NJASAPs Lack of Representation Regarding Furloughed Pilots

[gret]

I'm not sure that came out right. Are you saying then the pilot group is ignoring the furloughed pilots?

When somebody says you have nothing to worry about...you really have something to worry about.

 

[BentOver]

I specifically brought up the "being sold down the river" scenario to the few NJASAP'ers who took the time to visit our side of the message board... My question to them was (paraphrasing) " Can you guarantee with 100% certainty that nothing will change in regards to recall rights, longetivity increases etc...."

The answer I received answered neither question.. It was a vague response at best... Basically I was informed that of course it would come down to a membership vote.. (which I understood)... When I redirected my question to include the fact that anything brought to a vote has to come from the negotiating committee. And that it should be as simple as deciding beforehand that the negotiating committee will not entertain any TA that includes a deterioration of furloughee rights. The answer I received was that the negotiating committee has to go in and work out the best possible TA for it's members....

Further on it was explained that the most likely scenario (if it happened at all) would be a grandfathering in of the current furloughs, but any future new hires:erm: would fall under the new TA that could keep their recall rights reduced (if there were ever any new hires that eventually got furloughed at some point) Which to me is akin to having half the company home based and half the company reduced to 5 bases..hmmmmm...Nothing like having the same employee groups work under a different set of rules.....

Should have known not to trust an employee group that is willing to negotiate a reduced set of work rules for employees not yet on property but that will be called "brother" as soon as they pass their type ride...

 

[CALRepublic]

I like netjets, great job, best I've ever had. I'm happy here, no desire whatsoever to go back to the airlines

Then I come to FI, read these union threads and everything goes to s***t. Always the same guys talking about "moving on", "can't wait to get on with an airline" and how netjets is destroying your life, but you guys are still here.

How I wish those of you who want your airline job get your airline job. This negative stuff is getting tiresome

 

[BentOver]

I like netjets, great job, best I've ever had. I'm happy here, no desire whatsoever to go back to the airlines

Then I come to FI, read these union threads and everything goes to s***t. Always the same guys talking about "moving on", "can't wait to get on with an airline" and how netjets is destroying your life, but you guys are still here.

How I wish those of you who want your airline job get your airline job. This negative stuff is getting tiresome

Your wish has already been granted, however, when something has a direct connection to previous conversations (which possibly adds information to this topic) I don't see a problem coming over here to check up on what's going on at a former company.

 

[jetlag7]

I'm not sure that came out right. Are you saying then the pilot group is ignoring the furloughed pilots?

When somebody says you have nothing to worry about...you really have something to worry about.

Do you ever get tired of stirring the pot???

 

[billybob]

Jet

I have faith, being a 495er it's hard when you loved your job and people bit(h about it and you get no info from the mothership or from your brothers. It is easy to forget us and I think most of us just want to know that we are rembered a bit more.

Now I think it's a toss up as to my brothers want that third crew meal back or me back and it hurts. We were some of the best people in the buisness when we were welcomed to Nja! The best of the best and it would be nice if some of the old timers who came on when Nja was a crapshoot rememberd that. We were the new Nja, the guys that worked for the owner and worked with everyone to make this place be the best.

Now it's like we are 500 guys with cancer and it would be nice if we would all just go die. When your out in the cold it's nice to know that Njasap is working on something or would put in the 411 that we still have 400 some odd guys not at work and how we need to be thought of every now and then.

Sorry bout this, I'm still a bit hungover you get the idea though

 

[CA1900]

Billybob, there are plenty of us who think about you every time we go to work. (And many times, run into one of you at an FBO!) I can't speak for everyone at the company, but everyone I know has absolutely no intention of selling you down the river. I certainly would never vote yes on a contract that did, and I'll make sure the negotiators know it when we get to that point.

As for "B-scale" recall rights for future employees? I would hope we learned what a dumb idea that was when crew bases were the carrot.

 

[OPECJet]

Then you have nothing to worry about..... The leadership serves the membership -- they answer to us.

They already proved they don't listen with the message board issue. Most of the active pilots voiced their disagreement with kicking us off, but it proceeded anyway.

 

[BentOver]

I like netjets, great job, best I've ever had. I'm happy here, no desire whatsoever to go back to the airlines

Then I come to FI, read these union threads and everything goes to s***t. Always the same guys talking about "moving on", "can't wait to get on with an airline" and how netjets is destroying your life, but you guys are still here.

How I wish those of you who want your airline job get your airline job. This negative stuff is getting tiresome

BTW, did you work for a Legacy, LCC, or Regional?

 

[Dgpr]

CA1900 & Jetlag- I'm the one who first posted about being "sold down the road", at least on this thread.
I appreciate your support and am glad to know that some of the pilot group has not forgotten about us. My friends that are still there say the same thing, so I know that there is part of the pilot group that indeed "has our back". I think all of us on furlough would say "thank you for showing true union brotherhood".

But I too was told by a Captain, shortly before the furlough was announced, that we who were hired in 07 & 08 were a "mistake" (with 20/20 hindsight, he was right, but it still hurt to hear it). Now with the position the company is in, and the HUGE recovery the economy would have to undergo to even start to make a dent in the 495, I honestly don't believe I'll ever fly a QS tail again. How many of the pilots still on property believe that too? I really couldn't know...

Again, thanks for keeping us in mind.

 

[gunfyter]

I think at first everyone could believe a recall would happen on the timeline they gave because in the past everytime there was a severe recession we had a v-shaped recovery.... where the economy bounced back to its original line of expansion.

We haven't had the bounce back ... yet...

 

[BentOver]

I think at first everyone could believe a recall would happen on the timeline they gave because in the past everytime there was a severe recession we had a v-shaped recovery.... where the economy bounced back to its original line of expansion.

We haven't had the bounce back ... yet...

That and they replaced the god of fractional aviation with an energy guy who was ceremoniuously fired from not only Netjets, but Berkshire, hell the 2nd or 3rd richest man in the world cast him off. Then NJA replaced that guy with a guy who looks like he should be at the front desk of a Hilton welcoming crews...

I have no doubt if RTS stayed, maybe there's a furlough from pressure form Warren, but on time the furloughees would have been called back. At the very least call backs would have started..

What screwed RTS was his trying to not furlough anyone... I would have easily accepted a furlough with RTS still at the helm... Because I know he wanted the company to grow...And would do everything to get us back (or at the very least get the company back to size, resulting in our return)

There will be no bounce back...I'd bet $100 that at the best case the company remains the same size and MAYBE a few recalls in 5 years based on the current attrition rate. Hopefully increased when the airlines start hiring (which still doesn't look promising yet, unless you consider US Air a good job?) But I very much doubt there will be any real growth other than a few more a/c here or there.

 

[gret]

That and they replaced the god of fractional aviation with an energy guy who was ceremoniuously fired from not only Netjets, but Berkshire, hell the 2nd or 3rd richest man in the world cast him off. Then NJA replaced that guy with a guy who looks like he should be at the front desk of a Hilton welcoming crews...

I have no doubt if RTS stayed, maybe there's a furlough from pressure form Warren, but on time the furloughees would have been called back. At the very least call backs would have started..

What screwed RTS was his trying to not furlough anyone... I would have easily accepted a furlough with RTS still at the helm... Because I know he wanted the company to grow...And would do everything to get us back (or at the very least get the company back to size, resulting in our return)

There will be no bounce back...I'd bet $100 that at the best case the company remains the same size and MAYBE a few recalls in 5 years based on the current attrition rate. Hopefully increased when the airlines start hiring (which still doesn't look promising yet, unless you consider US Air a good job?) But I very much doubt there will be any real growth other than a few more a/c here or there.

Agree...only difference is that RTS couldn't save himself, let alone the employees.

Strong leadership will prevail in the end...and I don't mean union leadership...but a person who has a passion for the business. The business outgrew RTS, but they failed greatly in replacing him. I'm not a fan of Warren...smart guy when it comes to investing, but a very poor manager and he knows that. He always buys companies with mgmt in place.

Business (and life) is hard and there are no shortcuts.

 

[jonjuan]

Agree...only difference is that RTS couldn't save himself, let alone the employees.

Strong leadership will prevail in the end...and I don't mean union leadership...but a person who has a passion for the business. The business outgrew RTS, but they failed greatly in replacing him. I'm not a fan of Warren...smart guy when it comes to investing, but a very poor manager and he knows that. He always buys companies with mgmt in place.

Business (and life) is hard and there are no shortcuts.

Wasn't it rts who was hiring and taking aircraft like crazy in ''07 and '08 like there would be no end to the boom despite many saying the growth was over?

 

[gret]

Wasn't it rts who was hiring and taking aircraft like crazy in ''07 and '08 like there would be no end to the boom despite many saying the growth was over?

Yes he was. Who in those days was saying the growth was over?

Warren had this to say in 2007 and 2008-

"A much improved situation is emerging at NetJets, which sells and manages fractionally-owned aircraft. This company has never had a problem growing: Revenues from flight operations have increased 596% since our purchase in 1998. But profits had been erratic."

"Credit Rich Santulli, along with Mark, for this turnaround. Rich, like many of our managers, has no financial need to work. But you’d never know it. He’s absolutely tireless – monitoring operations, making sales, and traveling the globe to constantly widen the already-enormous lead that NetJets enjoys over its competitors. Today, the value of the fleet we manage is far greater than that managed by our three largest competitors combined."

"The NetJets brand – with its promise of safety, service and security – grows stronger every year. Behind this is the passion of one man, Richard Santulli. If you were to pick someone to join you in a foxhole, you couldn’t do better than Rich. No matter what the obstacles, he just doesn’t stop."​