Skywest TA??? Pay??

[JBcrjca]

Thanks for the clarification on ACA, gentlemen. It's hard enough to keep up with ones own company, let alone the rest of the industry. Fly safe.

 

[FlyingSig]

Your ingnorance is excused. Just being non-union doen't mean you don't have a contract. Guess what, our company (non-union) doesn't use the line "fly it and grieve it." They just honor the contract. Now isn't that refreshing?

Not trying to start a heated debate or anything, just trying to understand.... let's say that the pilots didn't want this TA, but managment really really did even though it would mean an end to the lovefest between employees and management.... Could Skywest management impose the TA or do the pilots actually have some legal clout to prevent this? (I'm not asking if Skywest would do this...just if they could) Do you guys have a scope section in your contract? Are new airframes addressed? Just curious....

 

[Windycity]

I am a skywest pilot , and yes this TA is crap. Sure it's only 18 months, a big positive, unless you think a littlte outside the box. Every pilot who works here knows there is a union drive going on. If you look at the rules of the NMB, when a union is voted in, the CURRENT rates become the letter of the law and cannot be changed without negotiations. Negotiations, which we all know would take years if a union is voted in. All the while we are flying 70 and 90 seat airplanes at CURRENT 50 seat RJ rates. True, our 50 seat RJ rates are currently higher than Eagle, Pinnacle, Air Whiskey, ACA, and Mesa. However, there is no promise we will get a raise in the 70 and 90 seat aircraft in 18 months.

Hence, a very possible scenario which the intellects in SGU have already palyed out. First, we vote for this TA because NOBODY is taking pay cuts, and everyone else is. (That's how this TA is being sold) In 18 months, the industry has recoverd slightly, and UAL has us flying 70's (maybe 90's) all over the place. Skywest pilots salivate because we know our contract is up for re-negotiations when all these 70's begin to get into full swing. Management says hell no to raises! There is nothing in the TA which says they must give us raises in 18 months. WE say oh yea, and vote in our big bad union-FINALLY! The catch, all the pilots who sold their souls "just to get the planes on the property" realize SGU outsmarted us. WE are stuck at these crap 70 and 90 seat rates while we take 2 years to negotiate new ones. Sure, we will have nice 50 seat rates, but in the four years this scenario plays out management makes money hand over fist as we cancel all future 50 seat orders, and are now operating the largest fleet of 70's at the lowest price out there.

For all the pilots who just want to get the planes on the property, think long and hard about it. WE are setting a very dangerous precedent that will come back to haunt us.

 

[small town guy]

I would also like to defend our "TA" at Skywest.

First, I would prefer to see raises in the 50 seat jet, an additional 20 percent for the 70-seater and say an extra 10 percent for the 90 seat RJ. Many would be correct in saying that this would be a fair and reasonable agreement - good for the pilots, good for Skywest, and good for our industry. However, these are not normal times.

Part of the problem with our industry in turmoil and United in bankruptcy is that current United Express carriers must "bid" for future flying while additional non United Express regionals also bid for that same flying that a bankrupcy judge will decide. This obviously means Skywest must be competative including our pilot pay rates.

This is why I think our TA at Skywest is as good as could be expected considering current conditions. If Skywest is awarded future United Express flying, we will have the highest pay rates amoung airlines (Skywest, ACA, Air Wisc, Chataqua, Mesa, ect.) competing for this flying-although I'm not sure about ACA. For example, compared with Air Wisc., our 50 seat captains will make between 3 and 4 dollars more per hour and our F.O.s will also get a couple dollars more. In the 70 seat jet, our F.O.s still make the same amount more and our captains make about 50 cents less. It seems too good to be true with so much at stake-what is the catch?

If we approve this new TA, 70 and 90 seat RJs will be flown at 50 seat rates so no pilot has to take a pay cut and will continue to get yearly raises. Like it was said above, we can only fly 70 seat RJs and still ba a Delta connection. So, for the next 18 months, I will gladly vote "yes" and hope for a much better industry a year and a half from now when we all will be looking at a better future.

Finally, I just think that the common pay rates for 50, 70, and (90?) seat jets is simply a new way to control our costs and disrupt our pilots lives the least. I do not believe we are "racing to the bottom" and I don't think it's an unreasonable agreement.

 

[trip]

There is no reason to vote in favor of this TA, If we do we are setting ourselfs up for big problems 18 months from now. Vote NO, we keep the same rates we have and would have had in the new TA, when managment makes an order for 70"s then lets talk pay. They dont need a pay scale to figure out whether we can operate larger AC our not. The 100+ seat rate is just a dangling carrot and should not even be in the package. Lets not get locked into a precendent setting pay scale before the order is placed!!!

 

[Anaconda]

Re: The SkyWest TA is...

1) Nobody's business but the pilots at SkyWest, certainly not the likes of General Lee (dude, don't you have anything else to do with your time than haunt the Regionals Board? Highest pay to the last day man, whatever) or anyone else who is not a SkyWest pilot.

and it only took the general three posts and one day to try and turn it in to a comair bashing thread...

 

[General Lee]

Man alive, I always get slammed when I bring up a topic I AM INTERESTED IN. Can't I do that? Oh wait, I don't fly for a regional, so I can't go on this board, right? Whatever. I guess I don't know anybody at any regional or have questions about any other airline. Whatever.

Midlifecrisis,

Easy there chief. I like your quote:

) Nobody's business but the pilots at SkyWest, certainly not the likes of General Lee (dude, don't you have anything else to do with your time than haunt the Regionals Board? Highest pay to the last day man, whatever) or anyone else who is not a SkyWest pilot.



Come on dude, you have got to be kidding me? You guys have your own forum, right? So nobody else can talk about Skywest on any other forum? Yeah, ok. You just don't like it that your little secret was leaked. I brought up this discussion after talking about it with a Skywest friend, and I thought it was ridiculous. Don't blame me, our guys at Delta are keeping UP the payscales. Even if we do take a pay cut coming up here, we will still be paid A LOT more than the others, which is good---so they can shoot for that payscale in 5-6 years. Am I haunting the Regional Board? So, according to you I cannot bring up subjects and ask questions at anytime? Sure, whatever, yeah ok.

Windycity,

I think you are correct about your management at SGU. From what I have heard from my friend you do have a pretty good relationship with your management, and I wish we had the same with Leo and company at Delta. But, it is a little strange that they didn't even give you a $5 an hour raise or anything---for a plane that could have 49 more seats (up to 99 seats total). And they want to dangle the carrot of 100-159 seat aircraft without even an order. It just seems sneaky. And how about a promise of wage increases after 18 months, instead of a "review"? Sure, the economy may still be in the tubes, or maybe it will take 2 more years to negotiate. Yes, they may know that you might get a union like ALPA if they do not, but that may take awhile too. But, I see people taking the offer because it promises growth and upgrades for all of the FO's and the junior Capt's will get lines etc.


Anaconda,

Every Delta pilot is not happy with Comair and the MEC Chair's position on not helping the Delta furloughs without the senority resignation. I try to leave it out of other subjects, but sometimes it just slips out.

Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[SKYWRJGUY]

FWIW

For what it's worth, the contract does include ~3% raise per seat inJuly. What used to be both a contract signing date raise, along with an anniversary raise, has been changed to reflect the single raise this summer. Somebody mentioned "at least" getting an extra dollar---for most the 3% will be more than that. Jury is seemingly 50/50 on love/hate it.

 

[Heavy Set]

Quit slammin' the General...

Why are you guys slamming General Lee on this topic? He brings up a great point - Skywest wants to lower the bar for pay like Mesa and Chit-Talk. Shouldn't that be of interest to others? Well shouldn't it? Huh??????????????? He brought it up - and nobody else did...

Windy City and Trip make excellent points about the crap TA - and they are Skywest pilots. They have a right to be outraged...

So, if you guys want to eventually fly for a major someday on the horizon, don't count on it. Why? Because the regionals will be sooooooooo cheap they will operate all trips under 1,000 miles for the majors. Complete outsourcing because of the deals Mesa and (soon) Skywest have made. The economic case will be too COMPELLING to ignore... Yeah, you guys will have ample opportunity to fly thousands of CRJs all around the country while General Lee and his fellow Deltoids are relegated to his 767 flying off to Hawaii and Istanbul (no more trips to Detroit)....

Don't bring the bar down any lower - or the entire industry will suffer...

 

[General Lee]

Thanks Heavy set (I think??). I want to know when we will be flying the 767's FROM Hawaii TO Istanbul? Now that would be a great trip! Maybe Song could fly it?

My whole point is that there should be some more questions made to Skywest management and some more reassurances. If things get better in 18 months, how long will it take to get the new rates? Have it in writing... If they take more than 2 months--the pay automatically doubles. Something like that. Have it in writing!!! If you don't, and management comes up with some more excuses, you will be stuck with it, and all of the other regionals will be doing it too---and you won't be competitive, etc...

Bye Bye----General Lee

PS---I kind of liked Detroit---the Novi Hilton was a nice hotel