NJ question

[CaravanMan]

Hey guys, I have a quick question for you NetJets fellows. I've been reading through the enormous amount of NJ threads and haven't found an answer...I've probably just skipped over it. Anyway, just wondering if y'all have any idea of the time frame for your new contract w/pay and that 100 base deal. Any clue as to when it would happen? It would work out well since I live in one of the proposed bases. Thanks!

 

[MississippiMud]

Vote counted on or around Nov 20th. Pay starts then, crew bases open around the first of 08 if it passes.

 

[CaravanMan]

Thanks, Mud.

 

[Buddro]

Vote counted on or around Nov 20th. Pay starts then, crew bases open around the first of 08 if it passes.

Pay change takes place Nov. 21, 2007
Base changes take place Dec. 1, 2007.

 

[CaravanMan]

Are you guys expecting this to pass?

 

[NJApilot]

Are you guys expecting this to pass?

I think the general expectation is that the TA will pass, but more than likely not by an overwhelming margin. In the ballpark of 65-70% is my guess. A lot will likely depend on the overall turnout.

If you have already applied for a position, expect about a 6 month wait between application acceptance and the call for an interview. If you haven't yet applied, I would suggest starting the process asap, as there is a lot of interest right now in the position.

Good luck.

 

[x402]

Are you guys expecting this to pass?

We'll know more 11-1 when the transition language is finished.

 

[CaravanMan]

Thank you all for your responses. Guess I'd better jump on the band wagon! It's tough finding a "next step" in the career moves game, but after reading a lot on the Frax boards, it seems that, for the most part, people seem to like it at NJ.

I'm flying single-pilot in a C-90 (EMS) right now; all round dial and single-pilot experience. Is that generally frowned upon or do they tend to take people from all walks of life?

Until now, most job paths were dead-end because I'm adjusted to this salary, which is pretty nice. I don't want to sound like a shmuck for listing $$ as a motivator, but I've just gotta do what's right for the family first.

As for getting the app... just fire off a resume and cover letter to the e-mail on the website? Anything else need to be sent?

Edit: Forgot, I STILL don't have a passport, d'oh! I'll get on that quickly, but would it be wise to hold off on applying to NJ until I get my PP? :0

 

[Guitar Guy]

I'm flying single-pilot in a C-90 (EMS) right now; all round dial and single-pilot experience. Is that generally frowned upon or do they tend to take people from all walks of life?

The people here come from all walks of life in the flying game. I don't know too many people who flew EMS like you are, but there have been some. And there are a number of us who came to NetJets with zero jet time.

As for getting the app... just fire off a resume and cover letter to the e-mail on the website? Anything else need to be sent?

Edit: Forgot, I STILL don't have a passport, d'oh! I'll get on that quickly, but would it be wise to hold off on applying to NJ until I get my PP? :0

Fire off the resume and cover letter ASAP - that's all you need. However, if you have someone who could provide an internal recommendation, let that person submit your resume along with his/her letter of rec.

With the amount of time it will take to get the process will take, submit your resume right now and then immediately start the paperwork for a passport.

 

[CaravanMan]

Thanks GuitarGuy!

As I'm playing "catch up," reading current/past threads, I've got another question that I haven't found the answer to:

If all these 100 bases open up, how's that going to work? I'm in ICT, so, for example, would it mean that now, at the start of my 7 days, instead of me buying my own ticket to a base that the company will buy me the ticket? Or, are they planning on actually basing a/c at each of these bases? I'm kinda thinking that scenario 1 makes more sense.

Also, from the way it sounds in other posts, the 7 days you're on duty means something like: Day 1 travel to a/c, Days 2-6 on road, Day 7 return home. Or will they fly you out on what we'll call Day 0, then have you on the road Days 1-7, then fly you home on Day 8 so that you're actually working an entire 7 days? Again, from the gist of what I'm reading, it sounds like the first instance is the norm.

BTW, just wanted to say that I appreciate the NJ guys in all these posts in the Frax forum, because I really never see any "Noob Bashing" or fighting like you do on other forums, such as the airline forums, etc. That's another reason for making me want to go this direction; you all seem a lot more professional.

(Why do I feel like I'm now going to get crap, lol?)

 

[btodd77]

Generally the travel on day 1 and day 7 is the norm, but you can fly on those days as well. The pattern seems to be switching more towards the travel on day one to get to a/c and ferry to set up for the next day. Fly days 2-6. Maybe do a pax leg or a ferry on day 7 and then airline home. Can lead to some very long days, but we always have the fatigue card if they try and work us to hard.
brian

 

[futurepizzaguy]

What is expected 1st, 2nd, 3rd year FO pay? Thanks

 

[CA1900]

If all these 100 bases open up, how's that going to work? I'm in ICT, so, for example, would it mean that now, at the start of my 7 days, instead of me buying my own ticket to a base that the company will buy me the ticket?

The irony is, in most cases, after you buy yourself a ticket to your domicile (in the current contract), the company was buying an airline ticket anyway to get you where the airplane actually is. (In my case, it's just a 3-hour drive, not an airline ticket, but it's still a waste of time.)

In a year of flying here, based in PBI, I have never picked an airplane up in PBI. The 5 domiciles were never going to work, because in our operation, the planes end up where the customer ends up at the end of a crew's work week. The company then airlines the next crew in to pick up the plane.

BTW, just wanted to say that I appreciate the NJ guys in all these posts in the Frax forum, because I really never see any "Noob Bashing" or fighting like you do on other forums...

Naw, they save the noob bashing for the internal union message board...

 

[atpcliff]

Hi!

I have been reading all the threads on the subject-from what I've read/heard from guys at NJ:

Will the IBB Pass?
The range on passing runs from 57%? to about the mid-80%. I have actually not seen one poster who thinks it will fail, even among those who say they're voting against it.

A/C Basing:
Most of the 100 bases, if the IBB passes, will NOT have planes located there.

SCHEDULE/PAY:
FO pay below is for < 40,000 MGTOW aircraft. It is theoretically possible you could get assigned to the heavier class of A/C. You will get more.

Start with 2 weeks of vacation: Year 0? Year 1?

If approved, there will be 3 schedules. You can bid for a different schedule 3 times a year (every 4 months).

7/7:
7 work days/7 days off. If NJ wants you, you can extend a limited number of times for more money. This schedule COULD be used by up to 90% of a specific fleet. Using 1 week (7 days) of vacation gives you 21 days off in a row (just like at Mesa!).

Yr 1 FO 7/7 schedule: $57K
Yr 2: $59
Yr 3: $64
Yr 4: $66
Yr 5: $68
If the conditions are met, the contract extends 3 years:
Yr 6: $75
Yr 7: $80
Yr 8: $84

15 day reserve schedule:
Work MAX of 15 days-probably 10-11. Max trip is 5 days. MIN day off block, after a trip, is 3 days. 10% of a fleet's pilots WILL be on this schedule. You may be junior-manned into it, or it may NOT be available if you want it.

On this schedule, you are given a min of 10 hours notice, so you can get your 10 hours of required crew rest. You will be notified the night before of an airline ticket waiting for you at the 100 base airport. If you are not picked to work the night before, you are OFF the next day. 1 week of vacation gives you 15 days off in a row.

Yr 1 FO 15 day reserve schedule: $63K
Yr 2: $65
Yr 3: $70
Yr 4: $73
Yr 5: $75
If the conditions are met, the contract extends 3 years:
Yr 6: $80
Yr 7: $83
Yr 8: $85

18 day reserve schedule.
UP TO 40% of a crew force could be on this schedule. It is voluntary...except, some pilots could be assigned to this schedule-instructors and the like-I don't think new hires.

You will bid for specific days off, more/less flying, longer/shorter trips, larger blocks of days off, etc. By the 15th of the month before, you will know your trip. You should work 18 days on this schedule.

Max trip 8 days (once per month). Otherwise 7 days on max. 3, 4, or 5 days off, depending on how long your work trip was. 1 week of vacation = 15 days off in a row.

Yr 1 FO 18 day work schedule: $69K
Yr 2: $72
Yr 3: $78
Yr 4: $80
Yr 5: $83
If the conditions are met, the contract extends 3 years:
Yr 6: $88
Yr 7: $92
Yr 8: $94

If any of the above is wrong, please correct.

I tried.

cliff
LRD

 

[x402]

Will the IBB Pass?
The range on passing runs from 57%? to about the mid-80%. I have actually not seen one poster who thinks it will fail, even among those who say they're voting against it.

The company has some final details to wrap up, by midnight tomorrow. Sick day buy back could be a huge problem if the company negotiators think they are going to get out of their responsibility for anything less than 100% on the dollar.
The new language would pay out at 110% for 5+ days sold back to NJA, going forward ( if IBB passes)Anything less for what's already on the books will start a firestorm.

We'll see how much a win/win this really is.

 

[Ultra Grump]

A/C Basing:
Most of the 100 bases, if the IBB passes, will NOT have planes located there.

Planes are not "based" anywhere. There may happen to be one at your base when you start a tour, there may not. Depends on the needs of the owners.

SCHEDULE/PAY:
FO pay below is for < 40,000 MGTOW aircraft. It is theoretically possible you could get assigned to the heavier class of A/C. You will get more.

You will NOT be assigned to the heavier aircraft. Current FOs will bid those slots, since seat locks (39 months) will not restrict upgrade if available.

Start with 2 weeks of vacation: Year 0? Year 1?

Vacation begins accruing on date of hire. A new-hire will most likely have fewer than 2 weeks to bid the first time around, pro-rated to date of hire.

15 day reserve schedule:
You will be notified the night before of an airline ticket waiting for you at the 100 base airport.

Not necessarily. You might pick up an aircraft at your base, or you might take a cab, sedan, or rental car to another airport. You might have standby at home, though the company would be stupid to do that on the 15-day.

18 day reserve schedule.
It is voluntary...except, some pilots could be assigned to this schedule-instructors and the like-I don't think new hires.

New-hires will start on the 18-day.

Max trip 8 days (once per month).

Not once per month, once per bid period (4 months).

 

[Guitar Guy]

Hi!...

SCHEDULE/PAY:
FO pay below is for < 40,000 MGTOW aircraft. It is theoretically possible you could get assigned to the heavier class of A/C. You will get more.

Don't count it as even a "theoretical possibility". Existing SIC's will want the increased pay and the "Falcon lifestyle" as they await for an upgrade that is now running 5.5 years and forecast to go up.

Hi!...

SCHEDULE/PAY:

7/7:
7 work days/7 days off. If NJ wants you, you can extend a limited number of times for more money. This schedule COULD be used by up to 90% of a specific fleet. Using 1 week (7 days) of vacation gives you 21 days off in a row (just like at Mesa!).

Yr 1 FO 7/7 schedule: $57K
Yr 2: $59
Yr 3: $64
Yr 4: $66
Yr 5: $68
If the conditions are met, the contract extends 3 years:
Yr 6: $75
Yr 7: $80
Yr 8: $84

15 day reserve schedule:

Yr 1 FO 15 day reserve schedule: $63K
Yr 2: $65
Yr 3: $70
Yr 4: $73
Yr 5: $75
If the conditions are met, the contract extends 3 years:
Yr 6: $80
Yr 7: $83
Yr 8: $85

18 day reserve schedule.

Yr 1 FO 18 day work schedule: $69K
Yr 5: $83
If the conditions are met, the contract extends 3 years:
Yr 6: $88
Yr 7: $92
Yr 8: $94

If any of the above is wrong, please correct.

You are not correct on how the contract extension works. If the company meets the requirements in order to extend the contract and wishes to exercise its option, then all of the "basic" wage scales contained in Section 27.1 must be increased based off of the CPI-U on May 22 of 2013, 2014 and 2015 as a requirement for extension. It's not just service years 6-8 as your post seemed to indicate, but it's all service years on all of the schedules.

You were incorrect on several other items, too, but someone else has already corrected most of those.

 

[NJApilot]

If all these 100 bases open up, how's that going to work? I'm in ICT, so, for example, would it mean that now, at the start of my 7 days, instead of me buying my own ticket to a base that the company will buy me the ticket? Or, are they planning on actually basing a/c at each of these bases? I'm kinda thinking that scenario 1 makes more sense.

Hopefully some of the subsequent posts in this thread cleared this area up for you. In a nutshell, on the days that you are scheduled to work the company will determine all your travel to/from your base airport (whether that be by rental car, taxi, sedan, airline, or NetJets aircraft (you riding in the back or you as a flying crewmember).

You mentioned that you reside in ICT. This is obviously a big maintenance center for our cessna fleets. So if you were assigned to one of these fleets, it would be more common for you to actually pick up a plane out of mx, there in ICT, than it would be for the others who reside in a location without a large mx facility. Make sense?

I live in GSO -- where a Cessna service center is located. At least 3 out of 10 trips I pick up a plane there to start my tour (and it's not half as big as the facility in ICT). At the end of my tour, I would say that I end up airlining about 95% of the time.

In a nutshell, just keep in mind that your "base" location has a lot to do with the way in which you will start your tour.

 

[CaravanMan]

Yeah, that all clears it up quite a bit, thank you all! After learning that new-hires tend to get put on the 18 day reserve schedule, does that tend to mean you might get called up for a 2-3 day flight, then sent back home to sit, then called for a day, then back home, etc? Or do you sit reserve and, once called, then you're gone for your 7 from that point?

BTW, if any of you guys float through ICT sometime on a MX trip, PM me...I'll buy you a coffee or a refreshing adult beverage of your choosing!

 

[imacdog]

On the current reserve schedule, plan on being used for a full seven days if you get called out and your hard days off don't require a shorter trip. Once you get called out for any length trip you get three days off afterward, unless it's a seven day trip in which case you'll get four days off after getting home. That's under the current system. The proposed 18-day fixed schedule would be set on the 15th of the month prior.