SLI. What's fair and equitable.

[el raton]

SLI by DOH is the only fair way to integrate the lists. The lists between Flex and Flops are not that significantly different but once Onesky / Dac starts adding newer startups like TMC and Wheels Up a percentage merge will seriously suck with 2 and 3 year guys ending up senior to an 18 year guy

DOH is the only fair and equitable way to go

^^^^^

Is this Phil? If it is, there's 1001 reasons why you shouldn't be move beyond a first officer.

 

[TexasChallenger]

^^^^^

Is this Phil? If it is, there's 1001 reasons why you shouldn't be move beyond a first officer.

Yes, it's Phil. Amazing how he kept that to himself on Yammer all year. But anyone with an IQ north of 20 knew his, and all the other transfers, intentions from day one.

 

[GlorifiedCabbie]

The FOK club has always had pilots that have to compensate for their lack of professional aviation skills. They only fly with certain other pilots and take check rides with only certain check airmen. Why we had 314 pilots agree that they wanted to continue their careers under such a system is beyond me.

 

[Club ORD FO]

I've got no Idea if that really is Phil, but he was asked directly on yammer what his preference for SLI is and he responded with "percentage". So if that is him, he has evidently changed his mind.

 

[Helmsalee]

Guys, I know some of you will tell me to go away since I have no skin in this game. However, I have been through 2 SLIs in my career. Granted they were 121, but seniority is seniority.

If you can come to an agreement on your on (direct negotiation), you will be very unusual. That is best but very rare. Failing to agree, you will move to arbitration. The problem with arbitrators is that they are arbitrary and you have to accept their decision. In my experience, both sides will be mad at the arbitrator after the list is published. His (or her) problem is that both sides have career expectations. There is simply not enough good stuff available to meet all the expectations of both sides. The best he can hope for is that both sides will be equally mad. If that happens, he has done the best he can.

With my first SLI, I was royally pissed. So were the guys on the other side. As the years passed, I came to realize that what I thought was fair would have been unfair to the other side and vice versa. An 18 year fo will feel it is unfair that there are 6 year captains on the list senior to him. On the other hand, a pilot who has been a captain for 3-4 years would feel it is unfair for that fo who has never been a captain to bump him out of his seat.

I know it is hard (and impossible for some) to try to see the other side but you will have to work together whether you like it or not.

Good luck,

Helm

 

[1folinepilot]

This SLI will be all about Precidence. It will define the method used for each subsequent merger of any future company Kenn aquires.

Flex and Flops need to go together by the DOH each employee held on the day of the vote at the company they are employed at. This is the only fair way to merge the lists because in the future when TMC or a company Kenn creates will have very junior pilots ending up senior to pilots who have been at Flex / Flops for 2 decades.

 

[el raton]

This SLI will be all about Precidence. It will define the method used for each subsequent merger of any future company Kenn aquires.

Flex and Flops need to go together by the DOH each employee held on the day of the vote at the company they are employed at. This is the only fair way to merge the lists because in the future when TMC or a company Kenn creates will have very junior pilots ending up senior to pilots who have been at Flex / Flops for 2 decades.

So Phil, you feel it's fair to bump a 10 year captain at Flexjet down to a first officer so you can trap your captains seat?


As far as a possible merge with TMC? Percentage SLI wouldn't hurt a single pilot at Onesky.

 

[Praetorian]

I've got no Idea if that really is Phil, but he was asked directly on yammer what his preference for SLI is and he responded with "percentage". So if that is him, he has evidently changed his mind.

He's hoping guys will get on here and pound their fists for DOH, because he wants to devide us. That's what he's all about.

 

[TexasChallenger]

So Phil, you feel it's fair to bump a 10 year captain at Flexjet down to a first officer so you can trap your captains seat?


As far as a possible merge with TMC? Percentage SLI wouldn't hurt a single pilot at Onesky.

"Fair and equitable" isn't the same in every scenario. However it's done this time doesn't mean it has to be done the same way the next time. Every merger is different making "fair and equitable" vary from merger to merger.

 

[GlorifiedCabbie]

Anybody still listening to what he has to say? I would feel no remorse if he was the only one stuck at the bottom of the Flex seniority list.

 

[el raton]

Anybody still listening to what he has to say? I would feel no remorse if he was the only one stuck at the bottom of the Flex seniority list.

I have a better idea, allow training use the same standards on him that are used on Flexjet pilots i.e. follow the TRB's recommendations.

 

[slowtation capt]

Don't listen to Phil. Here's is what he is going to do. He is getting on here, and saying DOH is the only way to do it. Pretty soon he will start demanding it be DOH, and then when the SLI comes out, he will cry foul at the Union, start yelling at the Union, and crying about how it's not DOH and that the Union is trying to screw everyone, etc.......

Phil, we beat you down twice now. Give it up all ready. You got no support trying to start your in house union, and you got no support trying to fight the Union on this vote.

You have to give it up all ready. You have all ready lost all respect for all aspects of your flying abilities, and you personal abilities. You are a mess, and a disaster. Either join the damn Union and be part of it in order to make this place better for all, or just go away.

It's done and over, the Union is here to stay, now and forever.

You have lost!

 

[Club ORD FO]

How can to be Phil if the poster is advocating DOH based on which side of the fence you are flying on the day of the vote. That would mean all the transfers stay at the bottom

 

[TexasChallenger]

He wants to use his FLOPs DOH but stay at Flexjet.

 

[1folinepilot]

How can to be Phil if the poster is advocating DOH based on which side of the fence you are flying on the day of the vote. That would mean all the transfers stay at the bottom

Ah yes we have a winner! Someone who actually reads the posts and thinks before posting instead of just blindly jumping to conclusions like some of the vocal idiots on here.

Yes the only fair an equitable way to merge flex and flops is a simple date of hire at the company thet they were working on at Dec 15th 2015. There is no holding of two seniority numbers or side deals. A percentage merge of these two lists would be a gross injustice as both sides have pilots that are senior to pilots that were hired far earlier than they were. This is the only way to finally fix the seniority lists

All of the flops pilots will have the same dues responsibilities. All of the Rif pilots (friends of slinghoff's or FOS's) that had their dues refunded and then given a responsibility date far later at their reinstatement instead of the contract date like all of the other flops pilots will not be considered a MIG untill they are paid up in full from day one like everybody else. The Flex pilots have their responsibility date of 90 days from the Dec 15 vote. No side deals, no FOS's or FOK's side deals will be permitted or tolerated

This is the only chance the Union has to be fair And equitable in fixing this mess once and for all.

Do it right or be gone