I don't believe your story. But even if it is true, then it sounds like you were acting like just as much a dick as they were.
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SWAPA Comments about 717
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I don't believe your story. But even if it is true, then it sounds like you were acting like just as much a dick as they were.
trip
Well-known member
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- Jul 22, 2002
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- 878
More likely you creeped them out, then scared the hel out of em with your Captain rant BS.
tankerhead
62 percenter.
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My thoughts exactly. Hopefully they packed their lunch for the day, because this Capt isn't getting them s$%t.
Lear70
JAFFO
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True that.
We call it "Atlantitude". You'll understand in a few years.
Until then, not saying your story is untrue, but I wouldn't make a call on the pilots or mechanics based on a few of our flight attendants.
If you have any doubt as to how our pilots are dealing with it, Southwest Management has added a "handling grief" module to our recurrent training and has asked ALPA to activate our CIRP team (Critical Incident Response), paid them for trip pulls to put them in crew rooms to help handle the stress, give them someone to vent to before they go flying with everything pent up, etc.
It's not just a few hotheads.
Lear70
JAFFO
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I don't know, I've been on vacation all last week and all this week, so I'm not in the crew room to gauge what the general undertone is, but judging by our message board, I'm seeing people who have never posted before or only posted once or twice in the last couple years or so coming out and venting their anger and frustration.
I think the hardest thing is going into this merger thinking things were going to get better than when they were under our previous management and, so far, most line pilots are only seeing negatives and having a hard time looking at the positives, especially when you get hit hard a 2nd time plus I'm getting a lot of phone calls and text messages about people worried about getting furloughed.
If you're EXPECTING that kind of thing, you can prepare for it mentally and be OK. When it's not what you were expecting, you have to adjust to it as it happens and still come to work, and for some that's harder than others. Everyone deals with grief in a different way and losing your Captain's seat (and a lot of pay that would have come with it in the left seat at SWA) or losing your quality of life (for our senior 200+ F/O's who bid the 717 out of seniority when they COULD have held the 737, foregoing the pay to keep their bidding power on the 717) is definitely not a "happy moment".
I'm glad SWA has activated our CIRP team. I've been urging people to stay professional, come to work, do their job, and standby for what ALPA can do in conjunction with SWA management to address the problems, but it's one thing to do so over the message board or text message and another to be face to face with someone you can vent to, get it temporarily out of your system, and go out and work with a little less pent-up frustration.
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The one thing I have learned since I have been with SWA is to look and lisent to GK's hints. Like him stomping his feet when he says we are looking to buy some one. This goes along with the 717 is not a good airplane spill. All I can say is, the company has to make business decisions and we are along for the ride.
Know one will get laid off. This is one thing you guys should see. The company takes pride in no furloughs.
Trust if they did not do it in 08 they won't do it now.
Know one will get laid off. This is one thing you guys should see. The company takes pride in no furloughs.
Trust if they did not do it in 08 they won't do it now.
PropPiedmont
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humveedriver
M1165A1
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Generally speaking, I think the pilots are disgusted with the outcome of being bought by the airline that for years has been a role model of financial and worker relations success. Alot of expectations are not going to be met. It at least appears to us that the lions share of sacrifice is on our side of the partion (seniority, 717 and eventually the flying). Some are trying to see what the upside is going to be and not finding it. And going to work somewhere else isn't as easy alot people make it sound. Comparing our situation to the Morris guys, those guys were able to take advantage of the rapid growth SWA enjoyed and got back to the left seat in about 5 years. Many of our guys will be permanent FO's, all because SWA couldn't raise it's ticket prices without getting rid of us first. I know it just business. But there is a human element too and we were hoping the "one luv" theme was more than just a catch phrase of the hour.
?????? Do you know?????
Its a merger, they suck for the labor groups....for all the angst on the AAI side remember we have former AAI Pilots here that will be junior to their former coworkers (former AAI CPs too), we have many FOs who will be displaced from MCO, BWI, DAL, HOU etc...and will have their upgrades delayed because they have former AAI pilots (who are younger) in front of them forever, we have pilots who bought type ratings ($8-10K, peanut butter sandwiches for a long time)...it sucks for everyone so man up, its a merger...
or is it throw?
humveedriver
M1165A1
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Have you upgraded yet? I know you were close.
HVD,
Yes, at 10.5 years, I am lucky, but plan on being a reserve Cappy for years and possibly downgraded to FO again in 2015 (as a result of the 717's going away...less airframes)...I fly with a lot of 80-90K SWA FOs...they have some real issues on SL10 and the fallout of AAI pilots getting on the list ahead of them...
Yes, at 10.5 years, I am lucky, but plan on being a reserve Cappy for years and possibly downgraded to FO again in 2015 (as a result of the 717's going away...less airframes)...I fly with a lot of 80-90K SWA FOs...they have some real issues on SL10 and the fallout of AAI pilots getting on the list ahead of them...
fletch717
Well-known member
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Well so many. fo's wouldn't be displaced if SWA hadn't taken every capt seat, as for upgrading over an older SWA pilot, After a 30+ percent seniority loss. That argument doesn't really work. Remember we brought all of our seats with us. You didn't add 1700 pilots who needed a plane to fly.
so many. fo's wouldn't be displaced if SWA hadn't taken every capt seat,
Not sure of your logic here, but I am not that smart and will assume you are right...but if we are going down memory lane, let's not forget SL-9 with 10 year seat locks for AAI CPs and SWA pay for everyone...not good enough for the MEC...the bed has been made, sleep in it!!
Not sure of your logic here, but I am not that smart and will assume you are right...but if we are going down memory lane, let's not forget SL-9 with 10 year seat locks for AAI CPs and SWA pay for everyone...not good enough for the MEC...the bed has been made, sleep in it!!
fletch717
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Don't forget the 35 percent seniority loss with the first deal. And no AirTran FO upgraded until every SWA pilot on the seniority list upgraded. Yeah how stupid of us to pass on that one.
scoreboardII
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fletch717
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I wouldn't say anything if SWA pilots would stop telling us how bad they are getting screwed in this deal.
boeing717
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- 60
Get over it. It is getting old listening to guys complain. You voted for it now live with it. It won't make a difference 50 years from now anyway. If you really do not like it quit. Most people do not really care how you feel. If you die today the first question people ask is what was their seniority number. Does that tell you what really matters?
fletch717
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I'm not the one complaining, and believe me I am over it. I really don't care anymore, about anything.
I tend to agree, and this is what I've been telling people who are worried about furloughs. But some of them respond with "yeah, but SWA doesn't really see us as their employees." And frankly, that's a valid argument. We've consistently been treated as outsiders, not as SWA employees. So, would SWA have as much hesitation in getting rid of us as they would a "real" SWA pilot? I don't know.
dicko
"It's a formidable scent"
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Not quite.
SWA management asked our MEC to be in the crew room for the announcement of the event that they claimed was merely a rumor. The MEC declined and offered the CIRP team instead.
dicko
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An AirTran CA made that bed for you Jack, just before 'Papi' kicked him out of it for you. With a metaphorical gun to his head.
Just thinking
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Does any of this really matter.... it all sucks
He will do whatever he wants with no regard for anyone. Just wait until he comes for his pound of flesh SWAPA.
Nobody will tell gk how to run his company. Nobody in the hierarchy will tell the emperor he has no clothes.
Single engine taxi will save millions.... Not how WE do it (yeah I know they have finally adopted this procedure.) Put extra seats in the aircraft and then have to block them out because they can't get the weight and balance accomplished for months..... Operate the engines this way with supporting date from Boeing to show the millions of dollars to be saved.... that is not how WE do it. Dispatch an aircraft past "herb" time to keep utilization rate high earning millions..... We don't do that.
SWA may have purchased lowly AirTran but in doing so they have pulled back the curtain and many have seen the money that is wasted and it is disgusting. Maybe gk bought AirTran to drag SWA into the 1990's. Unfortunately they are not poised to succeed and they playing catch up at best.
He will do whatever he wants with no regard for anyone. Just wait until he comes for his pound of flesh SWAPA.
Nobody will tell gk how to run his company. Nobody in the hierarchy will tell the emperor he has no clothes.
Single engine taxi will save millions.... Not how WE do it (yeah I know they have finally adopted this procedure.) Put extra seats in the aircraft and then have to block them out because they can't get the weight and balance accomplished for months..... Operate the engines this way with supporting date from Boeing to show the millions of dollars to be saved.... that is not how WE do it. Dispatch an aircraft past "herb" time to keep utilization rate high earning millions..... We don't do that.
SWA may have purchased lowly AirTran but in doing so they have pulled back the curtain and many have seen the money that is wasted and it is disgusting. Maybe gk bought AirTran to drag SWA into the 1990's. Unfortunately they are not poised to succeed and they playing catch up at best.
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