Stealth Age 67 to 70

[list2002]

AWESOME rumors and ideas! First that we should stagnate growth indefinitely, work till we die, and at the same time a suggestion that CA's make the same as FO's. So IF I ever upgrade I can look forward to that... and I bet if the age limit is removed, but those over 60 have to sit right seat, that WILL be the next move.

 

[madjack]

List,

Ok, how much more should u make as a CP when u upgrade? The CPs job has been made easier over the years, and the FOs share responsibility if something goes wrong...the diff btw the jobs has diminished, yet FOs labor on the low end of an archaic two tier pay system. With age 67 on the horizon and Seniority list stagnation a reality, how long r u willing to wait to get yours (upgrade) and how much $$ will u lose?

 

[Clutch]

I'm on the brink of slipping mickey's into these geezers' Ensure

 

[Boxboy]

If the "fly 'till u die" age passes, a few changes need to be incorporated into the FOM and FH.
1) All gummers* shall have the shoulder harnesses on and in the locked postion at all times while the aircraft is in motion.
2) Depends shall be part of the uniform for all gummers* as the use of the lavatory during flight is prohibited for all gummers* to include any jumpseaters who fit this criteria. Random Depends checks will be conducted by a qualified FA. The FA peforming the inspection must have more than 30 years of seniority with the company since he/she will have first hand experience with the operation of the Depends device.
3) All FOs shall be trained and qualified on the defibrillator. No exceptions. This will be an annual training requirement. This will be a hands-on training event consisting of one FO and one gummer*. A trained ER technician shall be present during training in the event the gummer* fails the training event. All crew members are required to pass this event and the training will continue untill all gummers* have been exhausted. There will be no remedial training.

*=any flight crew members over the age of 60

 

[relief tube]

if it gets pushed back again I will kick someone in the face.

I'm saving enough to retire at age 55 and can't wait. Goodbye. All you greedy, cranky old f----s can die in the left seat if it really is your goal.

 

[Flopgut]

3) All FOs shall be trained and qualified on the defibrillator. No exceptions.

Gummers ought to wear the defibrillator the entire flight. It should be wired to the emergency bus.

 

[Flopgut]

What happened to ethics? Toe the line and take your turn?

Retirements haven't even resumed and old guys want it moved up. This should remove all doubt as to which generation holds the franchise on greed.

 

[jonjuan]

Gummers ought to wear the defibrillator the entire flight. It should be wired to the emergency bus.

Really? How about, "Dammit, and I thought the defrib was charged before we left. Sorry Cap'n, looks like I'm gonna have to take this landing myself. Can you get please get your hands off you chest and at least get the gear?"

 

[flyboyike]

3) All FOs shall be trained and qualified on the defibrillator. No exceptions.

I'm already trained therein, but I won't be using it on a gummer. I'd rather it be available for someone actually worth saving.

 

[Flopgut]

This is the latest on this issue:

L-CAL training and advancement plan for the latest bid is now overdue. If we don't see that plan by Friday, we've got trouble. Old, senior pilots (mostly L-UAL, some L-CAL) are lobbying for age waivers to 67 from the FAA. These guys are whispering in jeff and fred's ears and suggesting they help them stay two more years, and in return these old pilots will help mgt continue to outsource, cancel upgrades, and forego hiring. They are using the big L-CAL bid, the crossover UAL pilots who are coming back to the company, and the rumored hiring as leverage to help them stay.

Yeah, this is a stretch, but it's all they have, really [luckily]. Another official age increase has no support.

 

[eaglesview]

Good Grief....no comment

 

[Flopgut]

Hey eagle: You know a lot of these guys. Do you think they are above using the current pilot turmoil over at American to further their own agenda in Washington? Shoot man, these guys would throw thier mothers under a bus for two more years of their seniority.

 

[eaglesview]

Since I already know you just make stuff up and say whatever you want i'm not to concerned.

 

[Flopgut]

And I get that because you hate CAL so much you can't see that UAL 85 hires are the real problem. Remember, the wackos are still around trying to game retirement age again (APAAD and SWA), but they never made a difference in the first place til the UAL guys threw Prater votes as he promised to raise the retirement age. Those same pilots are bypassing ALPA this time and trying to make a deal for mgts help in getting waivers. I do not think they have much of a chance, but this is the play they are making.

 

[vetteracer]

I never understood how some guys could fly for an airline for 35 years, and be broke at age 60.

 

[chqflyer]

I never understood how some guys could fly for an airline for 35 years, and be broke at age 60.

Some folks are just piss-poor money managers. Too many toys, bad investments, ex-wives, etc. Its not just pilots, look at some of these celebrities or wall street types that take in millions and are flat broke a decade later.

 

[doylehargraves]

What is it with baby boomers? LET IT GO. Enjoy your family and die in peace and not at the controls. Good grief, RETIRE ALREADY LOSERS

 

[eaglesview]

And I get that because you hate CAL so much you can't see that UAL 85 hires are the real problem. Remember, the wackos are still around trying to game retirement age again (APAAD and SWA), but they never made a difference in the first place til the UAL guys threw Prater votes as he promised to raise the retirement age. Those same pilots are bypassing ALPA this time and trying to make a deal for mgts help in getting waivers. I do not think they have much of a chance, but this is the play they are making.

You're comical. No matter how many times I tell you I have no issues with the CO pilots of today you still spew the same crap. Reread post # 73

 

[agrrlpilot]

Ha!! The only "pilot shortage" that exists is in the pay structure. Do you really think there would be a pilot shortage if the pay got better at the regionals? If I could make the pay a SWA or UPS pilot is making, I wouldn't care what I was flying! I suspect there are a lot of pilots out there thinking like that.

 

[fob727]

This is the latest on this issue:

L-CAL training and advancement plan for the latest bid is now overdue. If we don't see that plan by Friday, we've got trouble. Old, senior pilots (mostly L-UAL, some L-CAL) are lobbying for age waivers to 67 from the FAA. These guys are whispering in jeff and fred's ears and suggesting they help them stay two more years, and in return these old pilots will help mgt continue to outsource, cancel upgrades, and forego hiring. They are using the big L-CAL bid, the crossover UAL pilots who are coming back to the company, and the rumored hiring as leverage to help them stay.

Yeah, this is a stretch, but it's all they have, really [luckily]. Another official age increase has no support.

Jeez, FG! Do you have black helicopters flying over your house too?

 

[Flopgut]

I really hope I do end up sounding crazy. Remember, it's not like a retirement age increase didn't happen in the middle of the night. Ok? Additionally, where are the voices of the guys who acted like five years would do the trick? Should there not be some social enforcement out there from pilots who wanted 65, now acknowledging that enough is enough? There is nobody doing that. It's like 65 didn't help at all.

 

[BrickTop]

Half the pilots over 60 look like the dirt bag of a 1957 Hoover Wide clean. Especially UAL. Those men let themselves self-destruct. I doubt their medical will last much past 65. And if it does a few will challenge that in a parking lot of fed up 30 something stagnated pilots looking to deliver a fist full of greed discipline. GET OUT.

 

[Bringupthebird]

Stagnated? At "30-something"? Wouldn't those be new-hires with unrealistic expectations?

 

[Bringupthebird]

I really hope I do end up sounding crazy.

Well, if you don't it's not from lack of trying!

It's like 65 didn't help at all.

65 wasn't supposed to help the "pilot shortage". It was supposed to bring some reality into the retirement age for pilots that hadn't changed in almost 50 years. Extend it further? Maybe in a few decades when we see how 65 works out, that will be reasonable. If you do it now, do it along with a wholesale overhaul of pilot medicals, including dropping the third-class and allowing VFR private pilots to self-certify.

 

[Bringupthebird]

if it gets pushed back again I will kick someone in the face.

I'm saving enough to retire at age 55 and can't wait. Goodbye. All you greedy, cranky old f----s can die in the left seat if it really is your goal.

So why does the retirement age affect you if you plan on leaving at an arbitrary age?

What responsibility is it of the current pilots to improve contracts so that a pilot can make enough to contribute to a retirement plan or make investments that will allow them to retire at 65 or earlier? The erosion of buying power effects everyone and the worse it gets, the longer folks have to work just to survive.

 

[Flopgut]

65 wasn't supposed to help the "pilot shortage". It was supposed to bring some reality into the retirement age for pilots that hadn't changed in almost 50 years.

Ah, but in reality it did much more than that didn't it? That was the "Fair Treatment for Experienced Pilot Act" Complete with overnight seniority grab and built in windfall for a bunch of old guys. "Fair treatment" for you is sufficient to change the Constitution. But of other's expectations for some sort of fairness? You've got this to say:

Stagnated? At "30-something"? Wouldn't those be new-hires with unrealistic expectations?

Interesting. You are a peice of work. And if that's not enough, you continue with:

So why does the retirement age affect you if you plan on leaving at an arbitrary age?

What responsibility is it of the current pilots to improve contracts so that a pilot can make enough to contribute to a retirement plan or make investments that will allow them to retire at 65 or earlier? The erosion of buying power effects everyone and the worse it gets, the longer folks have to work just to survive.

You question any responsibility you might have to another pilot with expectations, but you've got zero apprehension over expecting other pilots to accomodate your needs. Whatever they me be, and especially if they are a detriment to others.

I might be crazy, but at least I'm not weak.

 

[Bringupthebird]

My needs? I can retire prior to 65 whenever I choose.

Age 60 was defended on the basis of safety, which has been proven to be a farce. It was indefensible featherbedding, and the slight change to 65 brought it a little closer to the reality of the rest of the world.

And no, I don't think I owe the younger generation a thing, especially retaining something like Age 60. I don't support an elimination of the the retirement age unless is comes with a wholesale overhaul to the medical standards for pilots, which is a safety concern. The same advances in medicine that have made the average 65 year old just as medically fit as the 60 year old of days gone by, have also brought us additional medical screening for other potentially debilitating illnesses. Add those to the repetoire of the AME and you may see a few vacancies in the left seat, but quite likely just as many in the right.

Why not abandon your fruitless attacks on age and seniority and focus on right and wrong. You'll likely get more support and you won't appear nearly as weak.

 

[Flopgut]

Stagnated? At "30-something"? Wouldn't those be new-hires with unrealistic expectations?

The erosion of buying power effects everyone and the worse it gets, the longer folks have to work just to survive.

30 something dude: "My career expectations are stagnated"! Answer: Waaa!

You: "I gotta work longer to survive"! Answer: Waaa!

They are basically the same complaint dude.

Oh wait, you said you could retire at any time... Right....

 

[f15boomer]

Flying from PHX to the east. There are a few westies that live in the east A..H....

 

[Furloughed80]

The CPO at sCAL sent out a blastmail that mentioned a strong push to change the mandatory retirement age to 67. Apparently, it was the regional carriers that were lobbying in DC because of staffing issues they will face when the majors start hiring (combined with the new increased minimums for hiring pilots). For now, there are no planned changes to the mandatory retirement age. I honestly thought increasing the retirement age again was just rumor and speculation. This was the first time I heard from 'an official source' that there are groups lobbying for age 67.