NJ Recalls

[Rubber Ducky]

so why is general council evaluating whether or not it is okay to share the transcripts? Making sure there isn't anything incriminating first?

 

[gunfyter]

so why is general council evaluating whether or not it is okay to share the transcripts? Making sure there isn't anything incriminating first?

I don't know ... I said "my recollection" and "if that is correct".

I'll be surprised if it isn't correct mostly because I don't know why the negotiators would tell us this was the intent if it was not....

 

[dudemize]

A normal English speaking person reads the bold print above as once zero is exceeded, a maximum of 11 days may be subcontracted while recalls are occurring. It says maximum, not minimum. Am I communicating? Maximum / Minimum. Am I communicating? Good.

As Gunfyter said, the lawyer that wrote the section, as well as the Union and the company are in unanimous agreement over the intent of this section. I think we all agree the language is ambiguous at best, but the reality is that there is no point in having this discussion.

Realistically if having a single sell-off flight is the trigger for recalls, then why not just say that no furloughs are allowed, period?

 

[Cavpilot]

A normal English speaking person reads the bold print above as once zero is exceeded, a maximum of 11 days may be subcontracted while recalls are occurring.

I really wish that was what this section says, but it doesn't.

I used to do IOE in the Excel before they RIFTed a bunch of us. Pretty much every First Officer I did IOE with is now furloughed. That is truly a shame since most of those guys and gals were damn fine pilots and super good people. I had more fun teaching IOE than I ever did as a regular line guy. Trust me, you have been missed.

The good news for the furloughed folks is that the current situation is unsustainable. People will be recalled for operational need before the provisions of Section 1.5(c)(4) ever kick in. The bad news is that those of us still flying the line will be getting out heads kicked in until you guys come back.

 

[gunfyter]

I will be shocked if the make it through the next quarter without going over 11 days.... same with first quarter 2014.

 

[CaveoFalco]

so why is general council evaluating whether or not it is okay to share the transcripts? Making sure there isn't anything incriminating first?

The transcripts for all sections are available both on the NJASAP App and the website.

There is no disagreement between NJASAP negotiators and NJA negotiators on this entire section (there is more to it than just the first paragraph). This section was approved by one of the top labor law firms in the country, Baptiste and Wilder, specifically Roland Wilder. It was the Company's idea/language by the way so the Company "woe is me" on this section falls on deaf ears.

Section one was not touched during 2007 negotiations so that the Company could not claim that a grammatical or punctuation change would also change the intent.

11 days is an exception to the zero percent rule by mutual agreement. If the Company violates 11 days then everything above zero percent is used in calculations. The RTS model was built with subcontracting in the equation.

 

[Rubber Ducky]

The transcripts for all sections are available both on the NJASAP App and the website.

The 2007 transcript doesn't even discuss 1.5(c)(4) because it wasn't touched. I would agree without a doubt that if the 2005 transcripts, when they are released, state that recalls begin only after 11 days of sell offs then this case is closed (they are not on the website and furloughed pilots aren't allowed the app for that).

A recollection of two paragraphs in an enormous agreement 8 years ago that nobody ever thought was necessary will not be taken over what those persons said in a court recorded transcript 8 years ago. So lets see it. I think we are all prepared to eat crow if you aren't bluffing. Show your cards.

 

[BentOver]

Problem is there are only a few days where sell offs typically occur.( thanksgiving, x mas, pres. Weekend etc) anything above those days is mostly abnormalities in either scheduling or availability.

I'd bet that if there were a 12th day where a couple sell offs were needed the company would rather delay a owner flight rather than take the hit of paying 50 or so recalls 2 months of pay etc....

Again take the 6.xx pilots per a/c, your seniority #, and figure how many a/c are needed to reach your number. Fudge factor some lead time for training etc, and that will be when a recall will occur. I just don't see the fleet growing much with all the disposals still due. It's all about the # of a/c IMO.

 

[-FlyAuburn-]

You know what's ridiculous? That we have to talk about this here instead of the NJASAP board to have any contact with the active pilot group; outside of a couple of good folks that still talk to us on the "furloughed" red headed step child board. Normally I would say that having this conversation in a public forum would be a bad idea. Unfortunately due to the infinite wisdom of the NJASAP higher ups we were deemed either unworthy or a threat or both, and therefore left no choice in the matter.

 

[fly4funcrj]

NJA will never exceed the 11 days. They control the information and can manipulate it at will. Unless/until the union does a forensic audit of Ijet, all we really have at the end of the day is the company's word.