Should an ATP be required for both pilots?

[BoilerUP]

I would much rather see a guy who has proven himself in a piston twin with a few 135 checkrides and a couple seasons under his belt.

Check 21 legislation has halved (or more) the availability of 135 night freight jobs, and many older Barons & Navajos have been replaced by Caravans and TBM700s.

That career path, which so many people took in the past, provides fewer and fewer opportunities which will likely continue to shrink in number into the future.

 

[ASA_Aviator]

Check 21 legislation has halved (or more) the availability of 135 night freight jobs, and many older Barons & Navajos have been replaced by Caravans and TBM700s.

That career path, which so many people took in the past, provides fewer and fewer opportunities which will likely continue to shrink in number into the future.

Exactly.

I hear what all of you are saying about the ATP. But what everyone seems to be missing is the practical aspect of this rule. Where are we going to find pilots if a rule like this passed? There just aren't enough pipelines out there to fill the seats of all of the regionals with ATP qualified people. We can argue about what is safer, what is best, etc., but the real question will soon become, who can stay in business and staff their airline?

The only way this could be put into place would be to phase it in slowly, and to grandfather in all of the current 121 pilots. Otherwise, as soon as the majors start hiring again, many regionals would go out of business or shrink dramatically due to lack of flight crews. Even without this rule, in 2-3 years it is going to be HARD to find enough pilots at many regionals. The enrollment at flight schools is way down, and the age 65 rule is just postponing the inevitable.

 

[imacdog]

Even without this rule, in 2-3 years it is going to be HARD to find enough pilots at many regionals. The enrollment at flight schools is way down, and the age 65 rule is just postponing the inevitable.

Hi Kit, good to see you!

 

[rustypigeon]

Where are we going to find pilots if a rule like this passed?

If you pay them, they will come.

The fractionals don't seem to have trouble finding qualified pilots. Imagine if the regionals had to pay better than the fractionals to fill the seats (now we are getting very hypothetical, I know).

Flying checks is not the only way to build up time for ATP mins. There are a lot of ways to build hours that you don't even have to pay for. ATP mins are not very high anyway (although it may seem like a lot if you only have a couple hundred hours). I am not sure why so many guys are hung up on the thought of actually having to get some experience to do the job.

 

[ASA_Aviator]

Hi Kit, good to see you!

Haha. I know, sounds just like him.

 

[ASA_Aviator]

If you pay them, they will come.

The fractionals don't seem to have trouble finding qualified pilots. Imagine if the regionals had to pay better than the fractionals to fill the seats (now we are getting very hypothetical, I know).

Flying checks is not the only way to build up time for ATP mins. There are a lot of ways to build hours that you don't even have to pay for. ATP mins are not very high anyway (although it may seem like a lot if you only have a couple hundred hours). I am not sure why so many guys are hung up on the thought of actually having to get some experience to do the job.

Sure, that is true, eventually. It will take a few years for the pipelines to start flowing again. But, if the regionals start paying FOs a lot more, then the majors will not have much advantage to keep us around, since our costs will come up dramatically. That means a reduction in regional flying, which would solve the pilot problem for the regionals.

 

[rustypigeon]

Sure, that is true, eventually. It will take a few years for the pipelines to start flowing again. But, if the regionals start paying FOs a lot more, then the majors will not have much advantage to keep us around, since our costs will come up dramatically. That means a reduction in regional flying, which would solve the pilot problem for the regionals.

So let me get this straight. An abundance of pilots is a good thing for the pilot group? A shortage of pilots is bad for the pilot group?

 

[brokeflyer]

both pilots should have ATP's and be typed. especially for the regionals.

 

[rondo]

An ATP should be required for any operation requiring a type. this would do wonders for the industry.

 

[BoilerUP]

An ATP should be required for any operation requiring a type.

Reverse that and you have a winner.