Piedmont/Allegheny rumor

[eddie]

LR25 -- I hope you weren't being serious when you wrote this.

What, a Dash is a piece of junk becuase it has props, granted, it aint as sexy (to the pax) as a RJ, but come on, it takes a whole lot more skill to fly the Dash than any RJ, not to mention more comfortable than an RJ also, or 737.


The Dash is like a 172. You don't fly an ILS at 110 knots in an RJ. Unless you've flown the RJ and 737, I imagine you are going by what others have told you. If you have flown those planes, then I question you ability to accurately judge aircraft.

 

[Cropduster]

Flew an ILS into DCA on Friday at 230Kts Indicated In a Dash. 50 knot wind on the tail, (thats right 280 over the ground) Its not your typical 172! Oh, and by the way, flown a 73 also. Great Airplane.

 

[FR8mastr]

flying lesson #1 Who flies an ILS at 110 kts.? in the real world unlike what they teach at embry riddle and the like ILS's are flown usually starting at 160 or greater depending on traffic and the airport, constantly slowing untill over the numbers at 110 in a Dash 8 This is done so that the slow dash will fit in with the larger aircraft that usually fly at 120-130 on final. Not that this is that difficult to do, but it is certainly not a 172.

I for one did not apply to anyone other than PDT and ALG, PDT never responded to me and ALG hired me. A few years prior to that I had an interview at Trans states that I did not even go to. Why? Because I would not work under those conditions. I always said I would fly frieght untill I died before I would whore myself out or pay for a job!! So, no sir we did not all apply to anyone that has an airplane. That being said I personally do not blame the pilots for what the company does. The pilots just go where they are told. The only exception is the buy your job crowd and I have nothing but contempt for those individuals. In my opinion the buy your job crowd have done more damage to the industry the JO at Mesa has ever done.

 

[eddie]

So my question still stands, is the dash really more difficult to fly than the rj?

I doubt it.

By the way, at PDT the "standard" ILS is flown at ref+20 (115kts) to ref+10 (105kts) at 1000ft, and ref (95kts) at the threshold. It will fly faster of course, but these speeds are much slower than most other turboprops.

P.S. The speeds I quoted depend on the weight of the aircraft, I was just giving a common example.

 

[FR8mastr]

I think you are missing my point entirely, nobody flies these aircraft that slowly, I dont give a rat's @ss what the book says. Just because the dash can fly around at 90 kts does not mean that is the speed you fly it. Besides by looking at the AC you are flying how do you know what the PDT "book" says? And I never said the tprops were that difficult to fly just that there is a big difference in speed between the Dash and a 172

 

[eddie]

My original post was not to you FR8mastr, I was asking if LR25 thought the dash was a difficult airplane to fly. (check page 2 of this thread)

You are very trusting if you think the experience these posters claim to have are truthful representations. As for me, I haven't updated my profile in a while. I fly for PDT, and the other day I was harassed on a Line Check for flying the airplane faster than the profile in the book calls. I was flying the ILS at 160 to the marker and 130 knots the rest of the way.

I am not saying that it ought to be flown that slowly, but it is the only profile this check airman would allow. I told him exactly what any line pilot would "This is too slow for real life environment". The check airman said that ATC can adapt to me so I shouldn't fly faster than the profile. I guess I can earn an extra .1 flight pay that way.

I do have one question for you, although I don't know what aircraft you flew freight in, do you think it really was better than flying during the day, in a jet, for a part 121 carrier? Even if that carrier is contracted and not owned by a major? Also I don't believe TSA ever had pay for training.

 

[dondk]

CRJ versus DHC-8

After flying the Dash for PDT and now the CRJ for PCL I can sort of add .02 to this contest...

Yes, the DHC can do 90 something Kts, but your only that slow when you have to (usually ATC directed) or for some other specific reason.


The CRJ starts the approach phase at 200 kts, about 160 at the FAF and usually 140 over the fence. I remember the DHC-8 profile being 160 or so down to about 130-140 (depending on model) at the FAF and anywhere from 110-120 over the fence.

Does it really matter?

Comfort... I personally think the DHC-8 cockpit is slightly bigger, in the cabin, about the same, maybe if your sitting in the last row in the middle seat you got a bit more legroom than the rest.

Which is harder? Well, they are different... The CRJ you manage more, the Dash you fly more.

I don't think I could judge one to be "better", "harder", or requires "more skill" to fly than the other.

As a point... Mesa has filled RJ's with lower time guys as has PDT with guys from UND. Both companies hired people with only CFI background, so to quantify the skills required is a non argument.

 

[Brother Francis]

Thank you dondk. Had you not intervened they'd've been arguing over who can pee the farthest.

 

[FR8mastr]

Eddie, sorry about your check airman, we have a couple of those also.


As far as the freight vs. 121 that requires a breakdown. Pay and benefits this job wins hands down (the only reason I am here) as far as the job, freight wins totally! A jet would be nice but in the big picture I really dont care I just want some time off and a respectable pay check. flying the canceled checks I was working 4 nights a week, weekends and holidays off, and all bank holidays off. Mon thru thurs. I left my apt at 10 at night and was back in my apt at 5:30 in the am. Also the personal part of the flying was, to me, much more fulfilling. Just me, the AC, and a job, and only a fraction of the BS we have to put up with here. but like I said at the beginning this is where the paycheck is, so I live with it. Trans states was just an example, in that case if I would have been hired there I would have cut my pay in more than half so I could sit in the right seat of a 1900 or junkstream. Again just me, but no thanks. My last freighter was the rice rocket

 

[328dude]

I can relate to FR's frieght days and I to also flew the rice rocket before going to PSA.

The nights flying cancelled checks around in TX, OK and AR, where some of the best times of my life. 121 flying is very diffrent, however, quality of life is somewhat the same. I didn't have to commute with my freight job and do with my current position. Pay? hmmm, about the same depending on what I fly for the month.

Which did my wife like better? The frieght job. Which do I like better? PSA. Why? Still working on that.

I liked flying the MU-2. Good experince and alot of time by yourself (mostly). I also like the Dorker and find it alot easier to fly then the MU-2 which i think FR can relate to.

MU-2's a good airplane if it dosent try to kill you like shedding blades over Houston. I have yet to lose a blade in the Dork. Hopefully I never will.

 

[Freight Dog]

AMEN Fr8master. Some of the funnest times I've had in aviation was flying checks in a Chieftain and sweating the 001OVC & 1/2SM all by myself in the middle of the night. Yep, we also had an identical schedule 10pm and home by 6:30 am Mon-Thu.

You said it man.. 135 rules. I was just after the quality of life here. If I didn't get hired by Island Air, I would have most likely stayed at Ameriflight and gone up the ladder.

As for how tough is it to fly DHC-8 overall, I'd say flying a Chieftain was tougher than flying a DHC-8. It's just my opinion. I find Dash 8 to be one of the most forgiving airplanes I've flown, although I've seen people make it sound a lot tougher than it really is.


My .02 cents.

 

[eddie]

I only flew a c310 when I flew freight, but the 4 nights a week was great. I don't think it would be easy to find another job like the one I had (6pm to 3am).

I just get tired of guys saying how tough the dash is to fly. It is the easiest plane I've flown in 5 years (except maybe if there is an engine failure with the loss of hydraulics). I can see why so many companies keep them.