Ricci is out at FLOPS!!

[boxcar]

Re: Can play too

From what I have heard your MEC and union aren't doing much for you. Do you think it will be ratified by the two-year mark. Hey that sounds like a good question for a poll. What do you say?

If you know anything about RLA contracts, you know two years is not a long time to hammer out a major amendment. I for one will be surprised if there'a a TA at the two year mark. How long did it take Comair (ALPA) or Horizon (IBT)?

 

[flexlrpilot357]

Quote:

Ponder this:
Why does Bombardier’s website (ie…History) not mention who the first large Learjet order came from? 10 of the first 12 Lears built went to EJA.
_____________________________________________

Excuse me???? Didn't know EJA was around in the early 60's. EJA had Lear 23s, huh? Wow, cool

 

[flexlrpilot357]

Oh, wow, I guess you're right. But what's the point? EJA circa 1964 has about as much to do with present-day Netjets as Bill Lear did with present-day Bombardier.

So Netjets won't ever have any Bombardier products, and Flexjet will always have the best-looking aircraft on the ramp. That suits me fine.

By the way, was the Excel inspired by a platypus, or was the design stolen off the drawing boards of some forgotten Eastern-Bloc design bureau?

hey, relax, I'm teasing!

 

[NJA Capt]

Quote:

Excuse me???? Didn't know EJA was around in the early 60's. EJA had Lear 23s, huh? Wow, cool

EJA operated Lear 23, 24, 25, 35, 36, Falcon 20s, Jetsars, and 707s.

If you ever go through Lewisburg, WV, they have a lot of '70s era pictures in the terminal/FBO. In several of the pictures you'll see EJA Lears and Falcons (-EJ tail numbers at the time....big red and blue vertical stripes).

What I was getting at in the previous post was this: Corporate operators are very brand loyal, right? People always want to stay with the same manufacturer (given good history) when they buy new aircraft. After 20 years with Lears, I'd say EJA was pretty loyal to Lear/Gates/Bombardier. EJA would have gone to Bombardier first, with the plans for the fractional in 1984. Something very bad must have happened for us to ditch the Lears and change everything to Cessnas. Otherwise, NJA would probably be flying Lears today.

 

[Semore Butts]

They talk about the Lear purchase in IND

Hey Flexlrjetpilot357, hope you had a great holiday! I haven't spoken to you for awhile. I've been a little busy.

Yeah they talk about the Lear purchase in INDOC during the company history. It's a pretty cool class, the future will be interesting.
In light of recent history, it's great to be a fractional pilot. My buddy at Flex recently upgraded and said he will be the last for awhile.
I Talked to KP the other day and she said you all will be doing some hiring whenever the Challenger 3 comes online.
What is Flex saying about pay on the 300?
One thing is for sure, things never remain the same.
Time to put on my little green suit and go defend the right to free speech.

Have a *&$&^%#$&^0*(^*&^ nice day!

 

[Semore Butts]

Gunfyter,

Flex was setup to be a marketing tool for Bombardier, it was not designed to make a pile of dough (or so I was told).
When Montreal saw what Ejay was doing they leaned on Flex to run in the black.
They did this through various ways, many of which had to do with items relating to the pilots (not good ways, my opinion).
Keep in mind however, one management blunder, can erase any gain you got by cutting costs regarding the pilots.
If Flexs was competing with EJAY it seems to me they would be buying a sh#tload of new airplanes and hiring at least briskly.
The inabilty to guess what was in my future at Flex is one of the reasons I left.

 

[flexlrpilot357]

Thanks for the history lesson. You know what they say, Gunfyter... if your aunt was "otherwise equipped", she'd be your uncle.

So I guess the moral of that story is that EJA preferred to have Learjets, and when we wouldn't whore ourselves out, you went with the second choice. Too bad for you.

Semore, the green suit is repetetive, you're a booger either way!

Hey, relax!!! I'm kidding!!!!

 

[flexlrpilot357]

If Flexs was competing with EJAY it seems to me they would be buying a sh#tload of new airplanes and hiring at least briskly.

How would they do that and remain in the black? We're not operating on the "build it and they will come" philosophy. Unsold airplanes in inventory are a money drain. The last Berkshire Hathaway report I saw said Netjets was losing money. Everyone and their Grandmother knows that our friends in Cleveland are losing money. We haven't done that for over a year. (Not losing money is good, by the way.)

When Montreal saw what Ejay was doing they leaned on Flex to run in the black.

I don't think Montreal (or Dallas) is interested in following the Netjets business model to the last letter. "Management Blunders", as you say, are way down, as illustrated by low charter rates, meeting or undercutting budgets in every operational category, and a year of black numbers at the bottom of the page. We're quite healthy, thanks, just waiting on the economy (and sales) to turn around.

 

[LR45JI]

So I guess the moral of that story is that EJA preferred to have Learjets, and when we wouldn't whore ourselves out, you went with the second choice. Too bad for you.

Flexlrplt,

How is the view from the 4th floor?

It’s not that Bombardier didn’t want to “whore” themselves out – they weren’t willing to take a chance on an unproven concept and provide the venture capital to get it off the ground. Montreal is now wishing they would have; I don’t see the production line on the Cessna side being shutdown in Wichita.

So, I guess you can say EJA went with the 2nd best [at the time] and it worked out for the best. Just look at the residual values we are providing to our owners when compared to FX; but that has more to do with difference of business models.

Would I like to fly the Lear 45 again? Sure. Would I like to fly the new 300? Sure.

I believe Bombardier makes a great product that would work great with EJA operations. However, our mgmt. is too loyal after the run around Montréal gave them years ago. Bombardier said they would “never sell to the competition” ….all I can say is: Avolar

If EJA decided to buy Bombardier products tomorrow you would see half-dozen execs form Montréal in Columbus in about 2 hours in Challenger 300’s and Lear 45’s.

 

[flexlrpilot357]

have fun!

 

[Cliff]

Guess we don't have to hear Ricciii run his trap about NJA anymore...

 

[GooseHZ]

funny

Cliff,

No you dont get to hear him run his trap, but you do got to see what FLOPS can do with RTNs money and 99% of the upper mgmnt still in CGF. Now i dont think FLOPS will ever catch Nets, but i do think we will grow into a stronger company and that is good for all the FRAC providers.



we will just have to see.

FLY SAFE

 

[Aspiring to be]

Do you really think that Raytheon will invest more money into FLOPS? Friends tell me that Raytheon will have to invest a bundle to get the fleet back up to an acceptable standard.

I would expect that Raythoen will put FLOPS on the blocks or go chapter 11 with FLOPS as soon as they can. Invest in a large way I would think is doubtful. I would aso expect many more of the old management at FLOPS to make a slow exit. Raytheon will be required to keep some around for a time and then the axe shall fall.

 

[GooseHZ]

What?



Ok a few questions for you Aspiring:

1.) What is "fleet back up to an acceptable standard. " ??? What is the problem with our used fleet. And how would u know anyway?

2.) Your "friends" who tell you all these thing are they in upper RTN mgnt? Do they know what is going on? But i bet they know as much as u do.........wich is NOTHING about FLOPS.

You have nothing good to say about flops on any of your post here. All you do is spread rumors, so go back to your sales meeting and tell them you are doing a good job posting rumors.mabye sales will pick up for you.

 

[Aspiring to be]

1. To the standard that RTA maintained the aircraft prior to the merger. From what I have been told the condition of your used fleet (I would assume all are used, including the ones brought in by RTA) is in a nut shell not up to standard. I do hope this is not true but I have been told this by people with FLOPS.

2. No my friends that tell me this are pilots or were pilots at FLOPS. It is my understanding that many of the ex RTA pilots have resigned or been fired, why?

3. It is true I have no first hand knowledge of bad maintenance, etc but I do believe my friends. I would think the best thing that has happened at FLOPS of late is the removal of Mr. Rici.

 

[Aspiring to be]

450- My total time is at least four times your posted time. I guess we will see and learn more in the days ahead.

I do know that one person (others have said the same thing)that has told me about the bad things that have taken place at FLOPS is in a position to know. I do hope and expect that Raytheon will correct most problems.

You might be one of those that would not believe that FLOPS merged with RTA and did not buy RTA. It does appear that RTA has bought FLOPS. Have you really accepted the fact that Ricci is not the CEO at FLOPS.

 

[Grim Reaper]

For Me, As a Former RTA guy,

It does not matter one bit who the CEO is. My life in aviation spans 35 years with the only the last four years in fractional aviation. My life in fractional aviation has been in turmoil for over a year now, so the latest shakeup at Flight Options is just one more thing.

Those that are having the most trouble are original Flight Options Pilots who are in a sever state of denial at the loss of their head cheer leader.

No need to get to worked up over it. The only constant is change and change is coming to Flight Options.

 

[flyboycpa]

I have to agree with 450. I can't understand how Aspiring has so much time on his hands to allow him to repeatedly flame or otherwise knock FLOPS. I think you might be better served in the generic AOL Chat rooms, and leave the aviation-speak to those who are interested in valuable information. I was a former 135 Charter Learjet driver, and I'm now a newhire at Options, just getting home from SimuFlite. I'm really impressed with all that is going on, compared to my previous company. I'm unsure about the new CEO, but who isn't? It's up to him to prove that he is here for the long haul (as well as the relationship with Raytheon). Like was said earlier, "the only constant is change." We must accept that, move on, and support the new leadership.

I call your bluff, Aspiring. Who are you? What is your background? What is your current position? With what company? What is your total time (and in what type)? How about coming out from behind your Username and giving us a real name so we can check your credentials? I'll give you guys my full name, so why not you, Aspiring?

Ralph Sammy Swift, Jr
(flyboycpa)

 

[Aspiring to be]

Jr,

You need to grown up a little. Call my bluff? I am just a pilot. Not trying to flame anyone or any company. I started this thread by reporting what I heard from a friend about Ricci being removed as CEO at FLOPS. Having met some of the FLOPS guys around I know that they are crazy about Ricci. I think they believe that he hung the sun and the moon and can do no wrong.

I have friends at all the fractionals and those from RTA tell me about the troubles at FLOPS and how the FLOPS pilots excuse it or refuse to recognize it. My post that have mention FLOPS, other than my original post, are in response to other post.

My background is mostly 121 (over 30 years) but I have a fair amount of time with 135 and 91. I have 8 type ratings, three in small airplanes LR, etc, 5 in larger types from DC-9 on up. Not sure about total time but over 24000. I’ve been there and done that several times! I do not need for you to check my credentials.

 

[SheGaveMeClap]

Aspiring, you said:

I have friends at all the fractionals and those from RTA tell me about the troubles at FLOPS and how the FLOPS pilots excuse it or refuse to recognize it. My post that have mention FLOPS, other than my original post, are in response to other post.

So what problems are you hearing about at FLOPS? You've made up some bull$hit about our mx not being acceptable. What else do your friends complain about? What do we excuse, or refuse to recognize? I've never flown an airplane at Options that isn't safe, or unairworthy. Sure, I've flown around with MELs, but everyone does. When we pull into a mx base or outstation, it's fixed ASAP, no questions asked. And it's usually within a day or two of writing up the MEL. You make it sound like we fly around with cracked spars and a motor missing. If it's a safety of flight issue (or a passenger convenience item), we are grounded on the spot and our mx department, crew chiefs, program managers, etc., all support our decision. In a case like this, we'll have a vendor come out to the airplane and fix the problem immediately.

For being a 121 guy flying big equipment, you sure do worry about Flight Options and the fractional business alot. Why don't you spend more time trying to solve your own airline's problems and stay away from ours. And say hello to your bitter friends who were former RTA from all of the happy pilots at Options.

Fly safe.