Pinnacle, Mesaba, Colgan Reallignment

[WMUSIGPI]

The above assessment is pretty accurate, IMO. The only two upgrades we had on the 9E side were hired in 2003 and 2004. For the forseeable future, our upgrades will only be the super-senior 7-8+ year guys who get it once the Mesaba/Colgan ratios are filled.

F*** Bloch. I still can't believe we left our fate in the hands of one geriatric lawyer/businessman.

Maybe you should go look at how many of the Mesaba junior captains got pushed out of our seats as well... We are taking hits too, and with the jobbing on the seniority we took, even if we do manage to get on the 200 it will be basically as a street captain sitting reserve for years. No thanks I have sat reserve over 6 years, it's time for a change.

And that pain will go up exponentially for us with MSP and DTW closing. since especially in MSP the Saab guys are senior to many of the bottom Mesaba guys but not the Pinnacle ones.

 

[bri5150]

Sinkrate and Flyer,

What are you guys talking about? "Once the Mesaba/Colgan ratios are filled" and "Former Mesaba pilots will always be at or below the CA ratio number". THE RATIOS ARE ALREADY FILLED!!!! There has been upgrades on both the 200 and 900 by Colgan pilots. So, unless there is a misaward, the fences are filled and are no longer binding until someone leaves, and it seems as though there are more leaving from the Pinnacle side right now anyways.

 

[Grinder10]

Sinkrate and Flyer,

What are you guys talking about? "Once the Mesaba/Colgan ratios are filled" and "Former Mesaba pilots will always be at or below the CA ratio number". THE RATIOS ARE ALREADY FILLED!!!! There has been upgrades on both the 200 and 900 by Colgan pilots. So, unless there is a misaward, the fences are filled and are no longer binding until someone leaves, and it seems as though there are more leaving from the Pinnacle side right now anyways.

Are you sure that the Colgan pilots are filling "Mesaba" slots? They could be filling "Pinnacle" seats since we are and will always be above our protected number of seats.

 

[DoinTime]

Do you think Bloch really intended this? Someone should ask him.

Quotas are a pretty ugly way to protect premerger groups and their "intent" is to ensure that attrition from one premerger group is filled by its respective premerger pilots. These quotas are no different. Without fleet growth, these quotas will always be in play for their entire 5 year duration and the premerger group to get the most upgrades will be the group with the most captain attrition.

PCL was well over their -200 quota but with the approximate 10 CAs leaving per month from the premerger PCL group we will be back at our quota in the next few months. Considering that nobody ever seems to leave Mesaba, I would anticipate that their premerger FO's won't be seeing a lot of upgrades. Maybe that will change once they become Pinnacle pilots.

 

[bri5150]

Are you sure that the Colgan pilots are filling "Mesaba" slots? They could be filling "Pinnacle" seats since we are and will always be above our protected number of seats.

Both Mesaba and Pinnacle quotas need to be filled before any Colgan pilot can touch an upgrade into a 900 or 200. The bases don't matter.

 

[sinkrate]

Quotas are a pretty ugly way to protect premerger groups and their "intent" is to ensure that attrition from one premerger group is filled by its respective premerger pilots. These quotas are no different. Without fleet growth, these quotas will always be in play for their entire 5 year duration and the premerger group to get the most upgrades will be the group with the most captain attrition.

PCL was well over their -200 quota but with the approximate 10 CAs leaving per month from the premerger PCL group we will be back at our quota in the next few months. Considering that nobody ever seems to leave Mesaba, I would anticipate that their premerger FO's won't be seeing a lot of upgrades. Maybe that will change once they become Pinnacle pilots.

Attrition for the former MSA CA's will be as great, if not greater than the attrition for the PCL group. Plus you forget how the top of the list was constructed. When a 900 CA leaves a MSA 200 CA will take his place.

One small surprise in the award was the very small number of PCL FO's that bid for the 900. It seems to me if you were a year or more from upgrade that would be the AC to be in. Note that one of the displaced PCL CA's went to 900 FO in MEM. As the 200 schedules get widgetized they are starting to suck badly.

 

[Flyer1015]

bri, the Mesaba quota is filled at the moment, but won't be one the Mesaba flowthroughs go to Delta starting next year. Any drop below 279 at Mesaba must be filled by a Mesaba pilot before a Pinnacle/Colgan pilot.

 

[bri5150]

bri, the Mesaba quota is filled at the moment, but won't be one the Mesaba flowthroughs go to Delta starting next year. Any drop below 279 at Mesaba must be filled by a Mesaba pilot before a Pinnacle/Colgan pilot.

I bet there will be more Pinnacle guys leaving between now and when Delta starts hiring than all of those that will flow. The last I heard, Delta won't even start hiring until 2013.

 

[Flyprdu]

I bet there will be more Pinnacle guys leaving between now and when Delta starts hiring than all of those that will flow. The last I heard, Delta won't even start hiring until 2013.

I agree, but it will be mostly FOs staring down a 7 year upgrade.

 

[Flyer1015]

And is it just me, or did anyone else note the Colgan Q400 Captains getting jet Captain positions? Colgan is already below their quota, and as more and more Q Captains move over to jet positions, they will always stay under their 193 quota. What this means is that Colgan gets an exclusive one-way moving deal to jet Captain positions, while their Qs are untouched by Pinnacle/Mesaba. How is that "fair and equitable?"