SWA/ATA revisited

[roughneck]

I just heard from a "management" type on the jumpseat that SWA is looking at ATA's scheduled operations again.

Apparently they looked at buying ATA back in 04 prior to the codeshare deal, but decided against it. Now they are looking at buying ATA to get the etops and Hawaii and Mexico flying.

I asked about the employee group integration and culture issues that always seem to be the deal stopper with SWA and his reply surprised me.

"We won't have a employee integration issue. They will either agree to come over at the bottom of the pilot seniority list, or they can line up in seniority order and turn in applications like everyone else."

We talked about the new Bond/McKatskill ammendment that requires Alegheny/Mohawk to be used and he said that wasn't an issue here. Apparently, SWA legal believes that Global Aero Logistics is "the operation." And the new ammendment only applies if you buy more than 50% of the "operation." They believe that ATA's scheduled service represents less than 50% of the Global Aero Logistics operation and thus this doesn't apply.

I am not trying to stir the pot, but it looks like something is going to happen soon. I hope you guys will take a lesson from the TransStar deal and take the "offer." It will likely mean a pay raise even if you move seats and you will be at a company that you can retire from.

Good Luck.

 

[bravodude]

Please dont take this guy as speaking for us all. DO WHATEVER IT IS YOU GUYS THINK IS RIGHT!

(my own personal opinion is re-interview and then 1-1 integration but its just that my own personal opinion)

 

[CaptSeth]

We'll settle this in court, thank you. And enjoy the assesment SWAPA is going to have to hit you with if you don't go with Alleghany Mohawk.

 

[atafan]

To be honest.

I JUST DON'T CARE ANYMORE!!!!!!

I'd rather sink it than bend over and take it up the back side by another frigging pilot group.

F U

Love ya mean it!

 

[JumpJetter]

Why would buying anyone be necessary? If ATA stops flying those routes, do they go up for sale or something? I don't really understand how it works. SWA is taking 29 new -700s this year, but the net growth is only 5-10 due to -300 retirements. Couldn't SWA gain access to the routes and just utilize their own aircraft by not retiring the -300s as fast? I suppose you would obviously need to gain ETOPS certification on Hawaii bound aircraft, but could they buy a few that may be sold by ATA or even have the aircraft being delivered new from Boeing be certified? Again, don't understand how all that occurs if anyone wants to educate?

It just seems interest in the routes ATA has is not a huge amount and could be covered by current (or lack thereof) growth plans.

 

[atafan]

I suppose you would obviously need to gain ETOPS certification on Hawaii bound aircraft, but could they buy a few that may be sold by ATA or even have the aircraft being delivered new from Boeing be certified? Again, don't understand how all that occurs if anyone wants to educate?

Believe me if SWA could just flip a switch and start doing the kind of flying we do they would. Please give ATA a little credit. We have been flying worldwide for many years and have the Ops Specs and various certifications that cost money and time to achieve, this has worth.

If SWA wants to grow up and be an International competitor they need what ATA has and they need it NOW. It would take at least a couple of years and many millions of dollars to get the Ops Specs that ATA has now. The problem is, you can't just buy our Ops Specs you have to buy the whole certificate, sorry. The expense to do this on your own is very, very high. Buying ATA would be a much less expensive way to achieve an Int'l operations.

My message to SWA pilots Mr. Roughneck. If SWA bought ATA and our small pilot group and treated us right than SWA would have a well motivated pilot group to work with and help transition your airline into a world player. By utilizing this new authorization SWA would have a huge overall growth in your seniority list dwarfing the small number of ATA pilots you integrated.

If you just want to be ugly than you might just miss out on this huge opportunity.

 

[1800 RVR]

I am not trying to stir the pot, but it looks like something is going to happen soon. I hope you guys will take a lesson from the TransStar deal and take the "offer." It will likely mean a pay raise even if you move seats and you will be at a company that you can retire from.

Good Luck.

As a former ATA pilot, all I can say is WOW! I like the way you make it sound so comfy cozy by saying "I'm not trying to stir the pot,..." but yet, you come off totally as stirring the pot! Why should they thake the "offer"? Because it would probably be good for YOU, whereas a seniority integration would hurt you. I don't have a dog in this fight anymore. But this has been some of the lousiest advice I've seen in a long time.

 

[Tanker Clown]

Why wouldn't an ATA guy be willing to be pay protected and go to the bottom of the SWA list? What are your other options. Go down with the ship? Sure, you'd be at the bottom of the SWA list, but at least you know you'd have a job. The way things are going now, one day you'll open the paper and ATA will have shut the doors. Sounds to me like SWA could be a life saver.

Pride is great, but it doesn't put food on the table.

 

[CaptSeth]

You'd make a great scab, tanker ass-clown. Too bad Lorenzo is gone, I'm sure you'd have fun living on your knees.

 

[AQ PILOT]

CaptSeth, why such animosity coming out of you? What am I missing here? I'm not sure if you're an ATA guy or not, but if you had two options one being on the street out of a job and the other being the very last guy on WN's seniority list, why wouldn't you prefer the latter? Hell, you could always quit WN if you didn't want to be there!

What exactly are you fighting for here? If you're an ATA guy, what is it you would like to see happen exactly? Personally, I'd love to see a 'fair' merge with AQ and ATA. Better yet, a merge with WN would be phenomenal for little ol' AQ. But I know I'd much rather be stapled to the bottom of WN than collecting unemployment and filling out airline apps again!

Seriously man, what is it you want here...