Piedmont/Allegheny rumor

[Smoking Man]

The biggest problem with the dork TP was that it was born at the wrong time, almost like the SABB 2000, the RJ revolution crushed it. You are correct about not getting the additional airplanes, but I guess Mainline did not want to put out the $$ for them when they could sub contract out RJ's from whoever.

The dork is a flop on the commercial venture, Some of my contacts at Picqua OH thell me that they lost $$$$$$$ on the developing the Prop, just an additional nail in the already over priced Dork.

I would say that you are correct in total over view of dorks V/S Dashs.

Kinda like Beta, good quality picture and sound, just did not stack up to VHS.


Smoking Man

 

[eightdriver]

Mr NewSouth?

What is your background if you don't mind me asking? I would just love to know.... I myself am one of those "Mickey Mouse" PDT Captains that you spoke of in you earlier remark. You say that your not an airline pilot, but yet you feel that you are so well informed of how the airlines and their contracts work. I myself wouldn't feel right telling some corporate "slave", I mean pilot, how his job future looks because I couldn't back up my statements with any real world corporate experience. So what is your background and where do you get off slinging #$% at us airline guys. You wanted a response, respond to this post PAL!!!!


Sincerely,

A (still very well paid) PDT Captain.

 

[SpacemanSpiff]

Apology to the WO guys out there

I just want to apologize to the WO guys for these two Mesa pilot Jacka$$es that are pooring salt on open wounds. There is NO excuse for it, and I hope you will accept my apology on their behalf. Please do us all a favor and ignore their a$$inine ranting and raving.

The pilots at Mesa (for the most part) have little in the way of hard feelings towards WO guys. We are, however, tired of being ridiculed by WO pilots who are just plain ignorant (I didn't say stupid - ignorance can be remedied) of the facts when it comes to Mesa and our current contract. "FurloughedAgain" described our situation well: we fly the airplane where Mesa tell us to fly it, irregardless of the paint job on the airplane. I fail to see the logic in blaming Mesa pilots for ALG's decision to sell aircraft and routes to our company. I realize that when jobs are at stake issues such as this one can become very emotional.

We, the pilots of Mesa Air Group will continue to work towards a fair contract which will represent ALL of the pilots at MAG. Only this will make Mesa Air Group a stronger company and a better place to work. Before we can raise any bars we have to deal with our own scope issues.

Okay, enough about Mesa. This whole thread is not about Mesa - it is about the WO carriers and various rumors which concern them. Let's get back on topic.

 

[eightdriver]

Hey SpacemanSpiff?

Is this NewSouth guy a Mesa Pilot? Does anyone Know??

The only problem I have with Mesa is the management. I do think however that most of the pilots that fly there knew what kind of company Mesa was when they applied. When I started applying to the airlines about 7 years ago I was aware of the game that Mesa played. I do think that the Mesa guys shoud get a parity type contract with Comair and AWA. And I do support there cause. Our pilot group at PDT supports Mesa's wish for a better paying contract. I just don't agree with the WO bashing that goes on just because we will not sell out to managements every whim. All of the Regionals need to stand up for themselves, especially now. The parent airlines need us and they know that. If Mesa gets a decent contract then it will definitely benefit the WO's also. The real scare here is MDA!!

 

[BoredToDeath]

Keep in mind;

With all this talk about Mesa raising the bar, It won't matter what kind of contract the Mesa pilots get with thier company. US Airways will still be paying them the same "Fee Per Depatrure" amount that they've been paying. This amount won't change until a new contract is drawn up between US Airways and Mesa.

In turn this forces the WO's to compete with contract carriers. This is why the contracting of Group flying needs to stop!

 

[Brother Francis]

Devil's advocate

And if the Mesa pilots win a contract that is on par or better than that of the WO's (before the "concessions" were rammed down the WO's throats) and Mesa can still offer the service at a lower cost than if it were kept within the group?

 

[BoredToDeath]

And if the Mesa pilots win a contract that is on par or better than that of the WO's (before the "concessions" were rammed down the WO's throats) and Mesa can still offer the service at a lower cost than if it were kept within the group?

In that case you would be helping Group Mgt. turn US Airways into the "Contract Carrier of Choice"

Fortunately since Mesa and the other Contract Carriers did'nt sign on for this piece of garbage jets4jobs, you will not reciceve any new jets to fly for Our group.

 

[Brother Francis]

So:

A) The contract carrier pilots should not negotiate a better contract because that would pull the teeth from your argument with group, or

B) They should negotiate the best contract they can, but then quit their jobs on principle.

I am not without sympathy for the WO's at any of the majors. The U WO's in particular have been really badly screwed. I'm sure I don't need me to report that understatement.

There is validity to the argument that the whore contract carriers are taking flying from the WO's and that some of the reason for that is the lower cost due to lower payroll expenses. I'll be the first to admit it.

Let me rephrase my question:

Would the Mesa/CHQ/TSA/etc. pilots still maintain their whore status if the disparity in compensation were not an issue? And why?

 

[BoredToDeath]

**So:

A) The contract carrier pilots should not negotiate a better contract because that would pull the teeth from your argument with group, or

B) They should negotiate the best contract they can, but then quit their jobs on principle.

I am not without sympathy for the WO's at any of the majors. The U WO's in particular have been really badly screwed. I'm sure I don't need me to report that understatement.

There is validity to the argument that the whore contract carriers are taking flying from the WO's and that some of the reason for that is the lower cost due to lower payroll expenses. I'll be the first to admit it.

Let me rephrase my question:

Would the Mesa/CHQ/TSA/etc. pilots still maintain their whore status if the disparity in compensation were not an issue? And why?**

Brother Francis,

My feelings are that the Contract Carriers should get the absolute best contract with their company that they can. And in these times I would'nt suggest quiting your jobs.

As far as the contract carriers being whores or not, I would rather see Mesa and the rest flying under their own names and paint trying to serve their own markets.

My bottom line is that Mainline and the WO'd need to be one company, no contracting. If a particular route has to be flown with a 1900 then it should be US Airways flying it. This way Mgt. can't whipsaw any group and with happy employees all of our attention can be placed at making this the best and stongest company. We need to be focused on customer service not worrying about whos flying what and where. With onelist we would be able to do that.

US Airways Group should be made up of the Mainline and the WO'd to become just plain and simple US Airways.

Not Mainline, PSA, PDT, and ALG then a world of contract carriers.

 

[Brother Francis]

Good post; you make your point well. I was not trying to start a whizzing contest- just trying to get an idea of what was going on in the hearts and minds of WO guys. The reasoning behind the reason, as it were. Thanks for the clear and concise reply.

Seems the entire industry has broken down into rival factions fighting over the planes, routes and the rights thereto.

We're being played.

Best of luck to you...and us all