NWA DC-9's

[comair00]

Thanks for the quick reply. I interviewed at Delta and wasn't offered a job. (Can't apply again) Now sitting in the pool at NW so I am concerned that if the pool expires or they don't honor it, I won't be able to interview again. Things got complicated in a hurry

 

[PeanuckleCRJ]

Ain't that the truth... I suppose it will all depend on the speed of the integration, which likely go at the standard snails pace.

I can't imagine them not honoring the pool for either side. The chances of this stuff getting sorted out by the end of the year are pretty low. There I go again...uneducated guesses.


Complicated? Yes!

I jumpseated on an NW DC-9 today- the guys were super nice, and the Captain was wearing a Delta lapel. It was pretty funny to say the least- also a bit ironic that I also have an NW sticker on my flight kit. The general consensus from everyone I've talked to (away from the zoo that is flightinfo) is no one wants our team or their team to get screwed. The trick is going to be how to pull that off.

 

[generaltso]

I think a fair SLI should favor the DAL side. Look at how the NWA group will benefit from this... much improved pay, improved work rules, better bases, better equipment (access to more widebody pay).

What does the DAL side gain... as far as PILOTS are concerned? Don't say the "Asia routes".

I don't buy in to all this "hiring by the end of the year". We will be lucky if there are no furloughs on either side, before or after the SLI is complete.

 

[clippyrip]

I think a fair SLI should favor the DAL side. Look at how the NWA group will benefit from this... ....better bases...

Really.

I for one, think your bases suck. But, that is just this Northerners perspective.

We also brought more cash on hand than Delta.

 

[Occam's Razor]

Really.

I for one, think your bases suck. But, that is just this Northerners perspective.

We also brought more cash on hand than Delta.

Steady, brother.

Ignore the trolls.

Things are going to start moving quickly.

 

[General Lee]

Yes, however the 9's can be parked without having to make lease payments, while a parked RJ - which NWA owns and leases to PCL, CPZ, and XJ all have payments monthly. The DC9 acts as shock absorber, and unfortunately so do the pilots flying them.

I have heard rumored that RA wants to reallocate the DC9's and run them on routes against AAI and other mid-continent flying. As he said in the merger conference calls there is nothing in the inventory between 76 and 152 seats other than DC9.

Despite GL's leanings that somehow your dick size is tied to the newness of your aircraft, or the ability to go direct, the DC9 is still a work horse, and is built like the proverbial brick @hit house - keep maintained and they will go for ever. Let's not forget that it was RA who originally refurbed and renewed the DC9.

I hope the rumors correct, because it represents more jobs for all of us, and I wouldn't be surprised to see even a few Widgets bidding -9 Captain. It's still more fun for some to be Captain of the tug boat as opposed to the second first mate on the Queen Mary

So, you must fly a piper cub, right? I hope the DC9s stick around, let's hope for the best.....


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[sweptback]

Heard that the DC-9 will fit in the RJ jetway gate boxes being constructed at ATL concourse C.

 

[PeanuckleCRJ]

Heard that the DC-9 will fit in the RJ jetway gate boxes being constructed at ATL concourse C.

Heard that you're dad used to force you to bend over and "submit to him" at concourse C.

 

[737 Pylt]

Really.

I for one, think your bases suck. But, that is just this Northerners perspective.

That's because where you're from, nothing spells a lovin like marrying your cousin! But that's just an east coast perspective, where, not everyone's "relative!"

We also brought more cash on hand than Delta.

What do you have a mouse in your pocket??
The only thing you bring junior, is more furlough fodder!

737

 

[sweptback]

Heard that you're dad used to force you to bend over and "submit to him" at concourse C.

Ok, big shot. What part of that statement made you assume that I was saying that it would be flown by regional pilots? Why then, the incredibly stupid reply?

Doesn't Delta operate all the gates at ATL? Couldn't a Delta plane park at any gate?

 

[CALDC9]

Wow. Like bell bottoms and leisure suits, fuel has become so expensive, the DC-9 is back in style.

Always thought I was in style, thanks for confirming it.

I found over the years the original nine seats were the most comfortable (if maintained) over the newer 80's or any Boeing seat. Plus you could carry on a normal conversation without shouting.

 

[Truckdriver]

I don't buy in to all this "hiring by the end of the year". We will be lucky if there are no furloughs on either side, before or after the SLI is complete.

If we get more 90's (still rumor), the 700's, and the 777's by the end of the 1st Q 09, they will have to park lots more airframes than have already been announced to generate the need for furloughs. I think the DAL side is still staffed very lean as it is and I assume the NWA side is also. If we can get a joint contract lined up so the NWA guys get DAL workrules I've heard that requires an immediate need for 300-400 pilots. I'm not going to say furloughs are not going to happen, but I think it is an unlikely scenario at least for the next two years.

 

[123]

I think a fair SLI should favor the DAL side.

You mean like the numerous "yet to be hired" DAL pilots that DALPA wants to have on the list prior to combining the lists?

 

[~~~^~~~]

Doesn't Delta operate all the gates at ATL? Couldn't a Delta plane park at any gate?

AirTran might not like that too much, but it's an idea

 

[PeanuckleCRJ]

Ok, big shot. What part of that statement made you assume that I was saying that it would be flown by regional pilots? Why then, the incredibly stupid reply?

Doesn't Delta operate all the gates at ATL? Couldn't a Delta plane park at any gate?

That was the computer being left on with me still logged in, haha.


Disregard!

 

[~~~^~~~]

FWIW, I heard the MD-90's are "still coming."

That must be one slow boat from China.

 

[737 Pylt]

You mean like the numerous "yet to be hired" DAL pilots that DALPA wants to have on the list prior to combining the lists?

Or the other one that had NWAALPA placing bottom 3000 pilots on the new seniority list from the DAL side?

Come on man, rumor control, it got us nowhere but throwing mud at each other and was really unproductive.....Let's cut it out and just focus on trying to get a joint contract and put the "rumor mill" behind us!

737

 

[PeanuckleCRJ]

That must be one slow boat from China.

Isn't that the truth. I swear they are just dangling those out there to keep the rumor going. SLC based CA I rode with the other day said they were still talking about them at a crew room meeting.

 

[PeanuckleCRJ]

Heard that the DC-9 will fit in the RJ jetway gate boxes being constructed at ATL concourse C.

as far as a real response to this, haha.....


It definitely looks like the 9 will fit in those. They are spaced out alot wider than one would have expected.

 

[Razorback Flyer]

The word from the DAL schoolhouse is that the fellow that rationalized the DAL network in bankruptcy (stoped flying a lot of widebodies domestically, and shipped them to international,) is looking over the NWA fleet and schedule, and believes many of their aircraft are seriously under-utilized. It wouldn't surprise me to have the 9's deployed on current routes running a high frequency of pakced RJ's, as someone else mentioned.

Thus far I've been impressed with the way DAL management is navigating this downturn. If plans remain as they are, I don't think anyone under the DAL/NWA umbrella will have to endure a furlough - and I think the management is planning on the economy and fuel getting worse before it gets better. Not to say that plans couldn't change, or that you shouldn't have a plan B - but as of right now, a furlough looks unlikely.

 

[clippyrip]

The word from the DAL schoolhouse is that the fellow that rationalized the DAL network in bankruptcy (stoped flying a lot of widebodies domestically, and shipped them to international,) is looking over the NWA fleet and schedule, and believes many of their aircraft are seriously under-utilized. It wouldn't surprise me to have the 9's deployed on current routes running a high frequency of pakced RJ's, as someone else mentioned.

Thus far I've been impressed with the way DAL management is navigating this downturn. If plans remain as they are, I don't think anyone under the DAL/NWA umbrella will have to endure a furlough - and I think the management is planning on the economy and fuel getting worse before it gets better. Not to say that plans couldn't change, or that you shouldn't have a plan B - but as of right now, a furlough looks unlikely.

I hope that is true. It would be nice to get the new Delta rolling and get past the furlough stage unscathed.

If the utilization issue is true, then we can get even more work out of an already paid for AC. That is good for the new Delta and in turn good for us, with the econ/oil as it is.

 

[se1776]

Speaking to the US Congress yesterday, Delta Airlines chief executive Richard Anderson revealed that the proposed merger with Northwest Airlines would mean the loss of 1,000 jobs at their new joint headquarters.

He added that the jobs affected would be managerial, rather than front-line, primarily involving staff in finance and accounting also said that figure was simply a "guesstimate" which is liable to change.

Delta has already announced 2,000 jobs cuts this year through buyouts and attrition, as part of a cost-cutting operation in response to higher fuel prices.

Altogether, the merged companies expect to have a workforce of 75,000.

When quizzed by a senator on how he would guarantee jobs if the industry's financial situation continues to deteriorate, Mr Anderson said: "The only real job security is a sound business plan."

High fuel prices have also hit other airlines, such as British Airways, which announced recently that it expected its fuel costs to rise by 20 per cent during this year.

 

[recallsomeday]

Speaking to the US Congress yesterday, Delta Airlines chief executive Richard Anderson revealed that the proposed merger with Northwest Airlines would mean the loss of 1,000 jobs at their new joint headquarters.


>> >>

Actually I believe he and Steenland looked at each other and threw out "less than 1,000" as a figure as they have not worked everything from the bottom up.

Steenland had a video message to NWA employees where he stated it had been premature to even mention a number when asked the question.

 

[dbrownie]

The word from the DAL schoolhouse is that the fellow that rationalized the DAL network in bankruptcy (stoped flying a lot of widebodies domestically, and shipped them to international,) is looking over the NWA fleet and schedule, and believes many of their aircraft are seriously under-utilized. It wouldn't surprise me to have the 9's deployed on current routes running a high frequency of pakced RJ's, as someone else mentioned.

I don't think there are a lot of "under-utilized" jets at

NWA, the guys on the 9s regularly fly 5-6 legs a day

we do 4-5 legs a day on the 320s all the time.

I realize thats per pilot not per plane.....

DB

 

[Occam's Razor]

I don't think there are a lot of "under-utilized" jets at

NWA, the guys on the 9s regularly fly 5-6 legs a day

we do 4-5 legs a day on the 320s all the time.

I realize thats per pilot not per plane.....

DB

Brownie, According to ALPA E&FA and the DAL Negotiators, NWA pilots are the "most efficient" of all the Legacy airlines.

A transition to DAL's 24.B would require about 300 more pilots to staff our our own fleet.

If you're doing 4-5 legs on the 'Bus...ur doing it wrong!

 

[Spectre]

...and if oil stays above $120 or goes north of that, at some point, the DC-9s will cost too much to operate even if they are paid for. Who knows, that oil price "number" may already be at that point now. Maybe they could re-engine them with B717 engines to make them more effiecient and keep them around another 30 years.

 

[Muskycat]

I don't think there are a lot of "under-utilized" jets at

NWA, the guys on the 9s regularly fly 5-6 legs a day

we do 4-5 legs a day on the 320s all the time.

I realize thats per pilot not per plane.....

DB

The 320 has a range of 2600 to 3000 nm range depending on engines on it. 4 to 5 legs a day is a waste of utilization big time. Granted some markets it may be profitable but overall it's capable of a lot further reach into markets with higher yields.

 

[atpcliff]

Hi!

Since I applied at DAL, I got a message from them stating they are planning to hire at the end of this year, or early 2008. I'm sure everybody else with an app in got the same info.

cliff
YIP

 

[Fly4hire]

...and if oil stays above $120 or goes north of that, at some point, the DC-9s will cost too much to operate even if they are paid for. Who knows, that oil price "number" may already be at that point now. Maybe they could re-engine them with B717 engines to make them more effiecient and keep them around another 30 years.

As oil and jetfuel continue to go up the CASM metrics actually invert and it's more efficient to fly the gas guzzling 9's over the 50 seat CRJ's.

IOW, it is more revenue positive (or less of a loss) to fly 1 120 seat DC9 over 2 50 seat CRJ frequencies on the same route.

 

[Spectre]

It may be more efficient, but DAL is one of the few carriers that actually owns a regional. For the other majors, even NWA as a stand alone carrier, they've been able to negotiate lower contracts with the regionals (ie. CAL and XJT)--you can thank SKYWEST and MESA. As long as the regionals remain profitable (most are doing better than their major counterpart), it's still cheaper to use them over mainline aircraft. Other than leasing the aircraft to MESABA, PINNICLE, or COMPASS, NWA does not save any money by replacing a DC9 on an RJ route. They are separate busnesses and do not share the same finances. Now, if they merge with DAL, that's another story--it's not a done deal yet.