Polar Air Cargo, 30 days out from possible strike.

[furloughfodder]

I think the reality is the Atlas guys would like to see Polar shut down or sold, so they don't have to worry about a merger of the seniority lists.

You guys are also really exaggerating how much Polar affected your last contract. Your pilot group signed the contract, no one held a gun to your head. I'm not trying to be crass, but jeez, you guys are completely blaming your current contract on the Polar pilot group. You should be blaming Cato and Erickson.

 

[ironspud]

WTF? It doesn't take long to see that Polar's MEC is working "solely" for the best intrest of polar pilots.

Uhhhhh. Is that a bad thing?

 

[bman]

no not at all, but I really believe that they have over played their hand on this one and the stance that was taken during Atlas's CBA nego. a few years ago has not been forgotten. Nor will it when you've got 7 & 8 year FO's at Atlas and they see commands being given to Polar people several years junior to them, some even off of the street. Many Polar crews have become just unbearable over the last couple of months. With some strutting around talking about how much they have made for this company and how they saved Atlas. About how much they believe they are ENTITLED to with this next CBA.

The insanity continues as Mgmt transfers A/C to Atlas Polar guys are hurling the word SCAB around, because we've been given the mandate to fly these aircraft. We must service our customers and our contract provides no Legal provision to refuse to fly these aircraft and they are calling people Scabs. All due respect, but F that!!

I wish Polar's pilot group well in their struggle to achieve gains in their CBA, but a small amount of humility about their position would go a long way.

Point of fact flying belongs to no pilot group and in the end we must service our customers or they WILL go to someone else.




[QUOTEironspud]Uhhhhh. Is that a bad thing?[/QUOTE]

 

[B747-300]

The Polar MEC lost the fight a long time ago when an arbitrator ruled that Atlas (the holding company) can move planes and flying freely between the two certificates. The unions pushing the NMB to get released from mediation played right into management's plan. Cato must laugh out loud when he hears the Polar crews talk about a strike. If they strike, their jobs will be gone forever. If they don't strike, they will be locked out on the 16th and their jobs will be gone forever.

Remember that Atlas crews have already been flying (more than two years) using the Polar call sign. The contractual legality of this was affirmed by an arbitrator. As this is already the status quo, nothing will change when Polar crews strike or are locked out. Atlas will grow, there will be no seniority integration to worry about and Atlas crews will will not have to worry about being stabbed in the back again when contract negotiations get down to the end game.

 

[Corporate Slug]

no not at all, but I really believe that they have over played their hand on this one and the stance that was taken during Atlas's CBA nego. a few years ago has not been forgotten. Nor will it when you've got 7 & 8 year FO's at Atlas and they see commands being given to Polar people several years junior to them, some even off of the street. Many Polar crews have become just unbearable over the last couple of months. With some strutting around talking about how much they have made for this company and how they saved Atlas. About how much they believe they are ENTITLED to with this next CBA.

The insanity continues as Mgmt transfers A/C to Atlas Polar guys are hurling the word SCAB around, because we've been given the mandate to fly these aircraft. We must service our customers and our contract provides no Legal provision to refuse to fly these aircraft and they are calling people Scabs. All due respect, but F that!!

I wish Polar's pilot group well in their struggle to achieve gains in their CBA, but a small amount of humility about their position would go a long way.

Point of fact flying belongs to no pilot group and in the end we must service our customers or they WILL go to someone else.

Shaking head in disbelief...........

Considering that you drank beer with many of the ones that got fired, and that you have a grand total of four months in at Atlas, you talk like you have been there 10 years! If I remember correctly what your past jobs were, when Atlas was negotiating their last contract you were a newhire F/O at a regional airline!

How is the Ducati? Hope it didn't get swamped by Katrina.

 

[furloughfodder]

Ignore bman. He is an example of someone who simple repeats what they hear, like a parrot. He has no true airline experience. It is people like this that will cave in so fast when the Atlas contract comes due in a few short months. People that don't know how hard we have fought to get where we are in this industry are the first ones to give it all up.

I would almost rather read 410dude's posts than bman's drivel, because at least I know 410dude is not for real.

I know who you are also, and this type of stuff won't be forgotten.

 

[Jolly]

Actually it is only 3 months.

Perhaps he would care to tell us how many ALPA contract negotiations he has lived through and actually been on any property for.

Shaking head in disbelief...........

Considering that you drank beer with many of the ones that got fired, and that you have a grand total of four months in at Atlas, you talk like you have been there 10 years! If I remember correctly what your past jobs were, when Atlas was negotiating their last contract you were a newhire F/O at a regional airline!

How is the Ducati? Hope it didn't get swamped by Katrina.

 

[Corporate Slug]

Actually it is only 3 months.

Perhaps he would care to tell us how many ALPA contract negotiations he has lived through and actually been on any property for.

Thats true, he won't hit 4 months till the 16th.

Unbelievable what some people will do and say. He took his newhire checkride somewhere around June 30th or so, maybe even the first of July. He still hasn't had time to receive his permanant certificate! Talking all this smack and he is carring around a temporary certificate with a brand new 400 rating! Probably hasn't been off of F/O IOE for more than a week or two if that.

 

[B747-300]

I just heard that the Polar MEC actually turned down the offer of an immediate 12% pay increase and no other changes to their "high QOL" CBA for 18 months. The MEC refused this offer before asking to be released from mediation and without consulting the membership.

I'm actually starting to feel sorry for the rank-and-file union members at Polar. It looks like they'll all lose their jobs because of the stupid things their union leaders (past and present) have done. But then again, they did elect the idiots.

 

[Corporate Slug]

I just heard that the Polar MEC actually turned down the offer of an immediate 12% pay increase and no other changes to their "high QOL" CBA for 18 months. The MEC refused this offer before asking to be released from mediation and without consulting the membership.

I'm actually starting to feel sorry for the rank-and-file union members at Polar. It looks like they'll all lose their jobs because of the stupid things their union leaders (past and present) have done. But then again, they did elect the idiots.

We already got the word on that one, MEC wanted mgmt. to add a clause that would prevent transfer of flying to Atlas(read no furloughs) until the merger, and in writing that they were going to merge the two carriers. Neither of which the mgmt. would agree to.

That would have put a kink in Cato's plans to whipsaw the Atlas boys next year by doing the same to them that is being done to Polar now. Appears that he wants to keep them seperate until he can beat your payscale down some next year to match Polars.

 

[On Your Six]

We already got the word on that one, MEC wanted mgmt. to add a clause that would prevent transfer of flying to Atlas(read no furloughs) until the merger, and in writing that they were going to merge the two carriers. Neither of which the mgmt. would agree to.

That would have put a kink in Cato's plans to whipsaw the Atlas boys next year by doing the same to them that is being done to Polar now. Appears that he wants to keep them seperate until he can beat your payscale down some next year to match Polars.

Sounds like a classic whipsaw to me... The Atlas guys shouldn't feel safe - they're next...

 

[Neednewcareer]

No respect for fellow Pilots

BMAN

Unbelievable, Not even four months on the job with maybe 50 hours in the aircraft and knows everything about the company. You could have easily been hired at Polar and put on the street. Good luck next year when Atlas fires all of its pilots not protected by the union. How is the quality of life over at Atlas, oh I forgot you don't have a life because they can work you pretty much the whole month. Guess you can grow your Gotee back and maybe can keep it for your next ID. Hopefully who ever hires you next year won't mind you sleeping during ground school. Thanks for no support!!!!!

 

[b747dogg]

no not at all, but I really believe that they have over played their hand on this one and the stance that was taken during Atlas's CBA nego. a few years ago has not been forgotten. Nor will it when you've got 7 & 8 year FO's at Atlas and they see commands being given to Polar people several years junior to them, some even off of the street. Many Polar crews have become just unbearable over the last couple of months. With some strutting around talking about how much they have made for this company and how they saved Atlas. About how much they believe they are ENTITLED to with this next CBA.

Well, I spent 5 years at Atlas and bman hit it right on the head! Maybe some of you shouldn't second guess him if you're not at Atlas or Polar. 4 months is much more then never being there and reading about it on flight info. Enjoy.

 

[Whale Rider]

To Polar/Atlas: Our time is now! Our MEC's are united and we should be united!
Stay the course and stand together!

 

[bman]

Listen guys

For the Record. I think it is 100% F-uped about what has been done to the newhire guys at Polar.

I have not attacked any individual personally, nor have I fired anyone, or been the cause of people being fired.

Everything you guys have said is certainly correct about me, but this is the kind of nasty rethoric that has been going on. I've seen Polar guys ignoring Atlas crews. I've heard Scab thrown around at people who don't deserve it. And on the Atlas side I've seen and heard much of the same. This is all a bunch of horse s--t. All in only four months!

There's not one of you guys who know me or have met me who I would have said one dispariging word about, not any of you! There's not one of you that if you needed a place to stay (as long as you don't mind gettin wet)or something from me I wouldn't give it to you! There are newhires on the Polar side that I have connections to from way back and I don't wanna see my friends screwed over.

I don't believe I have lied about anything or said anything untrue or grossly misrepresented what has been going on here.

furloughfodder ---You know who I am, fair enough, but what exactly have I done "that won't be forgotten"? I know you too and you know this isn't between you and me nor am I with them!

I hate seeing what happened to you guys, but I'm sorry I just don't understand all of this. I think its stupid. Is this what being at a 121 carrier nowdays is all about? Atlas vs AACS, AACS vs GSS, Polar vs Atlas, Mgmt vs EVERYONE!

PS
Reread my first post and it was not very tactful. For that I sincerely Apologize!

PPS
The Ducati IS now a watercraft as is the house! D. come on man r u thinkin I don't care give a s#@t bout u?

BMAN

Unbelievable, Not even four months on the job with maybe 50 hours in the aircraft and knows everything about the company. You could have easily been hired at Polar and put on the street. Good luck next year when Atlas fires all of its pilots not protected by the union. How is the quality of life over at Atlas, oh I forgot you don't have a life because they can work you pretty much the whole month. Guess you can grow your Gotee back and maybe can keep it for your next ID. Hopefully who ever hires you next year won't mind you sleeping during ground school. Thanks for no support!!!!!