Southwest off the runway at MDW

[vetteracer]

For the record I agree with everything you're saying except this.

I've been the guy that asked for the opposing at a pretty busy airport before and quickly found that it only takes one pilot to refuse it and they simply just move all of the operations over. I'm sorry, but it is your job as a professional pilot to make these types of decisions. Sometimes it won't make you popular.

Well, I agree with your premise, but the fact is at MDW they are un-willing to do that sometimes due to arivals/Departures out of O'Hare.

And of course, the feeling of not wanting to be the black sheep and Phuch the program up and take crap on the radio.

You make a good point, and one that we can all learn from.

Thanks

 

[Fly2Scuba]

Why is it okay to make fun of an accident when there is no fatality? I think we have answered the blue/white coller questions.

Why do people make war jokes or jokes about terrorism? Why do people make Nazi jokes? I remember a couple of Jerry Seinfeld episodes having some of those among other TV shows and movies. Why do people making priest jokes or Michael Jackson jokes? Is child mostellation funny? Why does the name OJ Simpson automatically instill laughter in most people? Is double homocide funny? Why are there so many JFK Junior and John Denver jokes? Are GA accidents funny or is it alright if it involves a celebrity? Are they not real people with real families? Why is there a website and books devoted to Darwin Awards? etc, etc, etc. So to answer your question, many more serious indidents have been joked about on a far greater stage that in fact did involve fatalities.

If you never laughed about any of the above subjects, then you have a right to bash the jokesters on here. If not, then you are hypocritical.

 

[Chuck Yogourt]

Maybe 737pylt should have someone banned. As for ASA, leave them alone. They are a good bunch.

 

[Fly2Scuba]

Also to add one more thing, laughter does help invoke memory. In CRM recurrent, they've slipped in some photos of accidents photo that made everyone laugh; specifically the SWA Burbank at the pump. Now whenever I land on a shortened runway, and if we are looking any bit unstabilized, that photo and accidnt always seems to come in mind. Helps to make a go around decision.

 

[Bumpman]

Canyon,

I got the impression he was an intructor pilot (retired), are those guys line guys? Not sure where the others are getting the interns from, Jim Dent sounds halfway decent, (remember they are trying to talk to the masses, not specifically pilots), the other guys was 737,777 pilot from CAL.

Glad everyone is ok, don;t much like MDW in good weather. Hang in there guys.

AA

Steve got his 737 type rating at SWA about 10-12 years ago. I have known him for the last 15 years, although I am not proud of that fact. He used to be with my airline. He has been an instructor in the UAL sims in Denver, but not sure he is still doing that. He is listed as furloughed on our seniority list.

 

[h25b]

Well, I agree with your premise, but the fact is at MDW they are un-willing to do that sometimes due to arivals/Departures out of O'Hare.

And of course, the feeling of not wanting to be the black sheep and Phuch the program up and take crap on the radio.

You make a good point, and one that we can all learn from.

Thanks

I don't mind being the black sheep. If it's that big of a deal for the controllers, it's time to start thinking about going somewhere else. Some people can call me a chicken, but I have a list of sorts of "big deals" I don't mess around with. When I get more than 2 of these "big deals" I start looking at an entirely different plan. Extremely low vis., slick runway, and tailwind are all on my list... I've seen this situation lots in my short career. In busy airspace and with deteriorating conditions it does take major cajones to be the guy that finally says enough. Unfortunately, if no one says "enough, I'm going elsewhere or taking another approach" the only way the dangerous situation gets revealed is when an aircraft has an incident or at the very least scares the hell out of themselves...

My heart goes out to the flight crew on this one.

 

[Remington]

Also to add one more thing, laughter does help invoke memory. In CRM recurrent, they've slipped in some photos of accidents photo that made everyone laugh; specifically the SWA Burbank at the pump. Now whenever I land on a shortened runway, and if we are looking any bit unstabilized, that photo and accidnt always seems to come in mind. Helps to make a go around decision.

I guarantee you the discussion of past accidents/incidents were not intended to envoke a laugh. Sure, we have all learned tons from past accidents. I gave my students, "The I learned about flying from that" articles. We can all learn from some other's mistakes. However, the people making fun here are hiding behind anonimity. I challenge you to go stand in the B concourse of MDW and laugh at this problem and make a joke of it. You won't.
People love to see the sucessful fall. SWA is the most sucessful airline in history and folks wait like vultures for something like this to happen.
On top of the child losing his life, other's were hurt, and two pilots might lose their career. Is anyone losing their career funny? Can you make up a joke about this? Lets hear it. Show your wife/parents/kids this thread and see if they think it's funny.

 

[Fly-n-hi]

This isn't a good time to poke fun at other airlines and its definately tragic for the family that lost their 6 year old son 2 weeks before Christmas.

I know this much...When they investigate this accident the two SWA pilots better have done everything right. They better have had the proper flaps, autobrakes, speeds, etc...

This isn't meant as an insult but SWA has the reputation for always being in a rush. The public may not realize this but the FAA certainly does. After running planes off the end of the runway in BUR and PHX, the flap spindle malfunction in HOU (which was caused ove time by being in a rush), and a few other cases SWA just can't afford to have any more haste related problems. Thank the Lord that no one has been killed...until today.

Now I'm not saying that other airlines don't make mistakes but if the investigators find out that this accident was caused by being in a rush this is going to be really bad for SWA. Hopefully it was something outside the pilots' control.

BTW...I have several SWA friends and I know that you hire good people. Every airline has people that screw up.

 

[freightdogfred]

??

If that is directed at me, I am curious how 121 distances are worked, not taking a shot at anyone. It has been an observation on my side of the business that contaminated runways are by a lot of pilots and operators, ignored as it severly limits the use of the airplane. I am interested in the airline side of things and am asking an honest question. I'm sorry for your company's situation, and more so for the family of the lost child. If there is anyone here who can help me learn about that I more than appreciate the insight.

Runway analysis at most 121 carriers are predicated on maximum braking, no reverse. Inop systems such as spoilers, anti-skid will typically require a radical weight penalty, (a much lower landing weight) There are adjustments for tailwinds as well. Data is usually supplied by listing the maximum allowable landing weight for a given situation.

 

[LarryinTN]

I respect your SOP's and can understand your statement. Can you just tell me do you guys use Auto-Brakes?

I don't know SWA's procedures but I was on their jumpseat on a 737-700 for a landing at PIT in light snow. The Captain armed the autobrakes then, when additional information was received on final, he bumped them up another notch. I thought he did an excellent job of managing the entire flight which had weather challenges throughout.