SKYWEST to PAY 4.8 MILLION FOR MOVE

[catIIIc]

I am so glad I left that mess. Good luck guys.

 

[Dave Benjamin]

Dave,

This may come as a shock but I am one ASA pilot who tends to agree that neither DOH nor Staple is fair.

If we ever did merge the pilot lists we would only know that it worked if both groups were equally unhappy at the result!

I will say though that a merger of the list should be the most important thing for everyone, Skywest and ASA, because until we do merge you can rest assured that quality of life can and will change at a moments notice, as management plays one group off against the other.

It is ASA today and could well be Skywest tomorrow that is on the receiving end of that beating.

LegalALien
ASA 50 seat Captain

Actually it doesn't come as a shock at all. I'm fairly confident that the vast majority of ASA pilots are reasonable and levelheaded professionals. I also doubt that there are too many SKYW pilots that feel a staple is fair or realistic. Somewhere in the middle lies a solution that neither group would be real happy with yet it would be somewhat fair.

You guys might need to find a shed to take a certain captain behind and explain why even talking about denying jumpseats is a bad idea.

 

[scarlet]

I think we can be adult--well not many on the web-boards are adults b/c all they do is find neg. things to say about each other...and these people are raising kids...uuummmhhhh

Well Skywest could save money by forming one airline, don't you think??? DOH is just the logical thing to do--as you nor I had anything to do when we were born and got to start training for this great job...as you had NO control of getting hired on that day---and what if MESA comes in and buys all of us--what would you say???? I don't care where I fall, but OUR company would save a boat load of money on salaries health care 401k contributions back ground checks....

 

[txpilot1974]

Somewhere in the middle lies a solution that neither group would be real happy with yet it would be somewhat fair.

I agree. When this merger hits many pilots in both the ASA and the SkyWest groups will get the shaft. Sometimes life plops a big fat turd on your plate and you have no chioce but to pick up the fork and eat it. I for one am not looking forward to mine.

 

[Dave Benjamin]

Well Skywest could save money by forming one airline, don't you think??? DOH is just the logical thing to do--as you nor I had anything to do when we were born and got to start training for this great job...as you had NO control of getting hired on that day---and what if MESA comes in and buys all of us--what would you say???? I don't care where I fall, but OUR company would save a boat load of money on salaries health care 401k contributions back ground checks....

Last I checked we're pilots and not airline economists or accountants. Actually I'm not sure if you're really a pilot but that's besides the point. Your theory does not take into account the training costs involved with an integration. Right now you have two separate FOM's and SOP's. One isn't better than the other but you do have differences. The FAA will require everyone to spend some time in class and possibly sim to get with the new program. Much of the backoffice stuff is already being combined according to SEC filed reports and public statements made by SkyWest officials. So much of what you're talking about has already occurred or is in progress.

Tell you what. When you get the America West pilots endorsing DOH for their deal with Airways then I'll sign on. How do you think that would go over? It's hard to believe we have a dues paying ALPA member that just doesn't understand why DOH isn't going to happen and if it did would be biased heavily in favor of ASA. Why should ASA pilots come out ahead of SkyWest pilots?

Like I told someone else you really need to talk to some of your MEC officers and have them explain the ALPA merger manual to you. What you really need to get clued in on is career expectations. And ask yourself what could you have reasonably expected if no merger had occurred. Even some of your fellow pilots have said DOH would not be a fair integration. Here's an excerpt from an earlier post.

An equitable merger protocol would take these factors into account and preserve career expectations.

1. Average ASA pilot is more senior than average SKYW pilot
2. SKYW pilots historically upgrade much faster than ASA pilots, in some cases less than 6 months and generally within 2 or 3 years

3. ASA was rescued from near certain bankruptcy
4. Prior to acquisition ASA pilots had no expectation of UAX flying
5. Prior to acquisition ASA pilots had no expectation of west coast bases
6. Prior to acquisition ASA pilots had no expectation of potential codeshare flying for partner other than DAL. SKYW actively bids for flying with other airlines according to SEC filed documents.

An equitable merger protocol would not harm SKYW pilots the way a pure DOH merger would. An equitable merger protocol would force ASA pilots to make some sort of sacrifice in exchange for the new opportunties offered. In light of the fact that ASA would be bankrupt had they not been purchased by SKYW how can any reasonable person suggest that SKYW pilots should be harmed in the aftermath of a merger? If nothing else relative seniority could be achieved. So if you have someone at the 33.6% pre-merger they are 33.6% after the merger.

 

[Gr82Aviate]

SKYW started flying codeshare for Western about 26 years ago. What you don't hear on this board is SKYW folks complaining about the loss of flying and resultant loss of income as SLC lineholders found themselves on reserve as a result of SLC flying being given to ASA.

Best regards and enjoy ATL,

another west coast fruit or nut

Dave, Actually we were completely independent 26 years ago...We didn't start the codeshare with Western as Western Express until I think 1987, maybe late '86.

 

[atrdriver]

SKYW started flying codeshare for Western about 26 years ago. What you don't hear on this board is SKYW folks complaining about the loss of flying and resultant loss of income as SLC lineholders found themselves on reserve as a result of SLC flying being given to ASA.

Best regards and enjoy ATL,

another west coast fruit or nut

Yeah, just like you didn't hear the ASA pilots bitching too much when SKW moved into DAL and took a whole lot more flying from us then we did from you when we moved into SLC.

And you missed a big one on your list.

Prior to the acquisition the SKW pilots had no expectation of suddenly getting 140 aircraft, and had no expectation of their company running 80% of DCI flying out of ATL.

You just stay in your hole dave. It's our turn now to suffer, but soon it will be yours. You are non union, and JA can pretty much so whatever he wants to you guys. As long as it benefits him to treat you guys well he will. At some point the roles will be reversed, that's just the way the whipsaw works. Personally I would like to see our pilot groups stick together and fight the whipsaw, until I hear a jackass like you talking.

 

[atrdriver]

Yes. Profits have decreased. Revenues on the other hand have increased. Do you understand the difference? Do you understand the concern about profit margins trending downward? I struggled to pass my finanacial and managerial accounting classes and quantitiative analysis was no walk in the park but this is pretty basic stuff that even a dumb guy like me can understand.

Revenue less expenses = profit
Increasing profits - good
Decreasing profits - bad
Increasing revenue and decreasing profit - bad (see previous line)

Watching someone trying to argue SKYW finances with Andy - priceless

If revenue increased 123%, then total amount of profit went up as well, even if the margin dropped by 2%. I thought you said you were good with numbers??

 

[jehtplane]

I guess I could expect a more intelligent repsonse from my 4.5 year old Australian Shepherd. Just another case of some idiot not being able to handle the truth. Those bullet points I posted are hard to argue with. So I can't be too surprised that you just picked up your toys and went off to a corner to pout. Grow up kid.

No they are not ASA is/was out west ,SLC
Yes you get the planes because of your pay rates but we won't go there
Skywest needed ASA in order to stay in the Delta business
ASA actively bids on flying also
An ASA pilots career expectations are every bit as important as a Skywest Pilots.
You are a wholly owned subsidiary of Skywest Inc, just like ASA
The ASA pilot group should not have to convince you to want to join ALPA, you should take that upon yourselves, but I think you are happy with the prospect of continuing to grow at the expense of others because of your pay and lack of union.

 

[BluDevAv8r]

Wow....39 posts and not one factual and accurate answer about how a merger of the 2 lists would occur. IF Skywest Inc were to approve the merger of the lists then the Allegheny-Mohawk LPP would apply and the 2 lists would be merged in accordance with that legal precedent. Who would decide how it would occur? Well both parties would have a Merger Committee meet and ultimately both sides will disagree on how to merge the lists so it will go to a 3rd party neutral arbitrator who will make the final award. Only 1 person will be happy - the most senior pilot on the new list. Everyone else will think they got scr-wed. Remember, ALPA Merger Policy would not apply since this merger wouldn't involve 2 ALPA carriers.

-Neal

 

[FL990]

Sounds like a perfect solution to me. And the SkyWest guys and gals won't mind as long as your DOH is changed to the date SKYW bought you so your former parent company could stay in business.

Pal,

you need to get over that wet dream because it won't happen. No advantage whatsoever to a staple!

 

[buscap]

smokers

I hope everyone posting on the subject of merging the pilots group doesn't have a urinal pop quiz soon.

A pilot merger will not happen. It is in management's best interests to keep us apart. If Comair and ASA never merged, what do you think the possibility of a SKYWEST/ASA merger really is?

And by the way, this pilot VS pilot gripefest is exactly what management wants to hear. Great job cutting our own throats you Nearsighted Cracksmokin Einsteins!

Cooperation between the 2 pilot groups is our only hope for minimizing the effects of whipsaw. We can't do much about most of the whipsaw, but we should fight it when we can...together.

 

[Dave Benjamin]

Dave, Actually we were completely independent 26 years ago...We didn't start the codeshare with Western as Western Express until I think 1987, maybe late '86.

What about the Pocatello flying that started back in 1980? Thought that was for Western

reference: Time Flies by Creedy

 

[Dave Benjamin]

Pal,

you need to get over that wet dream because it won't happen. No advantage whatsoever to a staple!

Pal,

You need to learn how to read things in context. The post was written in response to someone suggesting a DOH integration. Nobody with half a brain thinks that's realistic.

 

[DrunkIrishman]

Dave-

Got an MBA and you think you're smarter than everyone else on this board huh? I know quite a few MBA's that couldn't do what others without MBA's have done. Unless your last name is Hawking, I'm not at all impressed with your IQ. People with GED's are entitled to have their opinions wether mispelled or not.