Seniority dispute ends at US Airways

[Metrojet]

Separate contracts, blame yourself, don't come crying to me.

wow - thats the best answer you can come up with - after spewing all your reasons why this is going to be heard in the Supreme Court or in another lower court (after you pay Marty all the money you guys owe him)?

We on the east are just waiting to see what the decision is with LOA 93 pay rates - and if it is favorable - we will be very happy for the next 5-7 years with hundreds of retirements on the east - while the west goes nowhere.

C'mon - do you really want the next 5-7 years to be like the last 4? Maybe some of you out West want to move forward.

Metrojet

 

[El Pobre]

Consolidation is the name of the game right now in the industry and no one wants to dance with US AIR because of this seniority issue.

I think that eventually this will be the demise of this airline...but, that will take care of the capacity problem, supply and demand will thus allow more pricing power for the airlines, and perhaps airlines will start turning in year over year profits again. ALPA won't care, because they'll be eager to show what happens to a pilot group when they don't have the tremendous benefits of ALPA representation.

I give it 3-5 years. But the good news for USAIR/AWA pilots is that that's about the time that all of the age 65 geezers will be retiring so all former USAIR/AWA pilots should be able to get a job at whatever airline remains.

With the new hour requirements for ATP qualification, the USAIR/AWA pilots will fill in the bottom of the seniority lists for airlines that are desperate to hire qualified pilots that meet the new minimums.

 

[TransMach]

Consolidation is the name of the game right now in the industry and no one wants to dance with US AIR because of this seniority issue.

I think that eventually this will be the demise of this airline...but, that will take care of the capacity problem, supply and demand will thus allow more pricing power for the airlines, and perhaps airlines will start turning in year over year profits again. ALPA won't care, because they'll be eager to show what happens to a pilot group when they don't have the tremendous benefits of ALPA representation.

I give it 3-5 years. But the good news for USAIR/AWA pilots is that that's about the time that all of the age 65 geezers will be retiring so all former USAIR/AWA pilots should be able to get a job at whatever airline remains.

With the new hour requirements for ATP qualification, the USAIR/AWA pilots will fill in the bottom of the seniority lists for airlines that are desperate to hire qualified pilots that meet the new minimums.

Ding, Ding, Ding ... we have a winner ... neither east or west wins or looses... just the industry. Just as it has always been a business, not a bunch of whipsaw BS ... "they owe me", "my seniority", "my this", "my that". I think it will soon all be over for better times.

TransMach

 

[Taco Rocket]

Consolidation is the name of the game right now in the industry and no one wants to dance with US AIR because of this seniority issue.

I think that eventually this will be the demise of this airline...but, that will take care of the capacity problem, supply and demand will thus allow more pricing power for the airlines, and perhaps airlines will start turning in year over year profits again. ALPA won't care, because they'll be eager to show what happens to a pilot group when they don't have the tremendous benefits of ALPA representation.

How does an internal seniority issue equate to the demise of an airline? Answer: it doesn't. It may make merging more unattractive to some stakeholders, but in the grand scheme of things it is irrelevant. You are not as important as you think you are.

I have seen various crew news videos where (mostly west) guys ask Parker or Kirby what they are going to do about this or that, or enforce this or that. The straight answer is they don't care about you as an employee or person, nor do they care about your seniority concerns or who legally represents you. The pilots asking these questions do so under several false premises. To these two men, and the financial community that drives mergers and acquisitions, pilots are just higher than average compensated employees with an annoying collective bargaining agent.

So end the drama about "how are we going to work together!" and "this will destroy the airline!" Parker told you on a recent video that you are either going to behave as a professional or be shown the door. Perhaps it is this tough love, perceived as a sense of abandonment "from a management that really cares!" "and the end of the 'real' America West!" and "we had a sense of family!" that really bothers you. Either way, it's over, and it's time to move on.

 

[MCDU]

The reason the Westies want the Nic so bad is because it would put their furloughed pilots 25% up the east list instantly, plus they are scared that their jobs out West might get PSAed and they need the lifeboat of the East pilot positions. The East has sacrificed enough. West gets PHX. Trying to place a 2005 hire in front of a 1988 hire will not be accepted in PHL, CLT or DCA. The jobs Westies bought to the merger reminds of the properties people had in Vegas and PHX. Worthless.

M

 

[Tweaker]

+ 1 Taco Rocket. Spot on analysis.

 

[Cowboy75]

wow - thats the best answer you can come up with - after spewing all your reasons why this is going to be heard in the Supreme Court or in another lower court (after you pay Marty all the money you guys owe him)?

We on the east are just waiting to see what the decision is with LOA 93 pay rates - and if it is favorable - we will be very happy for the next 5-7 years with hundreds of retirements on the east - while the west goes nowhere.

C'mon - do you really want the next 5-7 years to be like the last 4? Maybe some of you out West want to move forward.

Metrojet

You guys had your chance in 06 getting a joint contract during better economic times. We are not the ones who grabbed your balls and stormed out. Good luck on LOA 93, more power to you.

I have complete confidence in Marty and Leonidas. The best money I have ever spent.

We'll move forward when the courts decide. Maybe then, it will be binding.

 

[xanderman]

Ooooooo Weeeee! Lots of east hubris here... Gotta love it. Don't forget boys and girls the company asked for a declaratory judgement. It may stir things up a bit. No matter what the east THINKS the 9th said it'll turn out one of two ways. Either DFR II when their DOH list is implemented or the DJ filing by the company will render USAPA's negotiations for anything other than the Nic DOA.

Doesn't matter guys. You either live up to your agreements or deal with the ******************** storm that we are living in.

 

[P38JLightning]

What is USAPA's/East's version of what the list should be regarding DOH and time spent on furlough? IOW does (should) time after DOH spent on furlough count as active service/longevity for the purpose of determining greater seniority over another pilot (West) who had more total active service?

 

[Carl S.]

The "Gold Standard", straight DOH, right from their CBL's! How did DAL/NWA do it? How will CAL/UAL do it? AAA, still living in the 80's!