Pilots against JBPA (jetblue union)

[Rez O. Lewshun]

Of all the ACA/Indy Air people we picked up, I've only flown with 2 that I would consider worthy by character standards... All the others, are very ungrateful that Jetblue took them on after their demise.

There is an interesting dynamic that occurs when proud airline pilots lose their company, seniority and slide back in pay and status.

Some Indy Air pilots went to Netjets as well. Often a NJA (or JB) CA would be less experienced than the Indy Air transplant. First off it is quite humbling to start over, but then to be treated as inferior by your inferior is quite frustrating.

It is not that the more experienced Indy Air CA is now a less experienced CA's FO, it is the way the NJA or JB Captains treats the FO.

It could all be resolved by the NJA or JB CA simply asking his/her FO "What is your experience?"

Any good CRM program would be having a majority of CAs doing this anyway. As a CA wouldn't you want to know if this guy can hand fly the jet, single pilot down to mins at JFK?

Any Indy pilot could, just as any JB pilot could.

The reason you have not meet agreeable Indy Air pilots is because:

1. They are being treated like low time FO's. Ask them who they are and where they come from. It is win/win for all.

2. When an experienced pilot, loses his job and company, like Indy Air, that is bad enough, but when you get treated like a new pilot, it is salt in the wound. To bring so much more to the table only to be discarded is poor leadership on the CA.

3. Maybe JB didn't meet their expectations... I am not saying their expectations are realistic or not... just that they weren't met....

 

[BrokenWing]

There is no way the average pilot wage at this company is close to $100K.

Really? Why don't you find out what the pilot payroll is at B6. $190 million sound about right? Divide that by the 1900 pilots and that comes out to...............$100K. So, sadly the 1% dues will only amount to about 1.9 million a year and will probably put them far short of where they need to be. My prediction, ain't no way it's gonna happen with 1% dues.

 

[FADEC]

Of all the ACA/Indy Air people we picked up, I've only flown with 2 that I would consider worthy by character standards... All the others, are very ungrateful that Jetblue took them on after their demise.

You can probably reduce that number to one. I'm ex indy and I'll tell you straight to your face that you're a tool. All you are is a seniority number doing a job that anyone of us could do. And just to get it straight, I left Indy before their collapse. Oh by the way, thanks Indy for the free bus type.

 

[Jet41]

UAW guy in a local bar. Bet you wouldn't. They are probably more "right" than you are. Who built everything in this country?

Have a great day.

Yeah because Detroit is doing so well right now...

 

[IB6 UB9]

Of all the ACA/Indy Air people we picked up, I've only flown with 2 that I would consider worthy by character standards... All the others, are very ungrateful that Jetblue took them on after their demise.

Maybe you're the problem. I've flown with maybe two that I feel the opposite about.

 

[Mamma]

Quote:
Originally Posted by BLUE BAYOU
I only quoted this crap from Bavarian Chef, do a search, its his quote-- stop attaching me to it...

It's called humor. You must be former Air Force.

Hey! Don't attach the Air Force to a tool like this! It makes us all look bad you dumb squid.

 

[Bavarian Chef]

Quote:
Originally Posted by BLUE BAYOU
I only quoted this crap from Bavarian Chef, do a search, its his quote-- stop attaching me to it...




Hey! Don't attach the Air Force to a tool like this! It makes us all look bad you dumb squid.

Whatever, you AFRES loser. Isn't there a gubment teet somewhere you should be sucking on?

BTW-- call me this week. Got a doozy for you.

 

[BLUE BAYOU]

That statement alone tells me how disconnected you are from 2/3 of this pilot group. I'm a 3rd year FO and I don't make anywhere near $100K. A handful of our super senior Airbus FO's might be near $100K if they are working their tails off. Our 190 CAs aren't averaging anything near $100K either. Don't even get me started about the 190 FOs. Most of them will be lucky to make $50K. The only folks making any real bank at JetBlue are senior CAs living in base, gaming PTX, and picking up RSA's The rest of us aren't doing nearly as well as the upper 5%. My guess is the average Airbus CA here makes about $125-130K. Only a select few do much better than that. There is no way the average pilot wage at this company is close to $100K.

SO EASY EVEN A CAVEMAN COULD READ... I said the average of all pilots is about $100,000 which is about the pilot payroll of $190 million-- do the math, 1% of this is only $1.9 million to run a union per year; I would say that is WAY SHORT of what is needed to even start one. SO why won't any answers come out of all the BLUEPILOTS JBPA backers on this matter? What will be our "special assessment" to get this show started, and oh, what if I don't want to be a JBPA member... I have that right, so you won't even see near the money you will from me that a normal due paying member will be assessed. What if there are hundreds that don't join, will the 1% of your salary work? What if all the senior guys here don't become members? Will the union survive on the average 1% from the F/Os salary? I think if the union route is planned, then you might want to consider ALPA-- we are too small for an in-house union, look at the troubles Airtran is having with their's.

 

[linepilot]

Why not go in-house and get some work done in your current political environment?

If Jetblue decides to make life miserable for all of you then you can avail yourselves of ALPA resources and merge.

By then, you'll have an organizational structure in place, you'll have worked through some issues that every union faces starting up, and you will have a group of volunteers in place with experience working with Jetblue management.

Also, you will have seen Jetblue's true colors as well as their books.

 

[PCL_128]

Agreed. The JetBlue pilots aren't ready to accept ALPA, but they need a union. An in-house union like the JBPA is a great way to get things going.

 

[radarlove]

$2 mm a year is pretty significant money, if your guys don't start feeding from the dues trough, it leaves lots of room for a small paid staff and a little bit of buying trips from the company for representation issues and meetings.

It's $166,000 per month. Do you really think that you can't get anything done for $166,000 per month? You could hire a full time director at $10,000 per month, a secretary at $4,000 per month and still have $150k to spend.

 

[Blue Dude]

$2 mm a year is pretty significant money, if your guys don't start feeding from the dues trough, it leaves lots of room for a small paid staff and a little bit of buying trips from the company for representation issues and meetings.

It's $166,000 per month. Do you really think that you can't get anything done for $166,000 per month? You could hire a full time director at $10,000 per month, a secretary at $4,000 per month and still have $150k to spend.

Don't confuse Bayou with facts, his mind is made up!

 

[Bavarian Chef]

Would JB be closed shop? How does that work anyway?

 

[banger]

Of all the ACA/Indy Air people we picked up, I've only flown with 2 that I would consider worthy by character standards... All the others, are very ungrateful that Jetblue took them on after their demise.

As a 6 yr JBLU guy I've found just the opposite. I find the Indy guys to be great to fly with. Really enjoyed my time when I fly with them.

 

[B6Busdriver]

How about some facts on how much this JBPA thing is going to cost-- they say 1% of my gross salary/year will be the dues-- crap, if everyone made a combined average of $100,000/year (and thats probably close) that would only generate $1.9 million to run a union... (that's assuming all 1900 will become members) Um, that doesn't even fund the "war chest" the company provides for free now... Nor will it even come close to paying all the lawyers, office fees, or union leaders' lunches... Many years ago when SWA was given money to start a union, wasn't that figure around $10 million 30 years ago?SO, how much are our "special assessments going to be to really start off an in-house union? Is it going to be what I put aside for my daughter's college? Will we in a couple of years, when dissastisfied with JBPA because they couldn't provide anything for us, be in Airtran's shoes-- looking to trade unions... I guess only a Navy guy could understand the humor in this...

But I thought all the Captains at JetBlue averaged 82 hours per month and made $150 k a year?

signed,
a B6 captain who hasn't cracked $135k in the 6 going on 7 years I have been here.