SWA/ATA revisited

[JJET44]

Ahhhhh.....................yup!

 

[Tristar]

I've read this thread with a measure of disbelief and sadness. I'm not even going to attempt to respond to most of this, but I will add just one or two things:

I'm pretty sure that when people get into aviation it isn't their dream to be a CRJ CA Mesa....or an ATA (insert seat and equipment here). Let's call a spade a spade...or in this case a stepping stone a stepping stone.

Pretty true. However, as has already been alluded to, many of us stopped in here and found the flying and above all our coworkers to be of such high caliber that we were compelled to stay. Many of us even envisioned ourselves retiring from ATA. It wasn't what a legacy carrier was in their heyday, for many of us it was far better in many ways.

As to the comment that if the shoe was on the other foot, I simply must disagree. I've had these discussions many times over the years with numerous ATA pilots, and I honestly cannot recall a single one who wanted to do anything other than what would be deemed "fair and equitable." Can we argue about exactly what "fair and equitable" is? Of course. And darn near all of us (excluding those who choose to argue for arguements sake) can also recognize what isn't.

Along those same lines, I am certain (at least as certain as anyone can be guessing another's actions) that a good number of ATA pilots would pass on the chance to go to WN. Not out of bitterness or spite, but simply because that sort of flying isn't their thing. By the same token, a number would jump at the opportunity simply for the stability.

Personally, I just want to have a job. I'd like to still be flying a widebody around the world, but I'd also like to make a living wage at it and be home more the a couple days a month. I'm afraid I"ll be doing none of the above very soon.

Finally, Tanker Clown. Words escape me to express the utter contempt I have for you. You have no dog in the fight, yet come off with the most off kilter, uninformed, moronic garbage I've had the misfortune to read recently (and that's saying something considering it's election season). If you were capable of it, you should be ashamed. However, having subjected myself to nine pages of your drivel, I must conclude you are most likely utterly devoid of any intrinsic moral compass. As such, any attempt to chastise you serves not to correct or enlighten you, but simply to serve as a warning buoy to others navigating in your presence.

MKR - I knew you were real, and well said.

 

[johnsonrod]

I've read this thread with a measure of disbelief and sadness. I'm not even going to attempt to respond to most of this, but I will add just one or two things:



Pretty true. However, as has already been alluded to, many of us stopped in here and found the flying and above all our coworkers to be of such high caliber that we were compelled to stay. Many of us even envisioned ourselves retiring from ATA. It wasn't what a legacy carrier was in their heyday, for many of us it was far better in many ways.

As to the comment that if the shoe was on the other foot, I simply must disagree. I've had these discussions many times over the years with numerous ATA pilots, and I honestly cannot recall a single one who wanted to do anything other than what would be deemed "fair and equitable." Can we argue about exactly what "fair and equitable" is? Of course. And darn near all of us (excluding those who choose to argue for arguements sake) can also recognize what isn't.

Along those same lines, I am certain (at least as certain as anyone can be guessing another's actions) that a good number of ATA pilots would pass on the chance to go to WN. Not out of bitterness or spite, but simply because that sort of flying isn't their thing. By the same token, a number would jump at the opportunity simply for the stability.

Personally, I just want to have a job. I'd like to still be flying a widebody around the world, but I'd also like to make a living wage at it and be home more the a couple days a month. I'm afraid I"ll be doing none of the above very soon.

Finally, Tanker Clown. Words escape me to express the utter contempt I have for you. You have no dog in the fight, yet come off with the most off kilter, uninformed, moronic garbage I've had the misfortune to read recently (and that's saying something considering it's election season). If you were capable of it, you should be ashamed. However, having subjected myself to nine pages of your drivel, I must conclude you are most likely utterly devoid of any intrinsic moral compass. As such, any attempt to chastise you serves not to correct or enlighten you, but simply to serve as a warning buoy to others navigating in your presence.

MKR - I knew you were real, and well said.

Great post. All I can say is many of us wish you guys at ATA luck as things shake out. I agree that it would be hard to go from one type of flying to another - hopefully people can find jobs they like that don't require too much of a step back in terms of pay. Good luck.

P.S. Don't take Tanker Clown too seriously. He is a desk surfer who puts others down so that he can feel better about himself. That's lame.

 

[JJET44]

Tanker

Finally, Tanker Clown. Words escape me to express the utter contempt I have for you. You have no dog in the fight, yet come off with the most off kilter, uninformed, moronic garbage I've had the misfortune to read recently (and that's saying something considering it's election season). If you were capable of it, you should be ashamed. However, having subjected myself to nine pages of your drivel, I must conclude you are most likely utterly devoid of any intrinsic moral compass. As such, any attempt to chastise you serves not to correct or enlighten you, but simply to serve as a warning buoy to others navigating in your presence.

Well said Tristar!!

Tanker,
I think Hillary could use you on her campaign.

 

[FlyinGuy]

I am not sure why you guys even acknowledge Tanker clown. He is not interested in discussing anything...just seeing how many of you will play his little game.

 

[Snapshot]

Trust me, if I had to work at World or ATA let alone be turned down by them I would consider my aviation career a total failure....

Consider any hope of not being an A$$hole a total failure after this statement. Trust me, no matter what you drive or how much money you have, NO ONE envies you.

 

[Whine Lover]

( Geez...Is it even worth my Time....?)

( Well, NO it really isn't.)

Let me give you a quick perspective.

I am 49. I will be retiring this year.

1) Because ATA is going Under.

2) Because I "planned" to retire at 50.

3) Because this Industry is PATHETIC.

My College Room-Mates who are at UsAir / AWA / Delta / American / United....ETC. are NOT EVEN QUALIFIED to APPLY at a JetBlue, an AirTran etc. because they are 15-20 year F/O's and have the same "178 Hours" of PIC Multi-Piston that we ALL had 20 years ago.

I have done EVERYTHING I came to this Career to do...And, strangely, I accomplished it at a Carrier I had never heard of. And believe me, this place is Idiotville. So, let's not talk about " My Airline is better..." I concede. But, "better" HOW?

Folks, They are all "Klown-Shows". And I don't give a Flying Fornication what is painted on the side of your Bird...or How many buttons you have on your "Klown Jacket". You are Puppets who work for Klowns. END of
STORY,

I have had an ABSOLUTE BLAST over the last 20 years, turned down the NWA's etc. and in the meantime, wound up with Flight Time that will get me hired ANYWHERE. All of this while earning equal to, or more than, ( in the Long Run ) my contemporarys, and having a Quality of Life Second To None.

Go figure...

You Wanna' make God laugh?

Go ahead and make some "Plans".

I thank Him for EVERY DAY that it didn't turn out my way....American, United, etc.

Whatever. Thank You Lord.

WHO KNEW?

MKR

P.S. - AND...Even WITH this Flight Time / Qualifications....I will remove myself from this Industry. IT IS BENEATH ME.

 

[Esprit]

Don't you know this guy (greenbayfan)? He's that kid in highschool that had to put everyone else down in order to build himself up. He would say these things behind their backs (from the safety of a keyboard here) because he knew fair well that he would get clocked if he said it to their face.

What a wussy.

ESPRIT

 

[bold_tiger9]

All of this pilot integration stuff could be moot if SWA (or anyone else for that matter) bought only the operating certificate without other assets. This has been done in the past by other airlines.

 

[vtwo]

All of this pilot integration stuff could be moot if SWA (or anyone else for that matter) bought only the operating certificate without other assets. This has been done in the past by other airlines.

The operating cert. includes ETOPS, and world wide authority. MNPS, RVSM ect..to keep that intact a buyer would have to take, certified airplanes, certified training program, certified maint program, and the dispatch program as well. along with those programs mentioned above key people have to go with that as well to over see each dept. so some pilots, dispatchers, flight attendants, fleet managers, maint head's ect.

So as you can see The ATA certificate is really not worth much with out the whole shebang.