SkyWest + Continental = Love

[hotwing]

SHHH!

General Lee - Are you in this conversation?

 

[scottm]

socalpilot-
I can agree with that statement regarding not getting a second chance to participate in the offer. As far as the 33, about a dozen of them are in training right now at Xjet, supposed to hold a position on the next bid and if from here on out we only see expansion, should be okay. Sadly though, as traffic usually declines after the summer, block hours will fall and we could see them furloughed again. The remains of the 33 is up in the air. We are pay protected until the day we get back to Xjet. I even called the union once recalls were delayed and asked if I could go to Commutair now and the union told me to stop compaining, stay home and be happy that I am getting paid to do nothing. I guess it wouldnt make sense to you either if you were a line holding jet captain.
P.S. what part of so cal- I grew up in the south bay and flew out of TOA and SBA in the beginning.


Smoove Ride-
Thank god, and screw the dixie chicks.

 

[embdrvr]

Thank god, and screw the dixie chicks.

If I can get the blonde one on the right side of the Entertainment Weekly cover, you bet I'll be thanking someone!

 

[Rank&File]

Isn't it interesting that Continental chooses these non-union airlines to fly props into their hubs? This must be a huge slap in the face for the CALEX pilots. I know there is a concerted effort by CAL ALPA to get Commutair on board with ALPA, but Sky West is probably a lost cause. They'll never let the CAL and CALEX pilots pressure them into representation.

 

[ATRCA]

socalpilot;

You said something that I'm sure you couldnt have possibly witnessed or heard yourself.

Your inference that some of our furloughed pilots claimed to be too good for the Beech is total BS and I think you know that. Thats the kind of BS rhetoric that made things uncomfortable when the CA code-share was announced.

Your preoccupation with "arrogant" CoEx folks is tiring. You have 10% a$$holes in every pilot group and ours is no different I'm sure. I have not heard, seen or otherwise been made aware of anyone who wasnt anything but greatful that opportunities with CA were avaliable to our furloughed folks.

I was in CLE this moring and yesterday and heard nothing but good things about our guys and the CA pilots working relationship. If you have had a different experience then by all means, make us aware. I have said on this board before that the CA guys are welcome, however rhetoric like yours will only cause both our groups unneeded strife.

Cheers.

 

[Jeepman]

Rank & File

You are 100% correct. There is no way the majority of SkyWest pilots would be stupid enough to let ALPA in. Look what ALPA has done for MESA. "Oh, you had better sign this this is the best it is going to be" What kind of ALPA garbage is that. The ONLY reason ALPA wanted MESA to sign their HORRIBLE TA is so that ALPA could make money off of poor regional pilots.

If we do get a union it will be a SkyWest pilot union. ALPA only cares about ALPA & the majors.


As for the Coex deal if it was up to me, the Houston thing would be ALL COEX pilots. I like growth, but not at the expense of others.

 

[ATRCA]

Your a good man Jeepman,

While I'm not furloughed (yet) it is a bit painfull for our guys some of which were on the E120 when they were furloughed to see someone else fly old and current XJT routes while they sit home.

I hope something can be worked out that will benefit our guys yet couse no harm the the folks at SkyWest. There's no reason why something amicable to both groups can't be worked out.

See yah.

 

[GuppyPuppy]

As for the Coex deal if it was up to me, the Houston thing would be ALL COEX pilots. I like growth, but not at the expense of others.

Kind of like the enormous growth that SkyWest has enjoyed over the past several years at the expense of United and Delta pilots?

I know that I may be comparing apples to oranges because SW flies RJ's and the majors don't. But, you can't argue the fact that most RJ destinations out of LAX and SFO are flying routes that used to be flown on 737's. I understand that especially in today's market certain city pairs cannot support a 737.

Would you be willing to let UA and DL pilots fly your RJs on those routes that were formerly using 737's? What if, SW got some B1900's to use for CO in IAH? Would you still want COEx pilots flying them? I am all for interviewing furloughed COEx pilots and placing them at the bottom of the seniority list, but to say that "..the Houston thing would be ALL COEx pilots..." is something I disagree with.

With little or no overall market growth over the past couple of years, most if not all growth has been at the expense of others.

Like Norm Peterson says, "It's a dog eat dog world, and I'm wearing milk bone underwear"!

Cheers!

GP

 

[ATRCA]

As for where CoEx pilots should be placed if offered postions at SkyWest. Thats a dead issue for me.

Their ONLY rightful place would be at the bottom of the list at SkyWest. It would be truely unfair for any SkyWest pilot to give up anything because their Mgt. negotiated with another company that happened to have folks on the street.

Creating pain for one pilot group while attempting to alleviate pain at another is ridicules. It would only create strife that would make the working environment awful.

 

[nimtz]

CommutAir had a pool when we started the expansion with CAL and all the Express guys were hired first, then they pulled from the pool. When the additional props were first announced all eligble Coex furloughs were offered jobs. Many people turned it down and said "I'm too good to fly a 1900". My personal feeling is that if you didn't accept the position your union negotiated for you the first time you shouldn't be allowed to take a spot at Skywest.

As was said before, you are trying to start BS that is not there! The number one employer of our furloughed pilots is Best Buy. No that is not a joke, but the true answer from our surveys. Still think a majority of our furloughed pilots think they are too good for the Beech? People turned down the position for various reasons. Some of them do have other flying jobs where they haven't been required to give up their number. I guarentee you no more then a few thought they we're too good for the Beech. You can't have that attitude at Express, because eventually you're going to have a very ugly fight with a jet captain that's a former Beech guy.

XJet pilots have been very friendly to Commutair guys. I remember how you guys we're hanging out outside the crewroom in CLE at first, because you we're told you weren't allowed in there. I went in there last week and saw 3 Commutair guys passed out on the coaches. Surprise, surprise nobody woke them up and yelled at them for taking space that is supposed to 'belong to Express pilots only.'

 

[Metro A-Team]

Guppy Puppy, I am with ya!!! It mostly has to do with that fact that I am a SW pool man...but here's a question.

(I realize that I ask this at the risk of being "black balled"...at least as much as a person can be when no one knows who I am...)

So, I'm taking all opinions on why Xjet guys should be put on line before poolies? If they wanted to work for SkyWest why didn't they interview like the rest of us? Yes, I understand that these are "old xjet routs" but if xjet could still staff and fly them why aren't they...?

It seems to me (IMHO), that if SkyWest is going to be the name on the paycheck, than it should be guys that wanted to work for SkyWest sitting in the front office, not guys who chose to work for another airline...

Now, with that being said, I am all for ya'll getting a special look when you come to SLC to interview but moving to the front of the line will only put a bad taste in the mouths of us poolies. Granted there are only 60 of us but I was told at the interview that we were the future of SkyWest...

As a side, it really sucks that some of you dudes are out of work. I'm sure there are a few of you that I went to school with...Good luck!!

 

[maddog805]

Rank & File

You are 100% correct. There is no way the majority of SkyWest pilots would be stupid enough to let ALPA in. Look what ALPA has done for MESA. "Oh, you had better sign this this is the best it is going to be" What kind of ALPA garbage is that. The ONLY reason ALPA wanted MESA to sign their HORRIBLE TA is so that ALPA could make money off of poor regional pilots.

If we do get a union it will be a SkyWest pilot union. ALPA only cares about ALPA & the majors.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not "pro Alpa" by any means, but it cracks me up when people blame alpo because mesa's pilot group are a bunch of coochies. The correct statement would be: Look what Mesa has done for Mesa. They didn't HAVE to sign anything. I'm not saying alpo is completely innocent but DAM. I hope we do get an internal union at SkyWest.

 

[Bjet Driver]

I'm surprised

I turned down a position at CommutAir. Why?? Certainly not because I'm an RJ stud and too good for the Beech. Certainly not because I'm an XJT stud and too good for CommutAir. So why then??? Personal and professional reasons at the time. I spoke with my wife about it, and we decided to bypass for financial reasons. From a pilot's point of view, I didn't want to endure 2 training cycles ( on 2 diff A/C) in 2 months. That's why. Did my decision matter?? Nope. XJT management ended up bypassing us anyway for the same reasons. It cost me $1000's for not signing, and my May recall class was cancelled puting me on the street again. Anyway, it's a decision I made and will have to live with. It's a decision many XJT pilots made- but none of us made it because we are on some high and mighty power trip.

Now there may be a similar situation developing with Skywest. Are you telling me I don't deserve an opportunity because I originally bypassed CommutAir?? That's just wrong. As it turns out, the job I did have is entering the off-season and I will struggle for the next 4 months to pay bills. At this point I don't expect anything from XJT union/management. I've lost all faith really. But if I'm offered an interview or position with Skywest this summer, I'm in. I would love to fly EMB120's for Skywest. I will go to work with the same positive attitude I had for 8 months at XJT, and enjoy every day I have in the sky. No questions asked.

Finally, do I want to take a position from a Skywest poolie? NO WAY! I hope it's arranged so both furloughees (XJT) and poolies (SKY) are given an opportunity to get back to work. I don't care if they flip a coin to see who goes to training first. There's no reason for any bad blood between the two- let's not go there guys.

GOOD LUCK TO ALL.........................

 

[socalpilot]

ATTN: All Coex pilots

I'm not trying to create any bad blood between CommutAir and Coex pilot groups. I have nothing but good experiences in my dealings with Coex pilots. Most of the guys have been very friendly and many have even offered drinks and snacks when our paths cross. You have welcomed us into CLE and treated us with respect. The Coex guys who took jobs at Commutair are great. Many of the things I said are based off threads from the Calforums board as well as Flight info when the Prop MOU was first announced. I'm not going to go back and research all the threads but I know what I read. It is those guys that thought they were above the rest of us that I have a problem with. With that said, it is my wish that CA and Coex work together and keep management from putting us in a situation where we are forced to work against each other. CAL just announced they are selling all their shares of XJET and it appears they may be positioning themselves to obtain feed from other carriers should Coex decide to strike. I just don't want to be caught in the middle when things get ugly. I wish no ill will toward any Coex pilot but reserve the right to express my opinions in regards to the people who said they would never take a job flying a prop. It's just my opinion. Just like you have your opinion. I respect your opinion but I don't have to agree.

 

[ATRCA]

Nuff said, no offense taken SoCal

I too have had nothing but good experience with the CA folks. I just hate to see damaging rhetoric on these boards (Calforums)when in reality the cooperation is good. The level of cooperations has been much better than I expected frankly. I'm proud of our pilot group. I think under the circumstances there are plenty of other groups who might find it harder to get along.

BTW, CAL did not announce that they were divesting themselves of XJT. They simply made it easier to sell the stock in pieces or in chunks. In addition, they would not need to sell XJT in order to contract with other cariers in the event of a work stopage at XJT. Our agreement with them allows them to do so anyway. At day 90 of a strike CAL takes posession of all our A/C.

Struck work anyone?? Any takers?? I doubt it.

 

[EMBATP]

JUNE 1

TALKED TOA CHECK AIRMAN 30 MINUTES AGO. SAID THE SKYWEST THING WAS A DONE DEAL. STARTING JUNE 1 IN IAH. UP TO 30 E-120'S TO BE FLOWN BY CAL/CALEX PILOTS. SOME OFF OUR OLD E-120'S I KNOW MAYBE SOME OF SKYWEST'S A/C ALSO. POSSIBLY ALL SEATS FILLED BY FURLOUGHED GUYS BUT NOT SURE. TO START JUNE 1 THOUGH, GUYS WOULD HAVE TO BE IN TRAINING NOW, SO WHAT GIVES?

 

[skyhogg]

I would be VERY surprised to see Skywest enter into any deal that would have ALL seats filled with a company's furloughed pilots. They considered a J4J with US Air awhile back for some ungodly amount of jets to be flown back east. They submitted it to the pilot group to wiegh the support and it was turned down with a resounding majority, (something like 85% against). I think that they honored the pilot groups wishes because they really want to keep morale as high as possible and avoid a union push to be a viable possibility.

Problem is that the US Air deal involved both left and right seats and really would've screwed Skywest guys out of their seniority. If they enter into a deal with CAL in the E-120 that effectively does the same thing, how quickly would the pilots unite?

My guess is that it will involve giving priority interviewing to the CAL/COEX guys and put them on the bottom of the list while allowing them to maintain their seniority at their respective company.

Just my speculation tho....good luck to all. Hope everyone can be back flying soon!

 

[Socalplt]

If we start up an operation in HOU these positions will be filled by a system wide bid which would allow any pilot on the senority list to bid for it. That being said I imagine it will go very junior, with most if not all FO positions going to newhires. Any Captain position would be filled by this bid as well. The only way it would go to someone not currently on our senority list (and to a new hire) is if they don't get enough bids for the position. Additonally, I'd think that the guys in the pool probably should plan on heading to Texas unless they're being hired into the jet.

This is how all positions have been filled in the past -- by senority.

If the company plans on doing anything else it would be a good way to piss off 1400 pilots and fire up a union drive.


(By the way I'm not Socalpilot)

 

[Obi-Wan]

I'm one of the guys who took the job at Commutair and would definitely want the opportunity to work at Skywest since I live out west. The way the union has informed me the only flying so far are is the VCT EAS until the union and the company agree on what to do. Our turboprop MOU states that our furloughed pilots should take these jobs. If this would happen we would get stapled to bottom of the current Skywest seniority, not integrated, which would be fair. Also, as we did at Commutair there would be no interview, only a lets get to know each other session. We would be guaranteed the spots. The Brasilia’s that will be flying are the ex Coex ones and many are fully refurbished and brand new (I used to fly one). As far as the poolies go I don’t know. Since they are not officially hired until finishing training, I think they will come onboard after the coex guys. This deal would benefit them as well since there is going to be expansion. The other way the poolies will benefit from this deal is that our union would not agree to Skywest not paying us during training, so that should set precedence. Now this the way it worked out at Commutair and we might work out a different deal in this situation. No matter what the deal should benefit both pilot groups. I have two good friends that have had their classes canceled ( one had already quit his job ) and love to be flying with both of them soon.

 

[embdrvr]

Also, as we did at Commutair there would be no interview, only a lets get to know each other session. We would be guaranteed the spots.

Something tells me that won't work out that way. I bet you get preferential interviews though. There are probably people at Coex that interviewed previously @ SkyWest unsuccessfully. Chances are they won't just open the floodgates. I admit that it's simply a WAG on my part but I'd bet a 6-pack on it.

 

[CA1900]

At day 90 of a strike CAL takes posession of all our A/C.

Struck work anyone?? Any takers?? I doubt it.

What's to stop CommutAir? As pilots for a non-union carrier, CommutAir pilots might be faced with that very proposition if our company decides to help fill the void in the event of a strike by XJT. Frankly, I'd let them fire me before I'd fly struck routes, but hopefully our work to bring ALPA into CommutAir will keep me from having to make that choice because it'll be a provision in our contract.

And Rank&File, we've been trying to organize a union at CommutAir since before the codeshare with Continental was even in discussions. A core group of CommutAir pilots has been working very hard to bring ALPA in ourselves. CAL ALPA is now assisting us because we want them to, but don't think for a minute that it's an outside group wanting us to be ALPA. Quite the contrary.

 

[Obi-Wan]

Something tells me that won't work out that way. I bet you get preferential interviews though. There are probably people at Coex that interviewed previously @ SkyWest unsuccessfully. Chances are they won't just open the floodgates. I admit that it's simply a WAG on my part but I'd bet a 6-pack on it.

I'm sure the opposite is true as well. But if this deal was to be worked out it would be a guranteed job. Also, if a person does not pass an initial interview and some one else does it does not necessarily mean one pilot in better than the other. As a matter of fact a friend of mine that was fuloughed from a major with lots hour under his belt failed the sim at Skywest and some intructors made it. But as we all know the level of experience shows up latter on in the training cycle when the less experienced guys need more sim , AC training and IOE which costs a lot of money. Skywest knows this as well thats why a few months ago when they where doing interviews still they where giving some guys with lots of 121 time the option to bypass the sim. I have flown the 120 before and am flying the 1900 now. So have many other Coex pilots. The floodgates would be open to experienced pilots.

What's to stop CommutAir? As pilots for a non-union carrier, CommutAir pilots might be faced with that very proposition if our company decides to help fill the void in the event of a strike by XJT.

Commutair does not have the capacity or the financial backing to take on such a task. You know that they offered us the houston flying before Skywest and we turned it down. Skywest does not have 200 Rjs like coex either to do this. Also, coex will be the exclusive operator for CAL until 2006, thats in writing. The real reason why Coex does not want to do the prop flying is that they want to get larger AC in the future and no it wont be a streched out RJ.

 

[maddog805]

If this would happen we would get stapled to bottom of the current Skywest seniority, not integrated, which would be fair. Also, as we did at Commutair there would be no interview, only a lets get to know each other session. We would be guaranteed the spots.

Are you on the SKW management team? You seem to know exactly what will happen.

The West air guys had to interview ALL OVER. They weren't guaranteed anything and SKW took over the company. What makes you so SURE that things will play out this way. I wouldn't be so sure.....

 

[hotwing]

obi-

I do not think that anyone knows except management and we will all have to wait and see what really happens here. You have an opinion and that is all that you have, just as I do.. What you think should happen and what does happen will probably be two differing circumstances...


Take care!

 

[everyonedoa360]

The West air guys had to interview ALL OVER.

Ah,

WestAir was bought by Mesa who then lost the UAL contact. Westair Pilots should have been interviewed and not just hired automatically. Skywest didn't buy them!

 

[Obi-Wan]

Are you on the SKW management team? You seem to know exactly what will happen.

The West air guys had to interview ALL OVER. They weren't guaranteed anything and SKW took over the company. What makes you so SURE that things will play out this way. I wouldn't be so sure.....

No, but I am a CALALPA member an know what our contract and MOU says. Last time I checked Skywest is not buying CAL. Again thats how things are right now. Now our union in the interest of our pilot group might decide to do something diffrent and since we are in contract negotiations now we might change our mind if they give us something better. For example, some of the people who where eligable for jobs at Commutair where taken of the list and are getting a salary since they are due for recall soon. No matter how you look at it its a great opportunity for Skywest since United is not doing that great and Delta is expanding Comair in the west. If a few furloughed guys got a job at Skywest it would not change anything. Both parties come out on top here.
Again nothing is set in stone and I will post the new info as soon as I find out.

 

[JBcrjca]

It's rather amusing to see what everyone else knows about what SkyWest is going to do in this situation. I work for SkyWest, and the only thing I know about the SW/CAL deal is what I've read on this forum. The company has made no formal announcements about anything. How do so many outsiders claim to know what's going on? Believe this: nothing can be believed until formal announcements are made. Until then, there's no point in getting your panties in a bunch. Everything else is just pure speculation.

 

[utahpilot]

just out of curiosity, where out of IAH will these 120s fly? what are the destinations? what kind of trips will the be, lots of locals or a mix of 3 and 4 days? are these cities that have gone unserved until now?

wondering

UP

 

[EMBATP]

iah

the cities i have heard: waco, tyler, victoria, killeen, san angelo, abilene ( all old beech/120 runs) also i heard 8-10 e-120's in iah, 20 or so in florida to supplement/replace gulfstream

 

[mckpickle]

Also, coex will be the exclusive operator for CAL until 2006, thats in writing. The real reason why Coex does not want to do the prop flying is that they want to get larger AC in the future and no it wont be a streched out RJ.

Actually it was extended until 2007 due to the jet deliveries being delayed. And Coex has no plans to get larger aircraft. The buisness plan is based on a single fleet type like Southwest. Before with 3 types we had an average of15% of pilots in training at any one time. Thats 300 pilots just sitting around getting paid with no productivity return. If we ever got bigger planes it would be a VERY cautious endever.