants me to be a Pilot so I am home more. You guys think you travel much-I'm gone 25 days a month.