Pilots wearing backpacks??? lets get campy?

[Holy Shiite]

I wonder if this thread will overtake the "hottest flight attendant" thread??? I doubt it though!!! I started this thread to get a "feel" from the pilots out there about the whole backpack issue as I for one think it is inapropriate and unprofessional. It seems that the younger guys take offense to the "criticism"
but the wearing of a backpack makes us all look sloppy,cheap, and not as a Professional Pilot. If a Delta Pilot was to wear a backpack I am sure that his fellow pilots would put such pressure on him to get rid of it before he stepped out of ops. If I happen to get paired up with an F/O wearing one I will surely voice my objection to it.

As far as the night cargo guys go, you are not in the public eye so really anything goes and nobody cares. But walking through a terminal looking less professional than the skycap who checks your bags is pretty pathetic. HS

 

[CapnVegetto]

God, some of you people need to get a life. It's a backpack. A BACKPACK!!! It's NOT A BIG DEAL!!! And yes, I used to wear one, when I needed it. I would do it again. If someone doesn't like it, tough. Make a regulation against it. I never had a problem with anyone about it. Some of you uniform nazis seriously need to get laid.

CapnVegetto seems to turn his attitude around a little.... He was defining is professionalism by his environment and observations. It is hard to go four wheelin through unknown territorty.....in a Ford Focus.......

Ummm......what????

That makes about as much sense as a soup sandwich. Perhaps you should word it differently.

I disagree with Holy Shiiite too. Cutoff jeans and a wife beater make you look unprofessional. A backpack does nothing of the sort. Hell, I wish they'd let me wear a polo shirt and khakis. I'd do it in a second!

Get a life people.

 

[Mike man]

I saw a chick in PIT the other day with a backpack...how stupid. WTF?

 

[Rez O. Lewshun]

God, some of you people need to get a life. It's a backpack. A BACKPACK!!! It's NOT A BIG DEAL!!! And yes, I used to wear one, when I needed it. I would do it again. If someone doesn't like it, tough. Make a regulation against it. I never had a problem with anyone about it. Some of you uniform nazis seriously need to get laid.

What I get from your quote is from my three year old watching Dora the Explorer when she uses her backpack. The intro song.....to the backpack scene in every Dora cartoon.

Do you need a regulation to mandate your image? Professionals do not need to be policed. We do not need the FAA and Company babysitting us. Or do we/you? Is there a policy manual that says backpacks are accpetable? probably not. But if it doesn't say I can't then I can, right?

Is that your best arguement... ?? That we need to get a life and that it is just a backpack? If it is not a big deal, then why use one? If you cannot (and thus HAVE NOT) logically and soundly argued the use of backpacks by professional pilots as a positive, then you simply are ineffective.

If you'd like a good arguement for using the backpack, try this one on. (no pun intended) They are convienent and easy to carry your "stuff" around.

Of course my counter is.....this. Is your convience worth a deminished image for all pilots?

If you are going to argue that backpacks are accpetable then you must show that their use by pilots will not have a negative effect. This thread shows that backpacks are four wheelin' in unknown territory at the least. (I know you don't like this analogy, but it is very fitting.... if you know what I mean. Do you?)

What is the backpack an alternative to? A rollerboard, like Travelpro or Luggage Works? Or even a flight case? How about discussing the how a backback is just as professional looking..... I have seen many USAF/USN Officers wearing backpacks in uniform. (on the Metro to/from the Pentagon) I think a briefcase is much more professional looking. But I guess it is harder to carry a briefcase.

Your "God!", "get a life", "no regulation against it" and "Get Laid" arguements FOR the backpack are about as amatuer hour and freshman as a 15 year old schoolgirl....with her backpack on...

Ummm......what????

That makes about as much sense as a soup sandwich. Perhaps you should word it differently.

I disagree with Holy Shiiite too. Cutoff jeans and a wife beater make you look unprofessional. A backpack does nothing of the sort. Hell, I wish they'd let me wear a polo shirt and khakis. I'd do it in a second!

Get a life people.

I could word it differently. Do you think you'd understand again?

OK.. here goes.....

Instead of climbing into your head (figure of speach) and deciding what is a professional image you'd rather simply mirror the current trends of clothing and accessiories (backpacks). Here is a hint. Ok, it is not a hint, it is as clear as can be.... Using current trends, pop culture and fads to define your professional image and attitude is not what we as Air Line Pilots are all about.

All the passengers are expected to do is sit in the cabin and complain and whine. Kinda like your post. (I know, cheap shot... ) They can wear, say and do what they like. (within the law) Just because the passengers are wearing sweatpants and tank tops to travel, doesn't mean you can dumb down the professional pilot image. As pilots, alot more is expected.

Look, if you want flying jets to be just a job like most people have, then you can take the path of least resistance, show up for work, do your job and go home. If you want to define your job as a career and reap the rewards, including financial, then make conscience choices.

Is the opinion of your fellow pilots not of value? If a percentage of them are telling you to reconsider your travel gear.. then maybe you should. Before you respond, at what point would you listen to your fellow pilots when they are offering a critque you don't agree? Does it have to be a majority? Overwhelming?

Finally, I am getting laid. And without a backpack.

And I do have a life. A rather good one. And my good life is dependant, in part, on my professional image. And to a certian extent.... your professional image or lack thereof.

We not me.

 

[PBRstreetgang]

Oh please...

I can deduce by your gross antipathy for us "kids," coupled by your odious usage of such archaic terminology as woodsy the owl and for crying out loud, that you are some form of washed up, 40+ year old 5000 hour loser. Do you really have nothing better to occupy your time with than absurd objections to people's choice of LUGGAGE? It seems all of the childlike-reasoning and immaturity is coming from under your rock.

Pathetic.

/will now begin wearing my Social Distortion backpack on a far more regular basis while on trips.

Hey,
I resemble that remark, I think all the uniform Nazis that rant and rave about uniforms, hats and backpacks are possibly the same ones who PFT'd. Professionalism is defined differently in the dictionary, hats and backpacks are not mentioned. Wear a thong, and flip-flops, I don't care just vote with me at contract time for more money. Otherwise relax and enjoy that 350hrs a month TAFB.
PBR

 

[CapnVegetto]

What I get from your quote is from my three year old watching Dora the Explorer when she uses her backpack. The intro song.....to the backpack scene in every Dora cartoon.

Do you need a regulation to mandate your image? Professionals do not need to be policed. We do not need the FAA and Company babysitting us. Or do we/you?

Is that your best arguement... ?? That we need to get a life and that it is just a backpack? If it is not a big deal, then why use one? If you cannot (and thus HAVE NOT) logically and soundly argued the use of backpacks by professional pilots as a positive, then you simply are ineffective.

If you'd like a good arguement for using the backpack, try this one on. They are convienent and easy to carry my "stuff" around.

Of course my counter is.....this. Is your convience worth a deminished image for all pilots?

What is the backpack an alternative to? A rollerboard, like Travelpro or Luggage Works? Or even a flight case? How about discussing the how a backback is just as professional looking..... I have seen many USAF/USN wearing backpacks in unifrom. I think a briefcase is much more professional looking. But I guess it is harder to carry a briefcase.

Your "God!", "get a life", "no regulation against it" and "Get Laid" arguements FOR the backpack are about as amatuer hour and freshman as a 15 year old schoolgirl....with her backpack on...



I could word it differently. Do you think you'd understand again?

OK.. here goes.....

Instead of climbing into your head (figure of speach) and deciding what is a professional image you'd rather simply mirror the current trends of clothing and accessiories (backpacks). Here is a hint. Ok, it is not a hint, it is as clear as can be.... Using current trends, pop culture and fads to define your professional image and attitude is not what we as Air Line Pilots are all about. The passengers are expected to sit in the cabin. They can wear, say and do what they like. (within the law) Just because the passengers are wearing sweatpants and tank tops to travel, doesn't mean you can dumb down the professional pilot image.

Is the opinion of your fellow pilots not of value? If a percentage of them are telling you to reconsider your travel gear.. then maybe you should. Before you respond, at what point would you listen to your fellow pilots when they are offering a critque you don't agree? Does it have to be a majority? Overwhelming?

Finally, I am getting laid. And without a backpack.

And I do have a life. A rather good one. And my good life is dependant on my professional image. And to a certian extent.... your professional image.

We not me.

Ah, here we have yet another holier than thou old guy that thinks he knows everything.

First and foremost, I had a rollerboard AND a flight case. What does my laptop go in? Answer: my BACKPACK.

Second, I'd sure love to know who in the hell made you the god of all things professional? So YOU don't like a backpack? YOU think it's unprofessional? What about the other 5,000 people out there like me that see nothing wrong with it? Should we immediately bow down to Rez O. Lewshun because he is omniscient and knows all about all things backpack? Exactly the type of jacka$$ attitude I was talking about earlier.

Your "Is your convience worth a deminished image for all pilots?" argument holds no water for two reasons. #1, If I am indeed 15 years old, at least I know how to spell the word 'diminished', and #2, that kind of broad-sweeping generalization is precisely what I was referring to when I speak of 'holier than thou old guys.'

Now on to your ridiculous ascertation that I base all of my decisions on 'pop culture' and 'fads'. You have never met me, you have never seen me anywhere, you have no idea who I am , where I live, what I'm like, anything. And yet, by some miracle, you think you know me. Must be more of that 'god' complex you have. I've already stated why I wear a backpack when needed, and it has nothing to do with a 'fad'. My 'professional image' is fine. It's not hurt by me wearing a backpack every once in a while to carry extra things I need because you say so.

Is the opinion of my fellow pilot not important? I have never once had any captain or copilot ever complain about my apperarance, or claim that I look 'unprofessional'. The percentage of them that have told me that I should reconsider my travel gear......0%. Apparently there are a few crusty old farts out there that have some kind of god complex and believe that they should be telling others what to do. Until a vast majority of people can give me a good reason that will convince me otherwise, then I will continue to wear a backpack. "Because Rez O. Lewshun thinks so" is not a valid reason, and will never be.

I think I'll put my backpack on now.

 

[Rez O. Lewshun]

CaptnVegetto,


Sorry to read your hasty response. I am not sure why you took it personally, my post. I was debating the choice to use backpacks. Why are you defending yourself personally? I am sure you are a fine employee and pilot. Let's stick to the issue.

Not sure why you think a conservative professional image is holier than thou? Holier than thou comments are usually weak defensive remarks for lack of sound arguement. Also, screw me/screw you isn't good debate either. (a bit pre-emptive)

I really can't use your modus operandi and the backpack to indicate immaturity because that wouldn't fair. Besides, a very senior old man that I repsect uses a backpack when he flies. (I politely and professionally offered my thoughts)And that would also debunk my thoery.

Sure my spelling was incorrect. Thanks for pointing that out. ( I think)

My spelling errors do not weaken my arguement. Yet, you think they do. And your belief that I have a holier than thou attitude is not a flaw in my arguement.

Lets get back on topic shall we? Can you?

 

[CapnVegetto]

CaptnVegetto,


Sorry to read your hasty response. I am not sure why you took it personally, my post. I was debating the choice to use backpacks. Why are you defending yourself personally? I am sure you are a fine employee and pilot. Let's stick to the issue.

Not sure why you think a conservative professional image is holier than thou? Holier than thou comments are usually weak defensive remarks for lack of sound arguement. Also, screw me/screw you isn't good debate either. (a bit pre-emptive)

I really can't use your modus operandi and the backpack to indicate immaturity because that wouldn't fair. Besides, a very senior old man that I repsect uses a backpack when he flies. (I politely and professionally offered my thoughts)And that would also debunk my thoery.

Sure my spelling was incorrect. Thanks for pointing that out. ( I think)

My spelling errors do not weaken my arguement. Yet, you think they do. And your belief that I have a holier than thou attitude is not a flaw in my arguement.

Lets get back on topic shall we? Can you?

Forgive me, but I get really pi$$ed off when someone simply judges that I'm an unprofessional inferior pilot because I choose to wear a backpack when I need the extra carry space. I get really pi$$ed off when someone tells me that I should dress/act/think a certain way because they say so.

I was defending myself personally because the above is what I gathered from your post. Perhaps I was a bit hasty in my 'holier-than-thou' assesment, but you still have yet to give me a reason that a backpack is unprofessional looking other that 'I think it is.' You even pointed out that someone older and more experienced than you wears one, and sees nothing wrong with it. He doesn't see a problem, I don't see a problem, and a very large percentage of pilots out there don't see a problem, so why do you? Because you THINK it looks unprofessional? That's your opinion, fine. Don't wear one. But don't expect me or anyone else to stop simply because you think we should. I need a reason.

 

[Gulfstream 200]

Ritalin Generation:

Dont judge me guddam it, im Pi$$ed, earn my respect. give me a reason. get a life. get laid. dont tell me.

 

[Rez O. Lewshun]

Forgive me, but I get really pi$$ed off when someone simply judges that I'm an unprofessional inferior pilot because I choose to wear a backpack when I need the extra carry space. I get really pi$$ed off when someone tells me that I should dress/act/think a certain way because they say so.

I was defending myself personally because the above is what I gathered from your post. Perhaps I was a bit hasty in my 'holier-than-thou' assesment, but you still have yet to give me a reason that a backpack is unprofessional looking other that 'I think it is.' You even pointed out that someone older and more experienced than you wears one, and sees nothing wrong with it. He doesn't see a problem, I don't see a problem, and a very large percentage of pilots out there don't see a problem, so why do you? Because you THINK it looks unprofessional? That's your opinion, fine. Don't wear one. But don't expect me or anyone else to stop simply because you think we should. I need a reason.

Ok...more of the same reasoning....

Backpacks look/are unprofessional because some Flight Operations Manuals say do not use them. If a pilots' FOM says backpacks are prohibited and a pilot still uses one; that is unprofessional. I understand your FOM may not address backpacks. I did use this arguement in my post.

One reason why some FOMs prohibit backpacks is image. Right or wrong, most people that use backpacks are hikers, campers and students. These three activities are are not professional activities. In fact, students are on the opposite end of professionals. In addition, most students in the US are under the age of 22. Backpack usage, right or wrong, is the image of a teenager/student.

When we think of other professionals, lawyers, doctors, Military Officers, architects etc. We think of clean pressed suits and uniforms. And accessories/luggage that compliment the suit/clothing or uniform. If I saw W. walking to Marine One with a packback on, I'd think he had some personal activities planned... not the agenda of the US Gov't.


Here are two more arguments against the backpack.

1. Would you wear a backpack to a pilot interview?

2. We don't wear our luggage. We don't put on our rollerboard, or our flight case. But one does put on a backpack. That makes the backpack unique.

In addition, most FOMs state that luggage must be black. Is the arguement for any color luggage ok? Backpacks weren't an issue in the 90's. At least I don't recall them being worn by many. Why the change? Why have pilots, mostly young, begun to change the luggage usage to backpacks? Perhaps changes to FOMs will include no backpacks. Maybe not.

CaptnVegetto, you arguement for the backpack is solid on the premise of how you feel about it. As I said before it is not about me rather we.
Let's change the backpack to facial jewelry. For some reason, lets say for discussion, pilots started wearing eyebrow and lip rings. A pilot can insist all day long that he is professional but the looks and stares from his passengers suggests something else. It is what they believe. If your chief pilot, fellow crewmembers and passengers believe you are professional then you are. If they don't....then you aren't.


So here are my arguements. Debate them.

1. Backpacks give the image of a teenager and/or student. Anti-Pro.
2. Professionals don't wear their luggage.
3. Backpacks were not a uniform issue until the new millenium.
4. Some pilots wear the backpack even though thier FOM says no.
5. It is what our customers, employeer and fellow pilot believe.


The idea is to self regulate. Not see what boundries we can push.


All I can do is offer my reasoning. God forbid I am actually telling you not to wear a backpack. You have to make that choice on on your own.

 

[CapnVegetto]

Ok...more of the same reasoning....

Backpacks look/are unprofessional because some Flight Operations Manuals say do not use them. If a pilots' FOM says backpacks are prohibited and a pilot still uses one; that is unprofessional. I understand your FOM may not address backpacks. I did use this arguement in my post.

One reason why some FOMs prohibit backpacks is image. Right or wrong, most people that use backpacks are hikers, campers and students. These three activities are are not professional activities. In fact, students are on the opposite end of professionals. In addition, most students in the US are under the age of 22. Backpack usage, right or wrong, is the image of a teenager/student.

When we think of other professionals, lawyers, doctors, Military Officers, architects etc. We think of clean pressed suits and uniforms. And accessories/luggage that compliment the suit/clothing or uniform.


Here are two more arguments against the backpack.

1. Would you wear a backpack to a pilot interview?

2. We don't wear our luggage. We don't put on our rollerboard, or our flight case. But one does put on a backpack. That makes the backpack unique.

In addition, most FOMs state that luggage must be black. Is the arguement for any color luggage ok? Backpacks weren't an issue in the 90's. At least I don't recall them being worn by many. Why the change? Why have pilots, mostly young, begun to change the luggage usage to backpacks? Perhaps changes to FOMs will include no backpacks. Maybe not.

So here are my arguements.

1. Backpacks give the image of a teenager and/or student.
2. Professionals don't wear their luggage.
3. Backpacks were not a uniform issue until the new millenium.
4. Some pilots wear the backpack even though thier FOM says no.

The idea is to self regulate. Not see what boundries we can push.

All I can do is offer my reasoning. God forbid I am actually telling you not to wear a backpack. You have to make that choice on on your own.

OK, now we actually have something to debate. Here we go:

1. Backpacks give the image of a teenager and/or student.

OK, so by this argument, we are supposed to look at someone wearing a backpack and assume that they are a 22 year old student. So, when I went to my airline interview in a suit, do you think that the interviewers looked at me and said, "Oh, he's wearing a suit, he must be a Baptist minister!" Or a lawyer. Or a businessman. The list goes on and on. Do I need to look at someone wearing a polo shirt and immediately assume they are a golfer? How about I look at someone wearing glasses and immediately assume they are a rocket scientist. How about when a Fortune 500 pilot gets out of a $20 million G550 wearing a polo shirt and khakis. Golf is a leisure activity, so is that unprofessional? You see what I'm getting at here? The old saying 'don't judge a book by its cover' does come from somewhere, you know.

Nowhere in our FOM did it say anything about luggage color, backpacks, etc. I have to think it was because the people that wrote it knew that there were better things to worry about then that. So why would I want to spend another $50 bucks on a laptop case from Office Depot when I could just carry it around in my backpack? Especially on a RJ copilot salary? This isn't a prison camp, it's a job. I understand a uniform, just like I understand any office saying you can't show up in a wife-beater and cutoffs. But enough is enough. When someone starts trying to control every little aspect, then we have a problem. Especially on something as insignificant as a backpack, which, as we've already established, a large percentage of people see no problem with.

2. Professionals don't wear their luggage.

Covered in my last paragraphs.

3. Backpacks were not a uniform issue until the new millenium.

So? When issues appear, you deal with them. That's life. I still say you're making a moutain out of a molehill.

4. Some pilots wear a backpack even when the FOM says no.

This one I agree with you on. If the manual says no, you can't do it. However, if that were true to the letter, then the Declaration of Independence would never have been written. If you don't like something in the FOM, change it through the proper channels. But saying everyone can't do it because one company's FOM says it doesn't hold water.

By the way, I DID wear my backpack to my pilot interview. I had my logbooks, paperwork, etc. in it. I didn't have a briefcase, and I wasn't about to go buy one just for that. And....I got the job. As a matter of fact, I've never not gotten a job that I interviewed for.

 

[FN FAL]

This thread is becoming more gayer by the minute

 

[CapnVegetto]

This thread is becoming more gayer by the minute

Then what're you doin' here bud?

 

[Rez O. Lewshun]

CapnVegetto,

I edited my post to include #5. Please respond. #5 is an arguement to your response to my #1.

Your response is to my #3 is not debatable. It is a rhetoric and pure opinion without reason.

Would you wear a packback to a dream job interview? SWA, jB, FX, UPS? Where I work a pilot applicant could wear a clown suit and get hired. But I wouldn't and that is just where I work.

And yes, FN FAL is gay.

 

[acaTerry]

You took it wrong. I was just saying that the "look" is less important to a darktime outfit like FedEx. Not at all to say you guys "don't count", unless you lose my package!
Anyway, I am simply referring to the "coincidental" decline in the lifestyle, pay and benefits of the job with the new breed of pilot coming in who has no regard for the things such as image and maturity. It adds up to what we are seeing here today. Cry all you want kids, but you are shooting yourselves in the foot.

BTW, congratulations on the 10/11, it is so much better sitting straight ahead, isn't it?

 

[embryflyboy]

I hope that I am not speaking out of turn but I feel that ROL has raised some fantastic points. I constantly hear complaints about how we are paid so low and how we are professional’s but it seem as if we continue to engage in activity that is not becoming of a professional, having Captains sleep with FO or FA. I have heard pilots say take the wings epilates and tie off. When you see a military officer going home and stops by the store he does not remove his medal ties and rank insignias. (am not saying that I support the dweeb that is trying to using it to help make up for some inferiority complex.) I have to say that the most annoying thing that I have to constantly put up with is having some one make some statement that I can't be a pilot due to my age. This problem of perception is something that individuals wearing backpacks will only exasperate. I have heard people that it is easer to just use a Back pack. It would be really easy to show up in flip flops, shorts, and a tee-shirt and in two day you can turn it inside out and go the rest of the Trip. We have uniforms and appropriate conduct in order to bolster public confidence. How much confidence you would have in your attorney if he showed to court in a sloppy suite and a Back pack.

Yes some day all FOM will have no back packs, no ---, no ---, no --we will reach a point that the FOM will be twice the size as all the systems books. In the mean time could be please self regulate ourselves. Other wise we will reach a point where the regulations on what we can and can’t dot will be unbearable.

 

[acaTerry]

Hey,
I resemble that remark, I think all the uniform Nazis that rant and rave about uniforms, hats and backpacks are possibly the same ones who PFT'd. Professionalism is defined differently in the dictionary, hats and backpacks are not mentioned. Wear a thong, and flip-flops, I don't care just vote with me at contract time for more money. Otherwise relax and enjoy that 350hrs a month TAFB.
PBR

I'm not a uniform nazi by any means, I just think that backpacks look stupid on pilots, have never emerged until recently and are just another sign og the immaturity of the losers who show up to work looking like garbage and complain about the pay, lack of respect, etc.
Rezz O. Lewshun has been making a lot of good points, but too much to stomach for many of the babies in here.
BTW, I never PFT'd. I waited it out and instructed longer until the whole thing blew over..

 

[CapnVegetto]

CaptnVegetto, you arguement for the backpack is solid on the premise of how you feel about it. As I said before it is not about me rather we.
Let's change the backpack to facial jewelry. For some reason, lets say for discussion, pilots started wearing eyebrow and lip rings. A pilot can insist all day long that he is professional but the looks and stares from his passengers suggests something else. It is what they believe. If your chief pilot, fellow crewmembers and passengers believe you are professional then you are. If they don't....then you aren't.


So here are my arguements. Debate them.

1. Backpacks give the image of a teenager and/or student. Anti-Pro.
2. Professionals don't wear their luggage.
3. Backpacks were not a uniform issue until the new millenium.
4. Some pilots wear the backpack even though thier FOM says no.
5. It is what our customers, employeer and fellow pilot believe.

Ok, my response:

You are comparing apples to oranges. These are two totally different things, looked on two completely different ways by society. Eyebrow rings and lip rings are a far sight more 'progressive' than backpacks. That's like sentencing someone to the death penalty for jaywalking. You have to use some common sense. Read my previous post about wife-beaters and cutoffs. I realize it's not a gallup poll, but in relation to this topic, I asked my neighbor what she thought of a pilot wearing a backpack, (this is the same one I mentioned in a previous post), and here exact words were, "What?? I don't care about that." I realize it's not a poll or anything, but it's an example of customers believe.

Now I offer this:

1. Customers don't care. They go whereever the cheapest ticket is. They have proven this time and time again with travelocity, expedia, priceline, etc. No brand loyalty. They don't care who's flying them as long as they can pay $39 bucks a leg.

2. Employer. If they cared, why did my FOM say nothing about it? Why does my current FOM say nothing about it? Why do a lot of the FOM's out there say nothing?

3. Fellow pilots. Once again, as in my previous post, this message board is the first time I've EVER seen or heard anything negative about wearing a backpack. No DO, CP, check airman, captain, or first officer has EVER said ANYTHING to me about it. EVER. My argument doesn't need to change here.

 

[CapnVegetto]

Would you wear a packback to a dream job interview? SWA, jB, FX, UPS? Where I work a pilot applicant could wear a clown suit and get hired. But I wouldn't and that is just where I work.

And yes, FN FAL is gay.

Oh yeah, and none of those jobs are my 'dream job'. I have no interest in working for SWA, JB, AT, and while FX and UPS are great jobs, flying on the wrong side of the clock just wouldn't work with me. My career aspirations are quite different then most.

 

[FN FAL]

Then what're you doin' here bud?

hehehehe...I just never thought we'd see this many pages of dialogue on backpackers v. non-backpackers.