New trend for AirTran negotiations?

[scar1900]

^^^^^^^^^^^

Maybe he was talking about on arrival....

 

[gearup5]

I just started this summer and we have already lost two guys from a class of 20 to Continental.
FO pay scales need to be revised up a lot more than what the company and our union is proposing.
Since when did we support the age 60 increase?(el presidente of union stated, most recent list of goals)WTF

 

[Citrusflyer]

I hope for all our sakes that pilots are not still doing this. Why on Earth would you want to pi$$ off 117-137 passengers by having them sit on a hot airplane just to save a few gallons of APU fuel? We are in the customer service field guys. That means keeping the customer HAPPY from the moment they make their reservation to the moment they pick up their baggage off the conveyor. Turn the APU on BEFORE the first passenger steps foot on the aircraft. At destination -during taxi in-, turn the APU on so conditioned air is ready to be introduced into the cabin the moment engines are shut down. Leave the APU on until the last passenger deplanes -or- external air conditioning is hooked up.

Please Please Please do not subject our passengers to hot, and/or low air movement cabin conditions. We need for them to be repeat customers...not go to the competition.

We have gate air at all ATL and almost all outsatation jetways. 95% of the time there is no real need for the APU to be on, and if there is one then mine is on.

 

[gt1900]

Whoknows.. You know nothing about me, so I suggest you keep your opinions to yourself. I have a question for you though. How many sections got ta'd when MB was our negotiator?? Exactly 0.. And if you know MB, you should know why. But then again I guess your totally OK with the fact that he has being paid since sept and just went through requall training several weeks ago. Doesn't that piss you off a little??? BTW.. They just ta'd two more sections today.. Yes, a lot of fluff stuf, but at least its going somewhere.. 10 sections ta'd since Sept, and none while MB was the negotiator the previous two years... Like I said, its a start.... And I'm not a fugging coolaid drinker..

 

[Ty Webb]

. I have a question for you though. How many sections got ta'd when MB was our negotiator?? Exactly 0.. And if you know MB, you should know why.

I know MB. He was not the obstacle. The Company uses the most basic tactics there are . . . and that is to personalize the negotiations and to demonize the negotiators themselves, and you fell for it.

.... And I'm not a fugging coolaid drinker..

No, the actual term for the behavior you are exhibiting is that of a "Useful Idiot". . . . and that's a technical term.

The problem isn't MB, or SH, or AP, or even SK. The problem is this 1980's management tactics . . . they didn't work at Eastern, and they aren't working here. Time for Joe to go.


.

 

[IAHERJ]

I walked in a 9 year AirTran captain's resume to our chief pilot here at Continental a few weeks ago. He wants to remain ananamous for several reasons. His reasons were many but overall he wants to have more variety in his flying. He is saving up for the huge paycut as we speak.

IAHERJ

 

[mnboyev]

Group hug man !!!

Just a couple of things..Nobody from my class has left...although a couple of em are looking..mainly the 30ish crowd.. All are left seat...

The Union is US guys...period.!!! Call AP if you want to give em a piece of your mind..... And MB was just a negotiator as is dough and SH..They don't decide what is accepted or TA'd...The BOD decides.

age 60...well.. I think CAPA supports it so we kinda fall under that umbrella in Washington last I checked... I agree that ol Wilson polling might have been in order..but at what cost to us... We'll get a contract before the MEH thing hits hard...I bet by spring or early summer... be safe!

 

[~~~^~~~]

How long is upgrade looking for new hires and just what are the union's FO rates for the first few years?

With the other Majors beginning to crank up, it would seem AirTran would have to be competitive.

 

[400ADude]

I walked in a 9 year AirTran captain's resume to our chief pilot here at Continental a few weeks ago. He wants to remain ananamous for several reasons. His reasons were many but overall he wants to have more variety in his flying. He is saving up for the huge paycut as we speak.

IAHERJ

You've got to be kidding us?? He's been there 9 years and his going to leave and start over at a company that pays 30/hr?? Throw in the 65 issue and that will thwart his upgrade over at CAL. He must be really burned out of the scabs at Valuejet.

 

[michael707767]

Training costs money, Chief . . . about $22K per pilot . . . so a first year FO is as expensive as a third year pilot. . . . and less productive, since the first three and a half months he's not even flying the line..

whoa, I just asked a question.

I understand training costs money. But I have no doubt that managment has figured the costs of training new guys vs the costs of raising your wages. Where the breakeven point between the two is unknown, but you can be sure management has looked at that.

Training costs don't seem to be affecting the pay at the regionals...despite their high turnover.

 

[Kharma Police]

You've got to be kidding us?? He's been there 9 years and his going to leave and start over at a company that pays 30/hr?? Throw in the 65 issue and that will thwart his upgrade over at CAL. He must be really burned out of the scabs at Valuejet.

It was ValuJet, and FYI there are more scabs at CAL then at da 'Tranny......

 

[Lear70]

Maybe he was talking about on arrival....

No, he wasn't. You'd have to work here to understand... topic for a different thread if you really want to know.

I think, historically, you were deprived of air in the birth canal.

ROFLMFAO!!!

I just got in from the 4-day from hell, made me snort Scotch out my nose, that hurt. Still funny, though.

IMHO a major reason guys are leaving is because the incompetence of certain management personnel has become rather apparent. IF you could work for the next 20 years for profitable, yet pilot-friendly management, then why work instead for a company that seems to think that the only way to make money is by squeezing the pilot group . . . .

Quite possibly this is true for the top 1/3 of the seniority group.

A lot of the guys I've talked to who are taking recall or leaving for SWA/FedEx, etc are simply saying they have no faith that AirTran will EVER be the equivalent of any of those jobs, and giving up 3-5 years of seniority here will still net them HUNDREDS OF THOUSANDS or MORE in $$$ with an equivalent or better QOL.

It's just that simple.

People are voting with their feet, and I'll bet that if the company rolled over completely and accepted the Union's proposed pay rates right now, they probably couldn't get it to pass a vote by the pilot group.

I'll take that bet. I bet you a C-note that the first T.A. that comes around with a small increase in B-fund, a substantial cut in health care costs, and 10-15% raises (just BARELY better than COLA) will pass.

I wouldn't vote for it, I know most of you on this board wouldn't vote for it, and I'm irritated as hell to have to say that, but I don't think the pilots of this company have the solidarity to hold out for any real increases, ESPECIALLY when our OWN UNION isn't holding out, even though we're in quite possibly the BEST position the pilots of AirTran will EVER be in to do so...

IMO from watching how things work here the last year, the vocal minority on this board is just that, a vocal MINORITY of the pilot group. Just too many people at the top of the food chain with too much to lose and not enough developed alternatives at other carriers to risk it all.

 

[400ADude]

It was ValuJet, and FYI there are more scabs at CAL then at da 'Tranny......

Maybe he wants to be around the professional scabs?

 

[Eagle757shark]

I hope for all our sakes that pilots are not still doing this. Why on Earth would you want to pi$$ off 117-137 passengers by having them sit on a hot airplane just to save a few gallons of APU fuel? We are in the customer service field guys. That means keeping the customer HAPPY from the moment they make their reservation to the moment they pick up their baggage off the conveyor. Turn the APU on BEFORE the first passenger steps foot on the aircraft. At destination -during taxi in-, turn the APU on so conditioned air is ready to be introduced into the cabin the moment engines are shut down. Leave the APU on until the last passenger deplanes -or- external air conditioning is hooked up.

Please Please Please do not subject our passengers to hot, and/or low air movement cabin conditions. We need for them to be repeat customers...not go to the competition.

I'm speaking to what this pilot group has done the last couple of years to save AirTran millions of dollars. I for one don't appreciate the way this management team has disrespected this pilot group with their childish games. There is no accountability in the middle management ranks and it has lead to poor morale. I wasn't impressed by the VP's letter at all. It was a slap in the face and shows they again aren't willing to face up to the reality of what really is wrong with our operation internally. They hear and do what they want and blame the pilot group when something goes wrong. This pilot group has been very professional and has saved AirTran Millions! I know for a fact a couple of guys who took other offers after that Christmas fiasco and the disrespect shown by management. I'm totally not surprised with the high attrition currently going on.

 

[RIDETHELIGHTING]

Maybe he wants to be around the professional scabs?

You are a DumbA$$. That comment just shows what an A$$ you really are.