SWA or DAL?

[Chubaka]

Delta has great company culture so if that is your main reason for SWA than I would look at DAL for similiar reasons. I am fairly new to the Delta family but I have been extremelly impressed how well the company treats and values their employees. I am biased but I would say it rivals what SWA has in terms of corporate culture.

What about the Delta flight attendants that are being routinely failed out of door training lately. Some with many years with the company. Non union of course.

 

[nwaf16dude]

What about the Delta flight attendants that are being routinely failed out of door training lately. Some with many years with the company. Non union of course.

If they are busting out the fat, old, or gay ones, I think everyone would see that as a plus.

 

[GuppyWN]

W2's and days off.

Until you have an offer from both, does it really matter?

Gup

 

[General Lee]

W2's and days off.

Until you have an offer from both, does it really matter?

Gup

I am pretty sure he was asking because he was trying to figure out NOW whether or not he should invest thousands of dollars in a 737 type. So sure, it does matter.

Gup likes to brag that they have high W2's now, and that could be matched or better at Delta in the future. Delta actually has pretty good first year pay. He also states days off is important, and picking the right plane at Delta could give the same result, being a line holder quicker on a narrowbody at Delta vs a widebody early on.

I say look 5 to 10 years down the road. After the merger is complete with Airtran, the young guys there will merge into the SWA list and upgrades will likely slowdown. Delta has scheduled retirements in the thousands over the next 10 years. Southwest does not, and their own pilots are famous for trying to extend their employment as long as the can.

Then look at the flying. The intial poster said he didn't really care what he did at work, rather looking at what he can do at home. If he doesn't care about the layovers, the SWA is the airline for him, because after that many legs per day and per trip, he honestly won't remember where he's been. It won't really matter. At Delta, there are plenty of productive trips, but memorable layovers in some exotic places also. It may take a few years to get there, but 5 leg days ending in El Paso won't be there, year after year, after year. Think about 30 years of El Paso and St Louis? How about one word: LUBBOCK. And before you throw Africa stuff in there, you can bid away and never do it again. It's a base thing. Certain bases never do it. Two bases do. You can bid away and stay away. Or, you can bid the plane when you are senior enough not to bid it. I still haven't done Africa, and won't. Just remember: LUBBOCK.


Bye Bye---General Lee

 

[Bill Nelson]

Delta has scheduled retirements in the thousands over the next 10 years. Southwest does not,

Not true, 1/3 of our list will retire in the next 10 years.

 

[GuppyWN]

I am pretty sure he was asking because he was trying to figure out NOW whether or not he should invest thousands of dollars in a 737 type. So sure, it does matter.

No type rating required to apply.

Gup likes to brag that they have high W2's now, and that could be matched or better at Delta in the future. In the future? Let's bet on the now, not the come. Delta actually has pretty good first year pay. He also states days off is important, and picking the right plane at Delta could give the same result, being a line holder quicker on a narrowbody at Delta vs a widebody early on. No argument.

I say look 5 to 10 years down the road. He's asking now, not 5-10 years down the road. After the merger is complete with Airtran, the young guys there will merge into the SWA list and upgrades will likely slowdown. Not likely, guaranteed. Delta has scheduled retirements in the thousands over the next 10 years. Southwest does not, and their own pilots are famous for trying to extend their employment as long as the can. Delta has more retirements in the future.

Then look at the flying. The intial poster said he didn't really care what he did at work, rather looking at what he can do at home. If he doesn't care about the layovers, the SWA is the airline for him, because after that many legs per day and per trip, he honestly won't remember where he's been. 3 day trip, 10 legs, 22 credits. It won't really matter. At Delta, there are plenty of productive trips, but memorable layovers in some exotic places also. Last time I checked your MD80's overnight in Birmingham too big boy. It may take a few years to get there, but 5 leg days ending in El Paso won't be there, year after year, after year. Think about 30 years of El Paso and St Louis? How about one word: LUBBOCK. And before you throw Africa stuff in there, you can bid away and never do it again. It's a base thing. Certain bases never do it. Two bases do. You can bid away and stay away. Or, you can bid the plane when you are senior enough not to bid it. I still haven't done Africa, and won't. Just remember: LUBBOCK.

Just remember $250k last year........ on reserve.


Bye Bye---General Lee

If you wanna piss....... let's piss.

Gup

 

[nimtz]

Like someone else said, just take a look around this forum. You can get enough information from this board, just by reading some of the dribble that is posted here. Ask yourself, would I want to sit for 3 or 4 days next to some of these guys? Not me, I never applied to Delta, seemed like way too uptight a pilot group for me. I would think that if you even have to ask between SWA or Delta, you belong at Delta. It's like deciding between the Playboy Mansion and The 700 Club Compound, where would you rather spend the weekend? Yeah, it's THAT different.

Could you please direct that sentiment to the Jeszoid LUV capt I overheard trying to 'save' his FO at breakfast in PDX last month.

Sorry hero, every place has it's cool guys and d-bags these days. I fail to see your group worthy of Hefner status cause some of you wear those stylish leather jackets...:erm:

 

[ivauir]

General Lee (et al:flop gut, scope out rjs, FD12 etc)

I hope SOMEDAY you do better than SWA pilots. You fly widebodies! For the sake of the profession you NEED to do better.

Stop trying to drag us down and focus on bringing yourself up.

Peace

 

[General Lee]

General Lee (et al:flop gut, scope out rjs, FD12 etc)

I hope SOMEDAY you do better than SWA pilots. You fly widebodies! For the sake of the profession you NEED to do better.

Stop trying to drag us down and focus on bringing yourself up.

Peace

We did do a lot better than your current contract, that actually helped bring your contract to where it is today. You're welcome. BK thanks to previous management brought it down, along with a $1 billion Comair strike, and other factors like 9-11 hurt too. Regardless, we thank you for keeping the rates high, and we hope to use them as a jumping off point for our future rates. Have a great one.


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[texman]

Not trying to play the middle man, but SWA did become the highest paid by success sharing and default. 911, BK's did not help the legacy's to much. Pay comes and goes though.

 

[Scope out RJ's]

General Lee (et al:flop gut, scope out rjs, FD12 etc)

I hope SOMEDAY you do better than SWA pilots. You fly widebodies! For the sake of the profession you NEED to do better.

Stop trying to drag us down and focus on bringing yourself up.

Peace

ivauir, guppywn, redflyer65 (et al)

You guys brought down the industry many years ago with your pft, lousy wages, commuter type schedules, and benefits, no pension, and of course, the catalysts for age 65.
Thanks to the force of bankruptcy, we were brought down to your level, and in most cases lower.
Stop dragging the industry down and focus on bringing yourselves up.
I can only hope that the merger with Air Tran will bring up the classless attitude that I see here.

 

[stalker]

Scope are you playing on your daddy's computer again?

 

[chase]

Skywiz,

Very reasonable question. You've gotten lots of responses, some emotional, some filled with more facts than emotions. Good luck sorting out the gems from the hot air.

Others have said similar things. List the 5 things you want most in your airline career; money, variety of airplanes to fly, far/near international flying or mostly domestic, job security, labor/management work relationships, quickest upgrade, etc.

Once you have done that, assess the carriers that best match those goals and apply; I would apply to both. BTW, I suspect when the applicant window opens up again for SWA, it may initially be for "typed" pilots only. No official word but just a gut feeling, but if not, apply to both is my recommendation.

One example of how choices may not always work out the way you want them. Recently flew with a DAL '97 hire who came to SWA in the mid-90's (pre bankruptcy). Great guy, great attitude, super flying skills. Drove to work @ DAL, great QOL but concerned about bankruptcy and DAL's future.

Left DAL, came here and is not upgrading as quickly as he thought he would....when he came to SWA, the trend was all towards quicker upgrades at SWA. Bottom line, he'd be a CA at DAL now, would still be driving to work vs. commuting to work, has lost many thousands of dollars by not collecting post bankruptcy payouts to pilots, equity from bankruptcy as well as a CA upgrade pay. I don't believe he was ever furloughed but had concerns about it obviously.

He acknowledges the choice has cost him great sums of $$ but despite that he is very capable, has the "luv" spirit and isn't bitter at all. In hindsight he says he should've stayed but is living with the decision.

DAL on the surface as do other carriers appear to have better upgrades coming in the future. The same was said when I was hired in the late 90's...as well as bigger salaries for the legacies. The big difference is growth will come from retirements not from airline growth as it was "promised" in the late 90's or early '00's.

I luv SWA and feel fortunate to be here, wouldn't want to be anywhere else but it isn't the right fit or choice for everyone, I get that and respect it.

One can have very successful airline carriers at other carriers; timing, leadership at the top and a world of unknown variables that can change a company's future in the blink of an eye will be more of the determining factors of your "success or missed opportunities" in this world we call the airline profession.

Once you choose the top 5 things that are most important to you in your career, go back every year or so and review them and make sure they stay the same; if you become unhappy at your airline it is probably because those priorities have changed or you weren't honest with yourself to begin with. Good luck in your choices.

 

[ivauir]

Scope,

The airline you describe bears no resemblance to the one I work at. You have absolutely no clue.

Stop hating and work on improving your own situation. Good luck to you.

 

[General Lee]

Scope,

The airline you describe bears no resemblance to the one I work at. You have absolutely no clue.

Stop hating and work on improving your own situation. Good luck to you.

It's ironic our situation is getting better due to our merger, while your situation and culture is deteriorating at the same time. I see rough waters ahead for your group if you don't get your acts together and play nice.


Bye Bye---General Lee

 

[Scope out RJ's]

Scope are you playing on your daddy's computer again?

Actually, it's YOUR daddy's computer.
And your mom says hi, and she wants you to clean up your room when you get home.:laugh:

 

[Scope out RJ's]

Scope,

The airline you describe bears no resemblance to the one I work at. You have absolutely no clue.

Stop hating and work on improving your own situation. Good luck to you.

Denial ain't just a river in Egypt, sport.
Besides, looks like your airline is about to resemble the chaos there after the sli is over.:laugh:

 

[waka]

Let me grab some popcorn.
This will go at least 5 pages. I'm not gonna even touch the pft thing at southwest.........

Seriously though, just go with whoever hires you, that's the ticket.

There is no "pft thing" at Southwest.

 

[scoreboardII]

This message is hidden because Scope out RJ's is on your ignore list.
This message is hidden because Scope out RJ's is on your ignore list.

This message is hidden because Scope out RJ's is on your ignore list.

 

[captain caveman]

There's a lot to be said about those productive three day trips at Southwest. It seems that our 4 day trips at Delta on the 88 pay about the same number of hours as a 3 day trip at Southwest. Then throw in our lesser hourly rate and we work more days for way less money. Delta loves to make four day trips on the 88. As an 07 hire at Delta, flying the MD88, I'd have rather spent my first three years at Southwest. Here at Delta, we have a long way to go, but right now if I had to guess, it would be a good long term move.