SKYWEST Pilots: SAY NO TO ALPA!!

[SkyNation]

I feel that in order to be effective Air Line Pilots need to be represented.

what does it mean to you to be 'effective?'

if you are 'effective' as a pilot group, does it matter what kind of representation you use to achieve that, be it ALPA, SAPA, Teamsters, the Tuesday Night Bridge Club, or the International Brotherhood of Prop Comics?

thanks, I appreciate your well thought out responses. they are anithesis to most union types on here, however.

 

[Rez O. Lewshun]

what does it mean to you to be 'effective?'

if you are 'effective' as a pilot group, does it matter what kind of representation you use to achieve that, be it ALPA, SAPA, Teamsters, the Tuesday Night Bridge Club, or the International Brotherhood of Prop Comics?

thanks, I appreciate your well thought out responses. they are anithesis to most union types on here, however.

Effective means to succed in completing ones own agenda. No it doesn't matter what type of repsrenstation...

One of the "deals" with unions is they are volunteer organizations... So you get alot of guys trying out thier egos.... This isn't a union issue but an social issue...

 

[SKYWRJGUY]

Sorry, I thought you said NUTS (my antecedant incorrect, but statement correct). But regardless, the SWA Airlines Way by Gitner has at its core relational coordination and the idea of knowledge sharing as a basis--again, not really a manifesto of labor relations.

 

[Rez O. Lewshun]

Sorry, I thought you said NUTS (my antecedant incorrect, but statement correct). But regardless, the SWA Airlines Way by Gitner has at its core relational coordination and the idea of knowledge sharing as a basis--again, not really a manifesto of labor relations.

What is labor relations? It is a tactful way of saying "We have to deal with unions on our property"

Relational coordination? Agreed! But how does that begin? With the individuals who are charged with the operation of the company. In other words, the corporate leadership has made a active and positive choice to work with unions. To create a positive relationship. They have decided to work together and not fight....

 

[SkyNation]

Effective means to succed in completing ones own agenda. No it doesn't matter what type of repsrenstation...

My agenda is to work for a company that:

-pays me at or above my counterparts at other companies while remaining competitive and viable for the long haul

-seeks to employ good people who will contribute to a positive work environment

-provides me with opportunities to advance

-has work locations where I want to live and raise my family

-runs a safe, quality operation that is innovative, dynamic and able to adjust to an ever changing marketplace


so, for me, and lots of folks here at SkyWest, our current structure is providing us with what we want, or our agenda. I'll agreee with you, that the particular type of representation is not important. It is the results that matter.

 

[Gr82Aviate]

lol ok I admit my post was over the top and mostly a joke. To accuse me of being in the Klan though?? wow...... that is all I have to say about that. I still won't sign the card though. This is exactly a big part of what turns me off to ALPA. Every time there is a union drive it always turns into mud slinging. The union drive in 2004 turned into a big time mud slinging fest toward the end and it went down in flames. Maybe if you guys would use some tact instead of resorting to name calling you would get somewhere. So far I admit the OC has done a fairly good job of keeping things mostly civil. Only time will tell how things go toward the end. I still won't sign my card either way though.

Can't say how shocked I am to see how "open minded" you are...

 

[igneousy2]

Do you think you will get anything more than this when you have ALPA negotiating for you?

ALPA negotiates an AGREEMENT...the company has to agree to whatever you want. Just because you want a higher pay rate for a 70 or a 90 seater does not mean they will give it to you. You can haggle, rationalize, yell insults but at the end of the day...it comes down to okay you want that...or else what?

are you willing to strike?

are you willing to do sporatic work stopages?

What are you willing to do to get that 90 seat pay rate?

Contract negotiations under the RLA takes YEARS! You cannot DECIDE to go on strike, you must be RELEASED to go on strike.

I have several friends at Skywest and I have seen pay stubs to confirm this...Skywest pilots as far as total W2 wages are amongst the highest paid regional pilots period.

Some things you have that is RARE at other regionals...

1. trip/duty rigs that allow many pilots to routinely credit 100+ hours of pay in a month.

2. great performance incentive bonuses.

3. 12 hour reserve RAPS

4. Reserve pilots can fill there reserve days with open time essentially becoming line holders for the month.

5. If I understood my friend correctly...you are assigned a trip worth 20 hours...you get displaced because the Captain you are assigned to is an IOE captain...you get credited with the 20 hours...you can then pick up another trip on the same day for 20 hours and then get paid 150% for that trip...so your total pay credit for that 4 day period is 50 hours! At most other regionals you would get displaced...then reassigned to the other trip...then get paid the greater of the two trips...in this example ZERO extra.

6. Other things like #5 above that would be considered ridicules at other airlines.

The friends I have at Skywest have been at other carriers...and there answer is YES, the grass is greener!

As far as voting yes or no for ALPA there are some good reasons and some bad reasons in my opinion in this particular instance...

Good: representation if management wants to give you a career ending whap on your pee-pee, some extra insurance, dues tax deduction, free magazine subscription.

Bad: improve pay drastically and/or quicklly, improve work rules drastically and/or quicklly. -- If you vote for these reasons I can gurantee you that you will be disappointed.

Think of the union as your lawyer...they negotiate for you...they represent you in hearings...they lobby for you in congress...but at the end of the day it all depends on what your pilot group can convince your company to agree to. If they are already giving you "just enough" then how much more can you expect? Nobody gets paid what they deserve.

FEDEX is making a ton of money and nobody is really doubtful about there business model going forward...airlines on the other hand. FEDEX pilots got there TA because of the unique circumstances that exist between the FEDEX pilot group and FEDEX management. This in no way indicates what "ALPA" will be able to do for Skywest.

Later,

 

[SkyNation]

Some things you have that is RARE at other regionals...

1. trip/duty rigs that allow many pilots to routinely credit 100+ hours of pay in a month.

True

2. great performance incentive bonuses.

True

3. 12 hour reserve RAPS

True

4. Reserve pilots can fill there reserve days with open time essentially becoming line holders for the month.

Not true. You are at the mercy of crew scheduling. They will fill in your scheduled reserve days as they see fit.

5. If I understood my friend correctly...you are assigned a trip worth 20 hours...you get displaced because the Captain you are assigned to is an IOE captain...you get credited with the 20 hours...you can then pick up another trip on the same day for 20 hours and then get paid 150% for that trip...so your total pay credit for that 4 day period is 50 hours! At most other regionals you would get displaced...then reassigned to the other trip...then get paid the greater of the two trips...in this example ZERO extra.

Mostly true. Once you are displaced, they have up until 72 hours prior to your original show time to put something on your schedule. It must credit equal to or greater than your original trip. Once within the 72 hour window, your off with pay and can pick up swap board trips, or open time for extra $. Or, you can just be off with pay for the original trip.


Later,

We have lots of great things at SkyWest.

 

[Flyguy801]

As I said in a ealier post, have the ASA pilots vote off ALPA and merge two pilots groups or have SkyWest vote in ALPA and merge the two groups....

but think about this, if something goes wrong such as missing pay for FT and you have to file paper and you wait for a while..Non Union, call payroll, they look at it and then they ask you if you want a check cut or it paid in your next pay check..

Either way if SkyWest goes Union or not, it won't effect me. I personally would like to see ASA vote off ALPA and merge the two groups BUT with 3 differant pay scales IE: EMB120/ATR, CRJ200, CRJ700/900.

 

[twott driver]

The skywest pilots continually point to the fact that their w2's are the highest in the industry. What you have to bear in mind is that if the ASA contract passes with rates anywhere near to what the company is now proposing, your pilot costs would be way ahead of ASA..........

What implications are there to that? WHIPSAW!

You can be sure that they will be coming after you next for cuts, with the threat of transfer of flying and zero growth.

You all seem to think that Jerry has a special place in his heart for Skywest. I can assure you that as the head of a publicly traded company, the only concern in his heart is return on investment and profit growth for his shareholders. He doesn't give a sh!t about where he gets his cost cuts.

Believe this: HE IS COMING AFTER YOU ALL NEXT

 

[Rez O. Lewshun]

What implications are there to that? WHIPSAW!

You can be sure that they will be coming after you next for cuts, with the threat of transfer of flying and zero growth.

Respectfully, not sure about coming after..... more like imposing terms...

The ALPA pilots who have voted on concessions recently did so from the negotiations table. They were able to make improvments in some areas...

 

[Detroitpilot22]

when is the vote at skywest?

 

[igneousy2]

4. Reserve pilots can fill there reserve days with open time essentially becoming line holders for the month.

Not true. You are at the mercy of crew scheduling. They will fill in your scheduled reserve days as they see fit.

I think you missed the point...they fill your schedule AHEAD of time..it is often the case that you already have trips filled in for your reserve days or weeks ahead of time. This is NOT the practice at the vast majority of airlines. Usually, you only find out the afternoon before even though the trip has been "held for reserves" all month.



Later

 

[wanagethi]

Let's get to the point, if Skywest would have voted alpa in, they could not undercut everyone's pay, and face it you should be embarrassed to fly the 900 for 200 pay. That is ludicrous. Pretty scabby to me.

 

[HelloNewman]

Let's get to the point, if Skywest would have voted alpa in, they could not undercut everyone's pay, and face it you should be embarrassed to fly the 900 for 200 pay. That is ludicrous. Pretty scabby to me.

Im not embarassed. Jet Blue E-190 capt flies for a top out of $89/hr, skywest flies for $93/hr. Usairways top 190 rate at 16 years is $95/hr. Skywest is $2 less. If we should be embarassed then they surely should be ashamed also right? Or do they get immunity from irrational flightinfo anger because they are "mainline". Are they scabby too?