Some UAL/CAL News (For Those Interested)

[saabservant]

I was just about to ask if anyone knows whether ual furloughs can expect longevity for time out when returning.
I'm very close to the bottom of the furlough list, ergo the entire seniority list.
Working at a delta connection carrier now at approx. 37 bucks an hour.
If I take a lcal position in november or december, I will go back at 33 bucks an hour.
No way am i coming back for a pay cut! Hard enough to be sitting right seat in a crj at low wages, after paying dues to alpa national for 10 years at mesaba.
So, no return for me until the new contract is ratified and implemented,
and hoping we get longevity. It is only right......

Anyone here know whether this was included in the agreement in principle?
if not why not?

Thanks

 

[Chairman]

I was just about to ask if anyone knows whether ual furloughs can expect longevity for time out when returning.
I'm very close to the bottom of the furlough list, ergo the entire seniority list.
Working at a delta connection carrier now at approx. 37 bucks an hour.
If I take a lcal position in november or december, I will go back at 33 bucks an hour.
No way am i coming back for a pay cut! Hard enough to be sitting right seat in a crj at low wages, after paying dues to alpa national for 10 years at mesaba.
So, no return for me until the new contract is ratified and implemented,
and hoping we get longevity. It is only right......

Anyone here know whether this was included in the agreement in principle?
if not why not?

Thanks

I understand everyone has there reason for staying out but 37 to 33 is a small hourly pay cut. But you are losing 12.75% B fund. and what pay rate at Mesaba will you be making next year vs at CAL Not to mention much easier flying. Now if you don't commute I understand as commuting sucks. I think those jr who go back now pre contract stand the biggest chance of making out if the contract is settled. Other wise it could be a another year or 2 being out as senior guys come back at a decent pay rate.

Chairman

 

[xjhawk]

Okay a number of issues here-

Chairman-(for Saabservant)when one is not scraping by at their current rates and cannot pay their bills, you cannot say taking away thousands of dollars of income needed to pay bills and feed ones family is worth it. One cannot pay a car/house/grociery bills with 401k match.

Dan and Andy-I also must have to say you both have great points. Dan is right that ALPA is a tool and many of the functions of immediate impact of pilots can be blamed or credited to the Local parts of ALPA. That being said, Andy is right in how junior pilots are given in many cases nothing, no protection and generally screwed by their ALPA (Local) leadership. I can attest to that in the contracts I have been forced to live under. That ALPA national has no policies or fair procedures to deal with reoccurring issues such as protections for Furloughs or ones Seniority during mergers is pathetic. I pay ALPA to maintain the contract and protect my seniority. The contracts I have seen give landslides to senior pilots while leaving junior pilots crappy rules and pay. Take PBS for example-as a junior pilot the only good thing I had to look forward to was build up lines and when they were taken away because the company wanted to save money-the senior pilots got more days off and better schedules-I lost weekends off and 15 hours of credit a month-a thousand of dollars a month at my pay rates. QOL and pay so a senior pilot can have 2-3 days off more a month and a higher credit. Andy has a point that DAL's pilots have set a standard in regards to protections for their furloughed pilots-ALPA should adopt that as standard. Oh and just look at what happens to furloughed pilots when a merger happens-screwed-

I also give credit where credit is due for ALPA's successes. But those successes have not helped my bottom line and QOL and I am sure many other Jr pilots can say the same.

 

[saabservant]

Chairman, xjhawk, thanks for your comments, very thoughtful.
Although a 401k match is not relevant for me now, the point about going back and getting in now before senior guys take all the slots when pay goes up is a good one.
However, commuting to sit reserve in IAH or EWR is about as tough as it gets i'm told, under the cal reserve rules.....

Thanks, saabservant

 

["TheBigPicture"]

However, commuting to sit reserve in IAH or EWR is about as tough as it gets i'm told, under the cal reserve rules.....

Thanks, saabservant

That is no joke...trust me uke:

 

[densoo]

However, commuting to sit reserve in IAH or EWR is about as tough as it gets i'm told, under the cal reserve rules.....

Understatement. 18 months of commuting reserve to EWR. Nearly lost my family. Fortunately those work rules go in the "Pathetic" chapter of "Flying the Line, Vol III" as soon as JCBA is signed.

 

[saabservant]

And, when will it be signed? guessing, but if they get a ta by end of sept. i think it is
30 days for the mec's to review, then 45 to hold a ratification vote. So, ratification probably in December. Hoping to have it in place by the time I get out of training, if I take a slot in November.
If we get longevity, let's all do the macarena! I sure need it, this furlough has been a financial disaster. Love letter to management that knew they were going to furlough me when they hired me: FUPM

 

[densoo]

And, when will it be signed? guessing, but if they get a ta by end of sept. i think it is
30 days for the mec's to review, then 45 to hold a ratification vote.

MECs see it for two weeks, then pilots get 30 days to vote.

 

[greyskyracer]

Hi,

Can someone please post the reserve rules for UCAL. Min days off? long/short call? And what the "Guam Package" is? Thanks in advance

 

[CheapFlyer]

Disregard.

 

[Chairman]

Hi,

Can someone please post the reserve rules for UCAL. Min days off? long/short call? And what the "Guam Package" is? Thanks in advance

Reserve rules will be different for UAL vs CAL as for Guam that will fall on the CAL side. When I was on reserve at LUAL I believe 12 days off a month and domestically reserve days were not moveable, everyone was on long call of 13 hrs but you could be moved up I think 7 times in a month.

Chairman

 

[Phrogs4ever]

I was just about to ask if anyone knows whether ual furloughs can expect longevity for time out when returning.
I'm very close to the bottom of the furlough list, ergo the entire seniority list.
Working at a delta connection carrier now at approx. 37 bucks an hour.
If I take a lcal position in november or december, I will go back at 33 bucks an hour.
No way am i coming back for a pay cut! Hard enough to be sitting right seat in a crj at low wages, after paying dues to alpa national for 10 years at mesaba.
So, no return for me until the new contract is ratified and implemented,
and hoping we get longevity. It is only right......

Anyone here know whether this was included in the agreement in principle?
if not why not?

Thanks

How many months would it take to get to second year pay? The jump to over $60 per hour (whatever the 737 blended rate is) more than makes up staying at $37. Plus, if and when the new contract gets implemented you will be able to take advantage right away.

 

[saabservant]

I've accepted a class date in November. I figure the new contract will be ratified by the time I finish training and new pay and work rules will be in effect. a gamble, i know.
good luck to all, hope God blesses us and our industry

 

[BID]

I've accepted a class date in November. I figure the new contract will be ratified by the time I finish training and new pay and work rules will be in effect. a gamble, i know.
good luck to all, hope God blesses us and our industry

Think of it as a calculated risk! Good luck.

 

[densoo]

I've accepted a class date in November. I figure the new contract will be ratified by the time I finish training and new pay and work rules will be in effect. a gamble, i know.
good luck to all, hope God blesses us and our industry

I think you've called it right.

 

[IAHERJ]

I think it was a good call as well. Welcome to United South. See you in Houston.

 

[Chairman]

How many months would it take to get to second year pay? The jump to over $60 per hour (whatever the 737 blended rate is) more than makes up staying at $37. Plus, if and when the new contract gets implemented you will be able to take advantage right away.

IF you were on first year pay when furloughed at UAL you will have to do 12 months of first year pay at CAL. Some furloughed pilots were on property well over a year and still on first year pay as it is a year from your checkride you went to second year pay.

Chairman

 

[UALRATT]

IF you were on first year pay when furloughed at UAL you will have to do 12 months of first year pay at CAL. Some furloughed pilots were on property well over a year and still on first year pay as it is a year from your checkride you went to second year pay.

Chairman

Yeah but with his calculation (and mine) more than likely his first year pay will be higher with the exception of his two months in training...

 

[Ex737Driver]

.........Where it come to who eats whom, you need a refreshed look at CAL's (fit for entry in the Guinness Book) SCAB list. Isn't still the largest ever? Then look no further than the SLI of pilots among the airlines that constitute CAL's current seniority list. The mess with Texas Air, then Frontier and Peoples Express, New York Air and Express Jet, or do you have no clue of all this???

Son if you're read this far, hat's off to you...

Kinda makes you wonder after the "screw" job in DEN why the CAL pilots might be a little perturbed and tired of hearing this same 'ole tripe. Your hands are just as dirty as ours. Ask the Frontier pilots. Unless you have NO scabs, your seniority list is just as tainted as ours is. One rotten apple in the sauce ruins it just as much as 100. Unless you've gotten used to the taste. If you'd like to up the ante, how many years did FL run your airline? Glass house man...........