SWAPA wants all FAPA Pilots

[Porch]

Talking with my buddy today he said Lynx has at least 2 FO's that he knows of that got fired from Mesa! Can't wait!

What doesn't kill ya, makes you stronger... I know of a bunch of dudes fired from there. They must be cool!

 

[luv2fly]

Depending on what it was for, it could be a badge of honor

Very True!

 

[bmxandjets]

what about all the SWA poolies..? we gonna take a back seat to the Frontier dudes you think? my timing sucks..

 

[Tejas-Jet]

what about all the SWA poolies..? we gonna take a back seat to the Frontier dudes you think? my timing sucks..

Thats a good question......?

 

[Cometman]

It appears that a large percentage of people on this site agree that if SWA wins the bid they could operate F9 as a seperate company. This is assuming that the SWA union SWAPA agrees with that. Now lets also assume that SWAPA gives the company a go ahead with the purchase and they will allow SWA to operate it as a stand alone for up to 2 years (or whatever period of time). During this time SWA gradually eliminates the Air Bus and the flying is picked up by SWA with the 737. F9 employees will be let go and they will have the option of interviewing with SWA. Naturally they will be on the bottom of the list.

If this can be done why would SWA do anything but this. It will not cost them the added pay protection, benefits etc. and no regulations involved.

This would be easier and cheaper than a staple with all the other benefits.

I do not think that the regulations prohibit a company from purchasing another company and operating them as 2 seperate companies. If anybody has a differnt opion please sate it. Otherwise Republic would be one company instead of several differnt companies operating seperately?

 

[Dan Roman]

Talking with my buddy today he said Lynx has at least 2 FO's that he knows of that got fired from Mesa! Can't wait!

1)You are aware that it is very common for pilots to make up those kind of things, especially coincidental when SWA is looking at F9 and a lot of pilots will make things up to suit their own personal agenda?
2) Even if true, getting fired from Mesa may say more about the type of operation Mesa is rather than anything about the pilot.

 

[Cometman]

1)You are aware that it is very common for pilots to make up those kind of things, especially coincidental when SWA is looking at F9 and a lot of pilots will make things up to suit their own personal agenda?
2) Even if true, getting fired from Mesa may say more about the type of operation Mesa is rather than anything about the pilot.

I agree with you.

 

[GuppyWN]

I know one a$$hold at F9 that was fired from WN. I'd sure like for him to jerk gear for me. See you soon Jimmy boy!

Gup

 

[PCL_128]

It appears that a large percentage of people on this site agree that if SWA wins the bid they could operate F9 as a seperate company. This is assuming that the SWA union SWAPA agrees with that. Now lets also assume that SWAPA gives the company a go ahead with the purchase and they will allow SWA to operate it as a stand alone for up to 2 years (or whatever period of time). During this time SWA gradually eliminates the Air Bus and the flying is picked up by SWA with the 737. F9 employees will be let go and they will have the option of interviewing with SWA. Naturally they will be on the bottom of the list.

If this can be done why would SWA do anything but this. It will not cost them the added pay protection, benefits etc. and no regulations involved.

This would be easier and cheaper than a staple with all the other benefits.

I do not think that the regulations prohibit a company from purchasing another company and operating them as 2 seperate companies. If anybody has a differnt opion please sate it. Otherwise Republic would be one company instead of several differnt companies operating seperately?

No regulations prohibit it, but the FAPA scope language does, and SWA would be required to adhere to the language unless they got FAPA to waive it. If SWA slowly started getting rid of F9 airplanes and using the old gates, slots, ramp workers, or anything for their use, then the scope clause kicks in and requires an integration.

 

[4 Fan Trashcan]

what about all the SWA poolies..? we gonna take a back seat to the Frontier dudes you think? my timing sucks..

We'll know more on Tuesday I guess. I'm sure that SWA remembers the guys and gals who met the 1000 or 1300 PIC mins, got the type (the majority in last round), interviewed and then started smoking a pack a day while waiting for either the letter or call. But bidness is bidness. My thought is that IF (big IF) there are classes in the next 2 years while F9 is operating separately, then there's a glimmer of hope that the pool could get drained before the staple/SLI/whatever happens.

 

[Cometman]

No regulations prohibit it, but the FAPA scope language does, and SWA would be required to adhere to the language unless they got FAPA to waive it. If SWA slowly started getting rid of F9 airplanes and using the old gates, slots, ramp workers, or anything for their use, then the scope clause kicks in and requires an integration.

So, what you are saying is that if SWA operates F9 as a seperate company they can never close the operation? If they do decide to close it they would have to take all the employees? That doesn't sound right. I think the regulations refer to one company merging both operations into one operation. I know some will say that if they use 50+% of the assets then the regulations would take hold. If SWA decided to close the doors what per centage of the assests would be kept? I think they could do just that. That is the reason why I think F9 should accept the offer if the offer is what everybody thinks.

 

[PCL_128]

So, what you are saying is that if SWA operates F9 as a seperate company they can never close the operation? If they do decide to close it they would have to take all the employees? That doesn't sound right. I think the regulations refer to one company merging both operations into one operation. I know some will say that if they use 50+% of the assets then the regulations would take hold. If SWA decided to close the doors what per centage of the assests would be kept? I think they could do just that. That is the reason why I think F9 should accept the offer if the offer is what everybody thinks.

You don't seem to understand that regulations are not the only thing in play here. Contracts are also at issue. The pilots at F9 are represented by FAPA, and they have a legally binding collective bargaining agreement. That CBA requires that if any airline purchases them and starts to use their assets for their own operation, they are required to integrate.

 

[Cometman]

So, when SWA starts to get rid of their aircraft and the writing is on the wall that their company is about to be gone, what does the contract say about that? A contract with no company doesn't seem to be worth much. What a gamble for F9 to make. It seems like if F9 should take a definite if they are offered it. I guess we will have to wait until the official bids are in and see what the 2 groups decide. If I was F9 I think I would want to take the best offer and not take a chance.

 

[crashpad]

Hey, life is a chance. It's just the carnage left behind by RAH at Midwest is still fresh in everyones' mind.

It's really a no-brainer. WN is a great major airline with very similar culture. RAH is a feeder with zero experience in running a major airline.

 

[Splert]

You don't seem to understand that regulations are not the only thing in play here. Contracts are also at issue. The pilots at F9 are represented by FAPA, and they have a legally binding collective bargaining agreement. That CBA requires that if any airline purchases them and starts to use their assets for their own operation, they are required to integrate.

What you are saying that as a condition of purchase F9/FAPA will not have to give that up like TWA/ALPA.

Should have been a MBA...

 

[PCL_128]

What you are saying that as a condition of purchase F9/FAPA will not have to give that up like TWA/ALPA.

Should have been a MBA...

Yes, that's correct, but FAPA is in a better position than TWA ALPA was, because they have two suitors rather than one. If they refuse SWA's demands to waive their scope, they have RAH in their back pocket that has vowed to operate them separately.

 

[Falcon Jet 1]

One thing you dont seem to understand is that FAPA has no say in which way Frontier goes, it is up to the bankruptcy judge, creditors, bidders, etc.

 

[Cardinal]

My thought is that IF (big IF) there are classes in the next 2 years while F9 is operating separately, then there's a glimmer of hope that the pool could get drained before the staple/SLI/whatever happens.

The "snapshot" for seniority purposes looks back to the date of the announcement of the deal, not consumation. Reference the Nicolau award, the reference date is the date the merger agreeement was first announced and put forward in bk court.

 

[4 Fan Trashcan]

The "snapshot" for seniority purposes looks back to the date of the announcement of the deal, not consumation. Reference the Nicolau award, the reference date is the date the merger agreeement was first announced and put forward in bk court.

I guess we'll just have to wait until Tuesday...and probably longer for the M & A lawyers to get into the language before we can make any proclaimations on when/how any snapshot would be taken.

 

[California]

I'm sure that SWA remembers the guys and gals who met the 1000 or 1300 PIC mins, got the type (the majority in last round), interviewed and then started smoking a pack a day while waiting for either the letter or call.

damn, that is funny! thank you, i needed that.

that was a longest three months of my life. (one month before the interview, and two months waiting to find out the results)