NWA F/A's reject offer

[WillowRunVortex]

i was hearing that there are some FA's from other airlines who are willing to fly at NWA are being paid to be on standby to be ready to jump in in the event of a strike. Is there any truth to this rumor...?

Uhhhh....without company training???? I don't THINK so!

NW trained about 1500 or so scab FA replacements in 05,,,May thru July I believe (right along with the AMFA replacements). Gottem "certified" and everything,,,even had the on line FA's training them on "IOE" on revenue flights while a management type supervised (any protest,,,automatically written up). At that time they were being paid 500 bucks a month to wait for the phone call. Not sure how long that lasted or if it is still taking place. Also don't know what their recurrent training requirements would be should NW's wonderful management team want to use them again.

If the girls stick to their guns though 1500 (even including management types on top of that) would not be nearly enough. I believe NW has just under 10,000 active FA"s at the moment.

 

[eaglefly]

You're a complete idiot who has not a SINGLE CLUE about the topic of which you comment on. Please elaborate on how it is up to the government to decide whether or not to save NWA. Please elaborate on the history of AMFA at NWA and the actions, or lack thereof, leading up to the strike. (hint: ask the overwhelming majority of current Mech's who are former NWA AMFA Mechs who feel that they were screwed by AMFA). Aside from the use of Federal BK laws I wasn't aware that we were asking to be saved by the government. The same BK laws that saved CO and US twice. Haven't demonstrated we are worth it? Our TA is bad and I voted no. Having said that, please provide a line by line comparison of our TA to your current ATR/RJ contract or the current UAL contract. Work Rules anyone?

Go back to defending the profession, one cramped,miserable, unprofitable if-not-for-the legacy-fee-for-departure RJ flight at a time.

Gee, I must have struck a nerve.

You're (at least supposed to be) a MAJOR Airline. Now you're a regional airline that flys big airplanes, so you've done nothing to "defend the profession" as well.

In fact, you've done more to harm it than any uf us losers flying toys at the regional airlines. Personally, I made a lifestyle choice to drive to work vs. chasing "the dream" across the country and in retrospect, a wise choice it was. The dream is dead with the NWA pilots participating in the nailing of the coffin. When that crook Duane and you're MEC look out for yourselves by enacting your, ahem, contract early demonstrating the lack of unity at NWA, you'll add a few more nails.

I'm sure you're looking out for the Mesaba guys too, eh ?

Made 111K in '93, 108K in '94 and 116K last year, so if you've got seniority, you have flexibility and life ain't so bad. Not bad for a loser flying toys around.

I'll watch closely, but judging from the past, I know what is likely to happen. Poor F/A's...................hopefully, they'll see that they've really got nothing to lose.

 

[YourPilotFriend]

Gee, I must have struck a nerve.

You're (at least supposed to be) a MAJOR Airline. Now you're a regional airline that flys big airplanes, so you've done nothing to "defend the profession" as well.

In fact, you've done more to harm it than any uf us losers flying toys at the regional airlines. Personally, I made a lifestyle choice to drive to work vs. chasing "the dream" across the country and in retrospect, a wise choice it was. The dream is dead with the NWA pilots participating in the nailing of the coffin. When that crook Duane and you're MEC look out for yourselves by enacting your, ahem, contract early demonstrating the lack of unity at NWA, you'll add a few more nails.

I'm sure you're looking out for the Mesaba guys too, eh ?

Made 111K in '93, 108K in '94 and 116K last year, so if you've got seniority, you have flexibility and life ain't so bad. Not bad for a loser flying toys around.

I'll watch closely, but judging from the past, I know what is likely to happen. Poor F/A's...................hopefully, they'll see that they've really got nothing to lose.

Why do I keep hearing NWA pilots put the nail in the coffin with the TA when voting in an industry standard contract that was already at several other airlines?

 

[ultrarunner]

NW trained about 1500 or so scab FA replacements in 05,,,May thru July I believe (right along with the AMFA replacements). Gottem "certified" and everything,,,even had the on line FA's training them on "IOE" on revenue flights while a management type supervised (any protest,,,automatically written up). At that time they were being paid 500 bucks a month to wait for the phone call.

Well, from a management standpoint, that's some pretty smart thinking. Not that 1500 will park the airline, but they could gear that up again, if it's not already going on at some other location, and be in pretty good shape should have or so walk off the job.

 

[320AV8R]

Why do I keep hearing NWA pilots put the nail in the coffin with the TA when voting in an industry standard contract that was already at several other airlines?

YPF-

Never mind eaglefly & the like.

No matter what we do….it’s not good enough. If we negotiated a 50% pay raise, called back all the furloughed pilots, & squeaked a deal for a $5 million dollar lump sum for all pilots…….it wouldn’t be enough.

He, (& willow run vortex, et al), would complain that we had no balls….cuz we didn’t get a 60% pay raise, call back the furloughed guys AND hire 500 off the street, and have a $10 million lump sum.

Do you think he knows who Alfred Khan is?

The end product of Deregulation & the Free Market Economy is coming to roost & they can’t handle it. Legacies revamping their cost structures to compete with the LCCs? Why that’s outrageous!!!!

320AV8R

 

[AceCrackshot]

No matter what we do….it’s not good enough

The crimes of the legacy MECs in allowing the situation to develop are the problem. You created this mess and took short term profits, and the rest of us will spend our careers trying to fix it. If there is a industry to fix it in after cabotage comes. The NW TA yes voter isn't fit to sniff the jockstrap of the Comair striker.

 

[DTW320]

Gee, I must have struck a nerve.

Gee, I don't think so.

You're (at least supposed to be) a MAJOR Airline. Now you're a regional airline that flys big airplanes, so you've done nothing to "defend the profession" as well.

OK. We're a "regional" whose "region" includes Asia, the Pacific, Europe, India, some Carribean, and all of North America. Tell me about your EMJ "region" big guy.

In fact, you've done more to harm it than any uf us losers flying toys at the regional airlines.

How so? I still make more than you with significantly more time off and benefits and better work rules.

Personally, I made a lifestyle choice to drive to work vs. chasing "the dream" across the country and in retrospect, a wise choice it was.

Personally, I drive to work too. Personally, what the f@*k does that have to do with anything? So, AA doesn't have a base where you live for Eagle? Kinda sounds to me like that "lifestyle choice" was made "for you"...

The dream is dead with the NWA pilots participating in the nailing of the coffin. When that crook Duane and you're MEC look out for yourselves by enacting your, ahem, contract early demonstrating the lack of unity at NWA, you'll add a few more nails.

If your 55+ then I agree that you've already seen your best years. 20+ years to go? Then you don't have a clue about the status of the "dream". By the way, who exactly do you want our MEC to look out for if not NWA pilots? Please elaborate.

I'm sure you're looking out for the Mesaba guys too, eh ?

Actually, Ummmm, NO. That's the job of Mesaba pilots and their MEC. Maybe you think we should give them our DC-9 flying with the resultant loss of NWA jobs.

Made 111K in '93, 108K in '94 and 116K last year, so if you've got seniority, you have flexibility and life ain't so bad. Not bad for a loser flying toys around.

So lets see....your pay went up 4.5% over 12 years. Gee, thats less than one half % per year raise NOT including the effects of inflation. Wow, you're right, you really are defending the profession. Even our CH11 TA has better pay raises than that. Lets see....18year Eagle EMB-145CA = $92/hr. 116k/12 = $9666/month = 105 hours/month. Nice QOL ya got there bud....Eagle must let you have your own cot in the crew lounge huh?Sweet!

I'll watch closely, but judging from the past, I know what is likely to happen.

Yeah me too. You're likely to post another steaming pile of clueless BS.

 

[eaglefly]

Gee, I don't think so.


OK. We're a "regional" whose "region" includes Asia, the Pacific, Europe, India, some Carribean, and all of North America. Tell me about your EMJ "region" big guy.


How so? I still make more than you with significantly more time off and benefits and better work rules.

Personally, I drive to work too. Personally, what the f@*k does that have to do with anything? So, AA doesn't have a base where you live for Eagle? Kinda sounds to me like that "lifestyle choice" was made "for you"...


If your 55+ then I agree that you've already seen your best years. 20+ years to go? Then you don't have a clue about the status of the "dream". By the way, who exactly do you want our MEC to look out for if not NWA pilots? Please elaborate.


Actually, Ummmm, NO. That's the job of Mesaba pilots and their MEC. Maybe you think we should give them our DC-9 flying with the resultant loss of NWA jobs.


So lets see....your pay went up 4.5% over 12 years. Gee, thats less than one half % per year raise NOT including the effects of inflation. Wow, you're right, you really are defending the profession. Even our CH11 TA has better pay raises than that. Lets see....18year Eagle EMB-145CA = $92/hr. 116k/12 = $9666/month = 105 hours/month. Nice QOL ya got there bud....Eagle must let you have your own cot in the crew lounge huh?Sweet!



Yeah me too. You're likely to post another steaming pile of clueless BS.

Who said I actually have to fly 105 hours to get 105 hours of pay (100 the monthly max. anyway) ? I have time to run another business that makes about what my lowly commuter pay is and assist in a third business that about covers the cost of my mortgage.

My "regional" comment is not about your service network, but about where the golden job of the "Major" USED to be. A mirage whose coffin now has some red and silver nails in it.

O.K., I'll throw you a bone and concede you're an L.C.C. now (contract wise) and not a regional.

Of course from a network standpoint, we're not even a "regional" anymore as we fly all over the continental US., Canada, the Bahamas (from ORD even) and Mexico.

Congrats on your time off. Personally, it sounds like you have too much of it.

I agree with you that your MEC will look out for you. Expect your MEC to agree to early implimantation of your agreement as another concession. I mean, why not.

In fact, if the F/A's have the fortitude to demand fair treatment and succeed (and I hope they do), perhaps your MEC would be willing to make up the difference to insure the dream stays alive ?

My heart goes out to the F/A's who deserve a fair deal & respect. I know that they are on their own over there as the MTX staff are all scabs and the pilots are doing there best to make sure they get theirs. If the F/A's can't get a fair deal, than they should insure the house falls down when they slam the door upon quick exit.

Same for the Mesaba pilots.

Congrats again on your hourly flight pay and work rules. Keep flying safely and living the dream.

 

[DTW320]

Who said I actually have to fly 105 hours to get 105 hours of pay (100 the monthly max. anyway) ? I have time to run another business that makes about what my lowly commuter pay is and assist in a third business that about covers the cost of my mortgage.

Ohhhhhh I see...your 116k is not from flying for Eagle. It's a combined income from Eagle plus 2 businesses. Cute how you conveniently left that part out when you were trying to convince us how life is "Not bad for a loser flying toys around". I have a company on the side myself. If I were to play your game and represent my COMBINED income as my AIRLINE income then I guess I should say that here at NWA I'm still making Delta's pre-CH11 $$$. Not bad for a guy flying around in a disposable French airplane huh?

My "regional" comment is not about your service network, but about where the golden job of the "Major" USED to be. A mirage whose coffin now has some red and silver nails in it.

O.K., I'll throw you a bone and concede you're an L.C.C. now (contract wise) and not a regional.

Of course from a network standpoint, we're not even a "regional" anymore as we fly all over the continental US., Canada, the Bahamas (from ORD even) and Mexico.

So which is it? Are you talking network or contract? You tell me its contract-wise but then your extreme insecurity kicks in and you have to try to impress me with details of your EMJ empire. ORD-NAS in an EMJ. Wow. I hope Bud, Edna and the kids got a good deal on those tickets to put up with that flight. That gets the ol vacation off to a great start.

I can assure you that even with our concessions this job is still light years ahead of most regional jobs. I've been there and I have friends that are still there. I noticed you declined to provide the line by line comparison of relevant contract sections I asked for. Just a lot easier to throw stones isn't it?

Congrats on your time off. Personally, it sounds like you have too much of it.

Oh, so NOW my contract is TOO GOOD? In my book more time off = more good. According to you I'm busy putting nails in a coffin but now I have too much time off? Your hilarious.

I agree with you that your MEC will look out for you. Expect your MEC to agree to early implimantation of your agreement as another concession. I mean, why not.

Your ignorance is showing again. NWA is asking the BK judge to implement our TA if he does not grant NWA their 1113c motion against the F/A's. If he DOES toss the F/A's contract then our TA goes into effect anyway. I don't know any NWA pilot that knew the TA would not be implemented right away if it passed. This "not until all groups have settled" clause down in the fine print surprised me and most others.

In fact, if the F/A's have the fortitude to demand fair treatment and succeed (and I hope they do), perhaps your MEC would be willing to make up the difference to insure the dream stays alive ?

I hope the F/As succeed too. I have no idea what you mean about the MEC making up the difference and "insure" ing dreams. You're rambling again.

Bottom line eagle: no matter how much you like throwing turds, you and your eagle buds would take our, "ahem", contract over yours in a heartbeat. I flew with guys like you a lot at my regional. Guys that had zero chance to go anywhere else and bent over backwards in their attempts to convince others that their deal was better than going to a bigger airline. They loved to point out where the legacies had taken a hit but NEVER wanted to compare the legacies concessionary contracts to their own current regional contract.

Congrats again on your hourly flight pay and work rules. Keep flying safely and living the dream.

Thanks!! I will. You too.

 

[dbrownie]

In fact, you've done more to harm it than any uf us losers flying toys at the regional airlines. Personally, I made a lifestyle choice to drive to work vs. chasing "the dream" across the country and in retrospect, a wise choice it was. The dream is dead with the NWA pilots participating in the nailing of the coffin. When that crook Duane and you're MEC look out for yourselves by enacting your, ahem, contract early demonstrating the lack of unity at NWA, you'll add a few more nails.

Eaglefly;

Sadly you are right. I used to be proud to be part of the nwa pilot group.
Now I feel shame, we gave in to greed and fear.

We had given much and when the company wanted more our "leaders"
quickly gave up our junior pilots careers.

The flight attendants at least had the nerve to stick together.

So now am I going to be asked to cross another picket line?

Watch how the "yes men" of our pitiful union spin this.

Just be happy you don't work here.

Dave B