SkyWest + Continental = Love

[jbDC9]

man, you're killin' me!

Sure is funny to watch Skyward go "WAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHH!!!!!!" about XJT's God-given right to the flying on those routes. Really, watching these XJT guys whining about "their flying" and scope cracks me up... for the last few years CALEx has been steadily growing on an expanding diet of ex-mainline routes. I'd list a few but can't count that high on the flying mainline has lost. Mainline guys cried "Scope!", but our scope clause is weak, so there's not much we can do about it. We just watch these RJ's take over the world... personally I'd rather see a single seniority list with higher RJ pay rates, but I know that won't happen.

Like a couple others have already said, it's CALs flying to be doled out as they see fit, and I'm sure they'll find loopholes in the ALPA contract to get another contract feeder in the door. It's a management thing, so don't get pissed at the SKW pilots; it ain't their fault.

Continue flogging the horse, it's almost dead now...

 

[Metro A-Team]

I am certainly in no possition to give advice...but if I was, I'd suggest that any Coex guy that isn't currently flying for their company or someone elses should apply on the SkyWest web site...it sounds like they may be looking to hire some more good people.

Cheers

 

[s.o.sJTB]

The word from one of our VP's here at SkyWest is that some furloughed pilots will be offered positions, will be treated as newhires and will be put at the bottom of the list. Nobody is going directly to the left seat from off the street unless for some reason there are not enough eligible FO's who want to bid for the spot. That's very unlikely.

.

That is true but i wouldnt be surprised if SkyWest has some of these new hires going to the left seat, in the Dec 2002 newhire class some were offered Captain seats as newhires. No one else wanted the seats and seniority was not compromised, some had previously held Captain seats at SkyWest and left for other companies, now furloughed they returned to the bottom of the seniority list. Others worked for other companies and met the equivalant hours requirement at SkyWest. I dont see alot of interest in RJ fo's taking captain Emb-120 seats here.

 

[Ben Dover]

News Flash

I've be restraining myself, but can't hold back any longer.

FLYING DOESN'T BELONG TO ANYONE!!!

IF it belongs to anyone, it belongs to who ever is doing it at that moment in time.

If someone comes along and starts flying a route and pushes the other carrier out, guess what? Now it's their flying!! If management promises you it's YOUR flying and then gives it to someone else, too bad it NOT YOUR FLYING. Unless of course you hire a bad ass attorney who can wrestle it away from management and give it back to you? GET IT??? It's gorrilla war fare.

If you want flying to be bequeathed to someone then lobby your congressman for the industry to be reregulated.

I'm not saying I agree, I'm saying it's the way it is in a market economy.

Just the messenger,
B. Dover

 

[RichardFitzwell]

Re: News Flash

I've be restraining myself, but can't hold back any longer.

FLYING DOESN'T BELONG TO ANYONE!!!

IF it belongs to anyone, it belongs to who ever is doing it at that moment in time.

If someone comes along and starts flying a route and pushes the other carrier out, guess what? Now it's their flying!!Just the messenger,
B. Dover

Hey Ben,

Please go back to restraining yourself...

You're right in that flying doesn't belong to anyone but the revenue, in the form of passengers, belongs to Continental.

Continental advertised to attract the pax, sold the ticket, rented the terminal space and hired the ticketing agents, baggers, etc.

All this cost $$$. Now another company with lower costs pops up and says, "we can do the flying part cheaper". I don't think it's right. While I sit on furlough, I see companies like Commutair and Skywest growing by flying the pax I once flew.

I don't expect much in the area of pay on CAL's new contract but you can bet the new scope clause will be much tighter. Many pilots are sick of seeing their pax being flown by the lowest bidder.

In my opinion, nothing against the pilots but companies like Skywest can do all the flying they want...just not with pax holding tickets that say "Continental Airlines".

 

[socalpilot]

I don't think it's right. While I sit on furlough, I see companies like Commutair and Skywest growing by flying the pax I once flew.

Everyone who is on furlough at Xjet was offered a job flying at CommutAir as long as you met company minimums. 900tt 100 multi. So, why are all the furloughed Xjet pilots complaining that they don't have a job. The only reason I can see is that they don't have 900 hours or they turned it down. Your company (Xjet) doesn't want to fly turboprops. Sounds like the proper place to channel your anger is to Xjet management for going to an all jet fleet. Some routes are just better served by props. Just take a look at the passenger loads from HPN to EWR. It doesn't make sense to fly these planes on short routes with no people. If it was your company would you just sit back and watch the money burn away.

 

[RichardFitzwell]

Everyone who is on furlough at Xjet was offered a job flying at CommutAir as long as you met company minimums. 900tt 100 multi. So, why are all the furloughed Xjet pilots complaining that they don't have a job. The only reason I can see is that they don't have 900 hours or they turned it down.

socalpilot,

I can't speak for anyone but myself. I was furloughed from CAL (with more than 900 hours TT) and didn't have the senority to flow back to Express.

Please don't take this the wrong way but I couldn't aford to support my family (aka. buy food, pay bills and make house and car payments) on Commutair's starting salary. I think it was somewhere around $16-17,000. I turned down the offer.

I couldn't risk loosing what I now have to jerk gear in a 1900. Granted, its a flying job and I'm sure a lot of furloughed guys are happy to be doing it. Like I said before, its nothing against those pilots. We all have different situations to deal with.

I don't blame the pilots. I blame the industry. I blame the people that have found a way to exploit pilots by paying poverty wages as a way to 'gain experience' for the majors. For many, that big airline salary will no longer be an option and the commuters could very well be their entire career (not that that's a bad thing if the pay was higher).

I'd like to see pilots' wages come up to match their level of responsibility. Being a professional crew member and flying passengers under the name of any major airline should pay more than $17,000 per year.

CALALPA cannot prevent companies from paying this low salary but they can, hopefully, prevent Continental's erosion to the lowest bidder and bring livable wages to entry level positions within the Continental Airline's passenger structure.

 

[GuppyPuppy]

Re: Re: News Flash

DELETED BY GP

 

[Ben Dover]

Re: Re: News Flash

Hey Ben,

Please go back to restraining yourself...

Dam that's funny....you have me rolling on the floor. And in fact you made my point even better than I did.

Originally posted by RichardFitzwell
Continental advertised to attract the pax, sold the ticket, rented the terminal space and hired the ticketing agents, baggers, etc.

All this cost $$$. Now another company with lower costs pops up and says, "we can do the flying part cheaper". I don't think it's right. While I sit on furlough, I see companies like Commutair and Skywest growing by flying the pax I once flew.

But the part you left out is that Continental has made a business decision to out source a part of it's business because it helps CAL make more money. You see Continental isn't in the business of flying their routes, owning planes, or courting loyal passengers. Continental is in the business of making money (something many pilots forget).

It sucks to be furloughed, trust me I know. And I don't blame you for being pissed if someone else walks into the job you had. Unfortunately, that's part of the price we pay in a cut throat industry in a market economy.

Back to lurking,
B. Dover

 

[Obi-Wan]

Well we are hearing a different thing from our union and mgt people. The word out there is that there is going to be a system wide bid here at coex which includes the prop flying out of IAH. Its kinda like subcontracting the training and maintenance to Skywest. CAL already owns a fleet of 120's (I used to fly one) As far as employment goes we will all be express pilots. Training costs will be picked up by CAL same as they did with Commutair. The only difference is that as a result of the CLE flying now we have a much stronger MOU. Now as the jet flying picks up and CAL flowbacks go back to CAL skywest pilots trickle in. Now I grant you all that nothing is set ins tone yet, and its all speculation, but if it did happen this way why would it be bad for skywest. If united liquidated tomorow many skywest pilots would be furloughed. This deal would make money for skywest and open up future jobs. Also, if skywest turnes it down I gurantee you some one else will pick it up. Many here make it sound as if Mesa could not handle the job. Working for any airline flying the 120 while you are on furlough is a great deal, I dont care if its Skywest, Mesa, !!!etc... Its all about job security. What if our furloughed guys get hired at Skywest and united goes out of
business and then you have to furlough. Do our guys go back on the street again while a skywest pilot does the IAH flying? The whole point of this deal is to provide job security for our pilots. I do not believe the union would approve a deal that does not protect our pilots.