Tab express

[bobbysamd]

Paying the TAB

OK, Pub, it's always valuable to receive information from all sides.

The question remains is if it is worth it for a rated pilot to shell out a minimum of $46,500 for what is the bottom-line of the course, 100 hours of King Air time, for a crapshoot at a job, given current hiring (I was looking at the Commercial Multi Engine/Instrument to Job option). I don't count the 100 hours of sim time. So, that is $465 an hour for King Air time. How much of this time is legal PIC? Is any of it? I'd check it out thoroughly before committing that kind of money.

The place also has the six-month Zero time to a job (357 hrs total) for a minimum of $63,711. For one thing, unless you graduate from MAPD you won't get a regional job with 350 hours - under any circumstances, even in good times. I see nowhere where any part of the program is Part 141. For that kind of money, I would want at least part of it to be 141 with self-examining authority. Not seeing that tells me I have to visit a DE periodically - and pay him/her his $200-$400 every time. Four practical tests (Private, Instrument, Commercial-Multi) at maybe $300 a pop average is another $1.2K minimum, assuming the DE doesn't charge double for the Commercial-Multi-Instrument. I can get a full 141 program at MAPD with a real chance to interview with Mesa Airlines for less money.

Frankly, I think TAB is a noble concept - to train new pilots to airline standards and get them turbine time ab initio. I wanted to be a flight instructor in that kind of environment. However, for the pilot/consumer, it needs to be considered carefully, with the "pilot shortage" malarkey and airline connections claims disregarded.

Once again, good luck with your decision.

PS-I don't doubt, Pub, that the place is quality; how can any place that sells me 100 hours of Kingair time be anything but quality? Just the same, for the reasons I enumerated above, one would have to think about it carefully to ensure one is leaving with skills that can be marketed immediately.

 

[TriDriver]

chperpilot

Thanks for you comments about the TAB F/Os you've flown with. We think we turn out a pretty good airline ready F/O.

When TAB Express was starting their progarm about 1-1/2 years ago, they looked at the airline industry and tried to figure out what kind of pilot a regional airline would want to hire. Typically, the pool of pilots ready to be hired at a regional had a background of going through their initial training, then being a CFI until they had about 1500 hours, very little of it ME, virtually none of it multi-crew. TAB decided an airline would like a pilot that has flown multi-engine, mult-crew, pressurized, turbine equipment, in a simulated airline type operation. That's the program they set up.

Instead of the advanced training part of the program being getting a CFI, TAB's advanced training is the King Air. It's a good concept - basically just like the military where they train you to fly your aircraft you're going to fly in your tactical unit. A military trained pilot gets into the right seat of a P-3/C-130/C-17, etc. or right into a single seat jet, when they've only got a couple hundred hours.

The STUDENT'S problem at TAB is, when a student finishes up, they don't have the CFI, which is the most common entry level aviation job. The traditional measure of a pilot is hours, and no matter how good a pilot coming out of any program is, if they only have 400 to 500 hours, they are not considered serioulsy for employment at a regional airline.

The COMPANY'S problem at TAB is that, even though they turn out a good product, nobody (except Colgan) knows it. They don't have any kind of track record with the industy yet. If the students don't get hired, the word will get out and they won't have any new enrollment.

Again, thanks for your comments about your TAB trained F/Os at Colgan.

Bob the TriDriver

 

[publisher]

quality

Bobby,

The program is quality. Whether it is worth it, that is up to the individual.

I think that there are a number of carriers that will have no problem with this and the hours if a bit of hiring gets going like Chicago Express, Eagle , adn that type.

 

[C601]

I would like to consider TAB as a school i would go to for my training, but taking out a loan the best part of $80,000 during these times, i feel would be a big mistake.

I really wonder after you have completed your flight training what type of jobs you would be applying for at 400hrs TT even at the best of times as stated above you would be very luckly to get a job. The lowest i have heard was 700hrs TT.

And how many students who have completed this course have actually got a F/O job.

Any students from TAB out there care to comment .

 

[chperplt]

I really wonder after you have completed your flight training what type of jobs you would be applying for at 400hrs TT even at the best of times as stated above you would be very luckly to get a job. The lowest i have heard was 700hrs TT.

Like I said above, Colgan has hired a few 400-500 hour TT pilot from TAB. They go into the right seat of a 1900D making $20 an hour.

 

[kilomike]

One very expensive flight school!!

I could not fathom borrowing $80,000 to attend a flight school! That sounds awfully expensive and with the industry being in so much difficulty these days a real gamble. The return on investment particularly if one looks at regional airline salaries for pilots is a very poor ROI. I am an electrical apprentice with the IBEW and I make more than many commuter pilots do (and I think this is shameful!). Those pilots are responsible for people's lives. Yes, I too am responsible--for wiring a place properly so it does not burn down but still!!!

 

[Timebuilder]

Hey, Kilo-

Good to see you still around. I'll bet you can see 1900 boxes and THHN wire in your sleep these days. I remember my time as a "wire nut". How's your conduit bending coming along? I made some pretty weird shapes at first.

 

[C601]

Course Prices

The course itself is only $62,000 but after living costs, food, fees and everything that goes with it, i was told that most students take out the max loan which is $80,000

Again the same was total to me with ATA, students take out the max loan $80,000

It is very expensive, but when you look at the cost only and see FSI is costing $60,000+ just for the cost for there Career Course, overall Tab express it does not look like a bad deal considering your getting time in a kingair.

 

[Timebuilder]

In my opinion, you are better off with all of your instructor tickets from a school that can employ you. Get someone to pay you to fly a King Air, if that's what you want.

 

[C601]

here is somthing to think about

Take out a loan for $80,000.00

I factored in 150months for the term of the loan to repay it back assuming you can get that time

Simple Interest Rate 1% ( yes i know its impossible)

Your Monthly Payment Will Be $666


Your Total Interest Cost Will Be $920006.10

Heres what is surprising even with a 1% interest rate.......

Minimum annual salary
to handle these payments: $1000006.00

makes me pissed when i see GA F/Os making $8/hr how do TAB ATA ever expect you to repay a loan like that back. makes me madd they expect you to take out so much and earn so little ;(

again assuming yr lucky to get a job.